A traditional fan also pulls air from around its blades using the same principal. A bladeless is just a gimmick it has no actual benefits.
NarrativeBear@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Its true there is a fan in the base of all bladeless fans, but the fan is smaller then traditional fan designs and moves the same if not more air then traditional fans.
Air is pulled in through the base and forced through a thin slit. This fast stream of air creates an area of low pressure, drawing in and amplifying surrounding air.
Because air “sticks” to itself, when you get some air moving (by breathing out, for example), the initial bit of air that you move “drags” some air with it from beside and behind. This is what Dyson calls “air multiplier technology”.
Dyson uses this property of air to claim that they only have to move a fraction of air (with the fan in the base) of all the air that blows past you.
Here is a example of how this works, and how you can use one breath to fill a large bag.
hOrni@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Axolotl_cpp@feddit.it 2 weeks ago
it has no actual benefits.
- no toddler will put their hands in to it
- can look better for some people
Valmond@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Toddler hands don’t go through the protection of a classic fan, if it’s built like after 1965.
Also we were not discussing esthetics but efficiency.
turtlesareneat@piefed.ca 2 weeks ago
Thank you.
Much like Sharper Image’s Ionic Breeze, this is a very expensive bullshit tower, but I am seeing them everywhere lately. Box fans are fucking amazing. Get a box fan.
hOrni@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I did one better, I got myself a ceiling fan.
Seppo@sopuli.xyz 2 weeks ago
Of course they have benefits. Depending on the situation of course. I wouldn’t put one in my computer, but I sure as shit have one in my home with a kid running around. Turns out a fan with all the heavy spinning hardware stuff in it’s base is less likely to fall over than one with all that stuff up on top. Honestly all my Dyson stuff work fucking great for their intended purpose.
Paying the absolute minimal amount for something isn’t necessary the goal of life. You’re not a corporation.
hOrni@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
None of what You said is about efficiency, which is the subject here. Not paying corporations for bullshit is one of my goals in life.
vogi@piefed.social 2 weeks ago
Ironically love Lemmy for the explainers you get on a shitpost. Only stumbled on this cause I was looking it up myself. Thanks for the write up :)
hOrni@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Keep in mind, that the explanation is wrong.
Valmond@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Yep, dyson bullshit marketing.
HerbGrower@slrpnk.net 2 weeks ago
Just like their hoovers then.
Used to have to use one and I just don’t understand the bagless appeal. I like having a bag to contain all this awful dust. Felt like I needed to wash every time I emptied it and they fill up so fast in comparison too.
danc4498@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
It’s the same reason I use a beef bouillon cube in place of real meat when I feed my vegan friends. It’s much smaller so it doesn’t count.
fulcrummed@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
My god, the sass - it’s magnificent.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 2 weeks ago
It’s also just Dyson’s completely overpriced bullshit. It makes weak air flow and has no real benefit for use as a fan.
Project Farm has tested them a couple different times. They’re expensive aesthetic toys.
AliOski@feddit.nl 2 weeks ago
Works pretty well on my end
fuck_u_spez_in_particular@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Any similar priced fan likely works better. Especially the fans seem to be garbage IME…
The dyson we use in the office is worse than the other fairly standard fan for a fraction of the price (airflow and loudness…)
Ep1cFac3pa1m@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Sir, this is a
Wendy’sshitpost community.Valmond@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Smaller fans = more noise
And why isn’t a regular fan getting the “surrounding air” to move too? Is there a subscription for that?
It’s most probably dyson bullshit (the moved extra air is slowing the original air down, or it’s magic) marketing.
Magnets!
Jumi@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I got one years ago when they still were a lot cheaper and I must say it’s the best one I ever had. It’s powerful and so quiet that I can leave it running next to my bed when it’s hot.
fuck_u_spez_in_particular@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I have the opposite experience, have ypu tested competition at the same price level? IMO they’re overpriced fragile plastic products with a very good marketing…
Jumi@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Why would I test others when I already have one I’m completely satisfied with for quite some years now?
fuck_u_spez_in_particular@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Yeah don’t understand the hype for dyson, for (almost?) every category they have a product for there’s a higher quality product for a lot less money.
They really seem to have perfected their marketing…
The products are not even high quality, thin fragile plastic everywhere…
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 2 weeks ago
The air thing is real physics. It does “work”. It just isn’t very useful in this application.
Valmond@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Sure it works, but it works for a basic fan as well, there is nothing special with the dyson variant.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 2 weeks ago
A much higher percentage of extra air will get pulled “down range” from a Dyson style fan. It’s just that the air speed and total volume of those dysons are too low and they’d be noisy as hell to overcome it. But as a ratio of forced air to air that moves along, it’s a much better amount than a traditional fan.
echodot@feddit.uk 2 weeks ago
And yet despite the fact that they’re using less electricity and a smaller fan somehow the product costs five times as much as a normal fan. How does that work?
Thebeardedsinglemalt@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Partly because of the overall quality of the fan. Like you can go to Walmart and get a comparable bladeless fan for 49.99 but it’s gonna be louder, won’t be as efficient and won’t last as long.
ChaoticNeutralCzech@feddit.org 2 weeks ago
Fans are usually loud in proportion to their speed. Quiet ceiling fans have a big diameter and many blades. Doesn’t a small fan cause a lot of noise?
HikingVet@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Honestly depends on speed, quality of bearings and motor, blade geometry and thickness as well as any possible enclosures.
The biggest source of noise with fans is air cavitation.
percent@infosec.pub 2 weeks ago
It’s also possible to reduce perceived noise with some blade spacing tricks. I remember reading about how Apple designed the MacBook fan blades to seem really quiet under normal load. It was pretty interesting to read. I’m too lazy to find a link, but it should be easy to find with a quick search, if interested.
teslekova@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Yep, which is why those Dyson fans emit an annoying high-pitched shriek.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 2 weeks ago
Yes. It’s not necessarily the size that makes the noise, but rather the rpm required of the smaller fans to move an equivalent amount of air. I have a fan in my phone, for instance. It is so small that it spins at 23,000 rpm to make just a small amount of air movement I can barely feel, but easily hear. My ceiling fan can’t be heard at all but still moves WAY more air while spinning at a couple hundred rpm. The air turbulence from blade speed is most of what you hear from a fan.
LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I just imagined someone turning on a fan and hearing an electric f1 car drive by
fuck_u_spez_in_particular@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Speaking of the dyson. IMO one of the worst fans out there: extremely weak (see measurements on YouTube), extremely loud and very fragile… Have one in the office, and I hate it…
A classic fan, fraction of the price performs better in all relevant categories…
Btw. They also create a “bigger” airflow around them so in that regard not better…
FatVegan@leminal.space 2 weeks ago
Don’t forget the fact that they cost like 400 plus dollars for reasons
rethnor@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
I’ve never really understood this multiplayer thing, sounds like a free energy gimmick. You can move more mass at the same speed without putting in more power.
echodot@feddit.uk 2 weeks ago
Basically they’re trying to claim that the Bernoulli principle is some amazing concept that only they’ve come up with.
Their fans do work in the sense they do move more air but it creates so much back pressure that most of that air movement is lost. So you might as well not bother.
GTG3000@programming.dev 2 weeks ago
You’re basically trading energy to move higher volume of air. The fan can move smaller amount of air at higher speed, but larger amount at a gentle breeze feels nicer and helps with circulating the air in the room better.
You could achieve it by taking that exact motor and slapping a bigger fan onto it, but that looks less cool and probably produces more noise? Maybe there’s some efficiency differences if the motor is better at spinning fast, but as a spherical cow in vacuum it should be similar.
Alcoholicorn@mander.xyz 2 weeks ago
It’s cheaper to make electric motor spin fast with low torque than slow with high torque, a ceiling fan of the same cfm needs a bigger motor than a standing fan.
Threeme2189@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I would counter that a small fan spinning at high rpm makes more (annoying) noise than a large fan spinning at a lower rpm.
666dollarfootlong@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
But due to it being hidden maybe it can be isolated easier?
rethnor@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
So it’s like a lever, you aren’t just magically getting more volume at the same speed without more power, it just slows down when interacting with the outside air, ie conservation of momentum
reksas@sopuli.xyz 2 weeks ago
maybe it works kind of like how water works. Water also sticks to itself, like how separate droplets combine very fast when close enough.
echodot@feddit.uk 2 weeks ago
Well in fluid dynamics you don’t really make the distinction between liquid and gas. You can model air as basically just a very low viscosity fluid and it works. No one really knows why it works because it shouldn’t, air doesn’t stick to itself, but if you pretend that it does the simulations still work, even though they’re wrong.
If you look in most physics textbooks even at quite a high level they will tell you that aircraft fly because air sticks to itself, but again, it doesn’t. No one is quite sure why aircraft work, no one’s all that certain where the lift comes from. But physics textbooks hate to admit that so they just pretend that air sticks to itself.
rethnor@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
The whole air moves faster over the top than the bottom, why would it do that? It’s not like the on the top of the wing and the bottom of the wing are connected by magic.
expatriado@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
i don’t think the point of the post is about being useless or inefficient, but about the misleading name
MonkderVierte@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
But all in all:
- 3x as expensive, at least
- not less noisy (except the old-style cage fans maybe)
- hygiene issues
- more likely to break
rob_t_firefly@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Nothing sticks to my breath, especially in the mornings.
ToxicWaste@lemmy.cafe 2 weeks ago
still a miss-labeling to call them bladeless fans, just because the blades are hidden. by that logic my beef raviolis are vegetarian (tbf: the catholic church made a similar claim during the medieval ages).
Bernoulli Fan is not only more accurate, it also sounds much cooler.
agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
To play devil’s advocate, there are no exposed blades at the point of use. I’d wager people who buy “bladeless” fans are more concerned with aesthetics and avoiding a crying toddler than they are with semantic accuracy. We call Wi-Fi “wireless” even though the router is plugged in.
SatansMaggotyCumFart@piefed.world 2 weeks ago
I can stick my peepee into a bladeless fan and not worry about cuts so there’s that.
TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Image
mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
well, no, see, you can’t.
you can stick it through it. but you can’t stick it in it.
ToxicWaste@lemmy.cafe 2 weeks ago
at work we have expensive fans with a cheap metal mesh around them - to avoid a crying co-worker. at home i have a cheap tower fan with a weird plastic mesh - there are no visible blades on it except if i crank my neck into a really uncomfortable position and shine a flashlight into it. which one of the two can i call bladeless?
luckily i already have a devils advocate and @arctanthrope@lemmy.world dropped the name of god. how well do i need to hide my fans blade to create a Ventilationbescheißerle?
HerbGrower@slrpnk.net 2 weeks ago
Regular fans dont have exposed blades either, there is a mesh over it.
agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I take it you’ve never seen a toddler stick their fingers through the mesh
arctanthrope@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
there’s a type of German meat dumplings called Herrgottsbescheißerle, which literally means “little things that bullshit the Lord” for the same reason
craftrabbit@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Oh my god that makes so much sense suddenly
MacNCheezus@lemmy.today 2 weeks ago
That’s just a nickname, they are called Maultaschen 99.9% of the time.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maultasche
They are basically very large ravioli, but with a more German flavor (for lack of a better word). As far as I know, the origin story is more legend than fact, but it’s a funny anecdote nevertheless.
Very tasty, I recommend giving them a try if you ever have the chance.
CIA_chatbot@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Well, Beef comes from cows, and cows only eat vegetation, so beef raviolis are vegetarian. Now, I’m not a Rocket Biologist, but I think the math here is pretty conclusive.
Sonotsugipaa@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Is this what a rocket biologist specializes in?
Image
DarkCloud@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The cynic in me thinks “bladeless” makes them easier to sell in fan-death countries.
Skullgrid@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Carpinchos (capybara) are fish.
ornithopiccoloelastibus@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Pun intended, ofc 🤭
brbposting@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Beaver?
ToxicWaste@lemmy.cafe 2 weeks ago
beavers are also a funny thing: it swims, therefore it is a fish. fish aren’t animal.
i was more referencing things like @arctanthrope@lemmy.world expanded: hiding meat in dough. funny how many strategies they had to cheat a supposedly all-seeing, all-knowing entity.
MelodiousFunk@slrpnk.net 2 weeks ago
Religion is the king of all rules-lawyering.
ToiletFlushShowerScream@piefed.world 2 weeks ago
You know … Bernoulli Fan - that’s way better idea than a room full of MBAs from expensive business schools and months of market research and focus groups with 2 way mirrors ever came up with. Well done
87Six@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
This is such a rollercoaster to read LMAO
rumba@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Tesla sounded like a cool name for a car too…
takeda@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
If only wasn’t owned by a Nazi.
rumba@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
And weren’t dangerous/death traps for no good reason. And had good service practices, and weren’t anti-resale.
Mr. Tesla is certainly rolling over in his grave.
ITGuyLevi@programming.dev 2 weeks ago
To be fair the originals were cool. A small museum in my town has one on display and damnit if those roadsters weren’t pretty cool (to me). Then the Nazi bitch bought the company and they started designing hot garbage.
rumba@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Yeah, I remember them wanting to open-source a lot of the design to help push electrics forward.