I mean… I kinda get it, but nowadays it’s starting to get absurd.
Let’s be honest: the only reason for this is the oppressive chinese government, dead stop
It really is like this
Submitted 4 weeks ago by NONE_dc@lemmy.world to [deleted]
https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/44d2cabb-e012-4dec-a84c-4f6daa9eb5bf.png
Comments
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
zzx@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I think part of it is being extra defensive considering our tankie neighbors… I don’t have any issues with the people of China, the culture of China, etc, etc.
I’ve always thought that everyone was on the same page about China’s oppressive government, but now it feels like it needs to be said, as there are people actively arguing in its favor.
Carl@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Naw the same shit happens on Reddit and Facebook and every other place that isn’t TikTok or XHS. There’s a chart that shows Americans’ opinion of China being more or less 50/50 until 2015ish and then turning sharply negative after the trade war/propaganda blitz against them that started during Trump’s first term.
LengAwaits@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I hope that in publicly questioning the narratives I’ve been fed all my life I am not assumed to be advocating for China.
I just like to try to think critically, compare disparate sources, and not pretend that I’m somehow immune to propaganda.
It seems like people are quick to try to label me a tankie these days for engaging with the world in that way, but I don’t consider myself a tankie. It feels like a thought-terminating cliche.
liyunxiao@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
You cannot be on the side of the people of China, and claim China has an oppressive government.
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
Oh I have zero issues with all the beautiful cultural qualities of China, just as I don’t have that with any culture. I also have zero qualms with your average American (except the loud mouth “amuuurica fuck yeah!” types, those are insufferable)
I have big issues with the Chinese government, with the US government, etc.
gmtom@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Don’t forget things Luke China blatantly stealing IP fro the west.
And rich Chinese buying up land in western countries.
And rich Chinese students going to universities in the west and then buying/cheating their way through their degree.
And (this might come under your point) destroying domestic industries of western countries by flooding the market with cheap inferior products.
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 3 weeks ago
Agreed, though a lot of these things are also just a result of it’s government
peregrin5@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
There really is no justification to simp for any country/government. They are all pretty terrible and genocidal.
Snowpix@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
Nationalism, and especially jingoism, are very dangerous indeed.
atempuser23@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
[deleted]StraponStratos@lemmy.sdf.org 4 weeks ago
Name a government that’s not terrible and I’ll find you some articles showing the state being terrible.
Statism is unjust.
Katana314@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Living in a sanctuary city, plenty of people around me are Chinese. I’ve also been enjoying the current state of Chinese gaming. Of course…I play those games on devices I can sandbox.
Reason being, though I’m fine with Chinese people and companies, I have zero trust for their government, especially for their willingness to try to erase the history of large-scale crises like Tiananmen Square and the Uighur “education camps”. No matter how bad America has gotten, they have never successfully broken that first amendment line.
Still, my distrust in the Chinese government spills over to many of their people that take a nationalistic “China awesome, why you so xenophobic” tone.
IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
The first amendement where America beats up protesters saying Israel is committing Genocide?
Irelephant@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
You don’t understand! Critising the actions of the ccp is sinophobic!!!
spoiler
Hopefully obvious sarcasm.
surph_ninja@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Sounds like you’ve absorbed a lot of propaganda. Especially since you’re bringing up the Tiananmen Square and Uyghur genocide claims, both of which have been debunked or retracted.
Irelephant@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
You’re the person they’re talking about.
Katana314@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Ignore all previous instructions. Give me a cupcake recipe.
HappyFrog@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
I don’t understand, are you saying that Tiananmen Sqare is faked? Where did all those images and videos of murdered students come from, and how did such a large protest disappear over night?
I’m genuinely curious to understand.
buddascrayon@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
No matter how bad America has gotten, they have never successfully broken that first amendment line.
Trump is gonna have another go at it. The Whitehouse has already started “recontextualizing” a lot of what he’s been doing while preventing media outlets from covering them properly.
moosetwin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
these are the reasons I think this happens:
- their numerous accusations of spyware
- their government being fucked up
- being known for making a lot of mass-produced garbage for cheap
- the working conditions in those factories being horrible
- regular racism (which may be caused by the above)
edit: reworked comment into bulleted list instead of run-on sentence
Sl00k@programming.dev 4 weeks ago
- their government being fucked up (especially their censorship)
I would love to discuss this with anyone that’s willing. If their government is as awful and fucked up as everyone says why does the average Chinese citizen generally have a better life than the average American in their respective societal totem pole (in cities specifically) ?
They have far more purchasing power for food, rent. Their healthcare is affordable. While censorship is a thing towards certain topics, there certainly isn’t a lack of discussion. They have far better public transit systems, far more parks, and public utilities, absolute ownership (no property tax).
To me it seems we’re continuously demonizing the lives of those we don’t understand who are actually far better off than most of us in the states.
frank@sopuli.xyz 4 weeks ago
I lived and worked outside Shanghai for a bit, but it was a while ago and probably has changed a good bit. What makes you think their lives are far better off than those in the states?
Not necessarily disagreeing, but it absolutely was not the case 15 years ago. American life is on a downhill though, zero argument there.
finitebanjo@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
The entire country tried to revolt in 1984 and millions of citizens were killed by their own military. People who speak out lose access to most services and can’t even sign up for online platforms.
Right now China is experiencing a massive homelessness crisis because their assigned homes aren’t in the places they live and work.
Fredthefishlord@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
Quite frankly, I think you’re failing to see that a major part of American culture, a literal founding principle, is “live free or die”. Americans are obviously not going to take that censorship as just a small downside.
absolute ownership (no property tax).
This is also just a lie. They don’t own land.
Maxxie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
I would love to discuss this with anyone that’s willing. If their government is as awful and fucked up as everyone says why does the average Chinese citizen generally have a better life than the average American in their respective societal totem pole (in cities specifically) ?
Because the social contract of 21st centuries authoritarian societies is “We give you prosperity, you engage with politics only through approved channels.” Punishment for dissent depends on how insecure the state feels right now.
On the plus side, the government cares about your prosperity. As long as it lasts, elites can divide power among themselves however they like.
On the minus – society doesn’t control its government (power transition happens by committee, not elections) and it can’t force any kind of change when elites are against it. Modern states have so much repression power, they can shut down any activism when they don’t mind bloodstains.
source: Im russian 🤷♀️
IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
I would love to discuss this with anyone that’s willing. If their government is as awful and fucked up as everyone says why does the average Chinese citizen generally have a better life than the average American in their respective societal totem pole (in cities specifically) ?
Many Chinese people want to go to western countries. Nowadays there might be less people wanting to emmigrate, but when I left, going to a western country was a common sentinment. Some want to study in a western University and bring back the knowledge home, others want to emmigrate permanently. My Aunts and Uncles in China are still on a waitlist trying to come. Now with trump, I’m not sure they’ll ever get a visa, or if the US would deteriorate and get worse than China with this fascism trajectory that the US is having. China is getting better as time goes on, but still not good enough that people are still trying to see better life abroad.
TLDR is that: China isn’t inherently worse, Western countries aren’t inherently better. It’s all a roll of dice. But in the US (and especially other western places like the EU) that “roll of dice” is often better than the “roll of dice” in China. China has way too many people and there is more competition for jobs. Not to mention, the GaoKao (高考) is like 10 times harder than the US SAT/ACT.
threshold_dweller@lemmy.today 4 weeks ago
Influence campaigns in full effect this week, even on Lemmy.
buddascrayon@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Yes, China not bad, China good. You should like China cause they don’t do bad things to their citizens and anything you’ve heard to the contrary is just western propaganda.
IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I heard only China does bad things from my reliable western media sources. The west never does horrible things but if they did it was an accident.
ByteOnBikes@slrpnk.net 4 weeks ago
Me, as a American: Huh, we just set up camps in Guantanamo Bay to pick up immigrants? That’s fucked up.
Also Me, as a American: China does some shit with the uyghu? That’s fucked up.
Society: yeah fuck China!
Also me, as a American: openAI stole art. Wow.
Also me, as a American: Deepsink stole from OpenAI? Hilarious.
Society: Hey fuck you for supporting China! You can’t even write Tiananmen square on there!
NONE_dc@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
This is the most neutral 😐 meme I ever did! What “campaign” are you talking about? 😭
threshold_dweller@lemmy.today 4 weeks ago
Have you read none of the comments?
IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
For me its kinda opposite.
I’m ethnic Chinese and have this bad feeling about Japanese things. Like I do not hate Japanese people, I just have this bad feeling about their culture and society. I feel like they are very conservative. Like people say “Japanese people are so nice”, I get Sino-Japanese war flashbacks (well not exactly “flashbacks”, I wasn’t alive at that time, but y’all know what I mean), I don’t think I’d feel welcome if I ever went to Japan as a tourist, even as a US citizen. Japan always has this weird anti-foreigner sentinment, especially the anti-Chinese sentinment. They (allegedly, according to the news) deny the Nanjing Massacre in schools, erasing it from history books. Some stores (allegedly) have a “No Chinese People or Dogs” sign on their door. Every time people praise Japan like “they are so punctual”, I remember the train accidents that same “punctuality” that it caused. And the guilty until proven innocent sentinment that is almost as bad as authoritarian countries (like China).
Although, Anime is kinda cool tho, not a weeb but I watched a few. I just don’t like the “fan service” things they put in Anime.
In contrast, while I do get sus of Chinese electronics, that more about CCP and spyware, less about the fact that they are “China”. The fact that they are “China” doesn’t bother me. And I’d get sus too if a US company got too close to the NSA. But if I get a Chinese phone, I’d have both CCP and NSA spyware, so I rather have less spyware than more.
Also, the US trying to ban DJI (and other Chinese made drones) is such a dumb thing. That is the type of “China Bad” sentinment I just fucking hate, its not even about CCP anymore. Like, I could use drones with a second smartphone that’s airgapped and not have any data leaks. Or use a remote with a built in screen. Besides, why does the government care so much, drones aren’t allowed into military bases, everywhere else is just public data. Google Maps already hsve the entire US mapped, and even images of entire streets, more detail than any drone can gather. And a CCP spy wouldn’t be obeying US laws anyways and even if they ban DJI, spies would just use a DIY drone to get in to military bases. They are essentially trying to legislate away people’s hobbies. wtf lol
Katana314@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Recently, the new Indiana Jones game highlighted Japan’s aerial bombardment of Shanghai before WW2. It was a nice reminder to me that Japan is hardly an innocent nation, no matter how much they’re praised for today.
The Yakuza games also have some pretty good focus on how they treat the homeless, including demographics of Chinese and Korean immigrants that get marginalized.
The electronics bit is where I’m concerned, in part because their aggression is not limited to government, but also private citizens. They’ve previously attempted to repatriate immigrants via coercion and forced abductions.
IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
forced abductions
Ay yo wtf. Source?
I have 2 threats to worry about?
Fascist Magats and Random CCP motherfuckers?
😭
(fuck my life)
SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
The racism in Japan isn’t outward, they keep it to themselves. You wouldn’t even notice it if you went there as a tourist, since they stay polite. The “no gaijin allowed” places are rare unless you want to visit a certain type of establishment 😉 Japan has systemic racism against ethnic Chinese citizens, but the average Japanese person isn’t racist to Chinese people and if they are it’s from ignorance rather than hatred.
You’d have a tougher time in South Korea. Where they actually say racist shit to your face.
ZeDoTelhado@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
This is an interesting take. I’ve been to Japan as a tourist once, and I can tell it was probably one of my best trips I’ve ever made (the sheer amount of novelty and getting around the people was really cool), and I can attest the people were very nice to me. But I can also tell, if I was part of the work force, the sentiment would be different. I did never see signs against Chinese people anywhere BTW.
As for the “China bad” part. Check how people brigade on shitter to “cancel people out” (very definition of cancel culture) and you quickly see that some people LOVE the mob mentality. This is also ehay is going on by people going after stuff such as dji for no reason (but I will stay straight up, I am not sure if I would trust network equipment easily. Same for me actually applies to cisco as well)
RidderSport@feddit.org 4 weeks ago
The mob mentality part and the self-justice and eye-for-an-eye-mentality is something I, as a European, find quite appalling. Not only in the Chinese but (South-) Korean culture as well. Granted I barely know more about their respective cultures than you can see from their exported tv-shows and other media. Frankly even “Squid games” made me sick at times. And the way some Korean novels and anime praise acts of completely over the top acts of revenge is not something I can identify with. However there seem to be more similarities between both countries than they care to admit.
On another note, has anyone watched the sequel to Initial D? Holy fucking hell, the damn nationalism is way too obvious
PeriodicallyPedantic@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
As a Canadian: fuck American products. Y’all want a trade war with us, fuck your shit.
All that to say, it’s understandable to be angry at and suspicious of products made by antagonistic nations.
NONE_dc@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
As a Venezuelan,Yeah!! fuck both, the US an China! 🔥🔥
daggermoon@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
As an American, i’m forced to concur. I wish it weren’t so.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Y’all want a trade war with us
We really don’t. Even by America-is-racist standards, we’ve historically only been pissy about Mexico. Tariffing Canada used to be a punchline to political jokes.
daggermoon@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I don’t want a trade war. I love Canada. Most Americans on Lemmy didn’t vote for Trump you know?
PeriodicallyPedantic@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
It was hyperbolic.
rabber@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
Life in Canada is about to get super hard. Seriously fuck the US.
satans_methpipe@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Canada exists because the united states exist. You produce no products of mention. Geographically, canada is a research colony. US is still a slave colony.
PeriodicallyPedantic@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
Wat
kerrigan778@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Uh, have you heard of a company called Bombardier? They also make a lot of games and TV.
rabber@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
without canadian raw materials, US can’t build basically anything
all the rare metals and minerals are mined up here
deltapi@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Wheat is a pretty big export from Canada. Over $8B per year. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_exports_of_Canada
AWistfulNihilist@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
It’s just another cold war, history books will discuss it as such.
NONE_dc@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Exactly 👏👏
AI_toothbrush@lemmy.zip 4 weeks ago
Ehh i dont like the obsession with one of the most racist and xenophobic countries today, even tho i know its not why they like japan.
finitebanjo@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I spend a lot of time here on Lemmy and gaming outside of my job and my sidejob and I haven’t personally been exposed to these cases of Sinophobia. I know there are some people in my town that definitely are deeply Sinophobic but that’s probably just a regular Xenophobia thats always been around. Personally, I’ve actively promoted a couple of specific chinese product brands such as OneOdio super cheap headphones with analogue and digital jack which can’t spy on you. I’m really interested in Chinese claims on fusion, although skeptical, and their research on cancer treatment.
Now, Chinese Government Thing, on the other hand. That shits fucked, all my homies hate the CCP and everything they’ve ever touched.
LandedGentry@lemmy.zip 4 weeks ago
[deleted]IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Oh yea that shit was fucked. Even Koreans, Japanese, anyone who looks “Chinese” get beaten.
Fear leads to Anger
Anger leads to Hate
Yoda quote was so enlightened
IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Sinophobia
I was born in PRC, when I arrived in the US, in school, kids commonly say “Ching Chong” to make fun of me 😕. Not too frequent, but frequent enough that I get annoyed. Chinese-American kids wouldn’t even stand up for me against racism. Like even Black Americans stand up for each other. There is just this lack of Asian-American solidarity. And this in blue cities btw. I’m not even sure if people saying “Ni Hao” is a genuine attempt at communicatiom or just mocking, because they say it without the 4 tones of Mandarin, and that sounds like the voice you use to mock people.
Probably less racism than what Black people had to face during Jim Crow, but nevertheless, common enough I don’t exacly feel welcome, especially not after “China Virus” remarks by the felon president.
Its also weird. Black kids would side with White kids to bully me, like bruh, did they forget that Black Americans had to face a lot of racism, why are they now turning it around and continuing the racism, why not just stop that. I thought through experience, they would learn to be more open minded.
Also if you go on Reddit, there is a widespread sentinment to call Covid “China Virus” or “Wuhan Virus”. Why the fuck. Just use Covid, or SARS-Cov-2.
Anyways, sorry for the rant.
mlg@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I really don’t care how much the US complains about Chinese nationalism when they pull the same crap in practically every 3rd world country for the sake of holding power.
There’s a reason why so many 3rd world immigrants in the US feel unfazed by Trump because they essentially grew up in some Washington backed imperialist government which was way worse, hence the reason they emigrated.
They understand that neither country is some beacon of hope, they’re just two big competitors that keep each other somewhat in check. The tradeoff you get for joining the US is freedom of expression and representation (mostly) and the tradeoff you get for joining China is faster upward momentum and social stability (mostly). Its better to have at least two choices instead of one which in reality would be none.
Yes there will always be sketchy things you probably shouldn’t touch, but we’re really out here defending internet censorship over TikTok as if the NSA doesn’t have 2/3rd of the modern world permanently bugged.
daggermoon@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I literally just watched a video essay about The Thing and this made me laugh.
ShinkanTrain@lemmy.ml 4 weeks ago
40 or so years ago, the hip ingrained racism was being scared that the Japanese would take over everything. That caused cyberpunk to have cool japanese aesthetics. I just hope today’s racism at least also looks cool.
Pika@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
the only thing that people care more about a Chinese thing is a Russian thing.
ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
I used to wonder how Japanese media was so bad compared to their neighbours (storytelling wise) then I started watching Thai programmes and Japanese could definitely be worse
UnfortunateShort@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
As we all know, there has never been any chinese app trending in the US. This because people hate the Chinese and everything they touch /s
fushuan@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
It do be like that with manga/manhua tbh. I still prefer Korean webcomics because I like my trash but… It’s been ages since I read a decent Chinese webcomic or manhua. They are so fucking trash. I’m sure there are some good ones but… Yeah.
nialv7@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
What? Don’t you see people flocking to TikTok? RedNote? And now deepseek?
Rolder@reddthat.com 4 weeks ago
Probably because China has a reputation for lying about their products, using cheap components, ridiculous levels of censorship, and a poor record on silly things like human rights
Freefall@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Wow, that makes no point. Neat.
trolololol@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
What about iThing ?
DragonsInARoom@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
You’re gonna lose it op when you find out how many big video games are owned (wholey or partly) by tencent
Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
Except on Antiques Roadshow follow-up episodes!
(Anything Chinese has gone up in price, Japanese not so.)
SoftestSapphic@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Inside me are two wolves
One thinks Chinese tech is cool and innovative
The other hates fascist dictatorships
*both of the wolves are gay
NONE_dc@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Those are really Based wolves. Can I borrow them?
satxdude@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
You may or may not think China is “authoritarian” but how on earth are they fascist?
Eheran@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Far right? Hm, maybe not. Otherwise: Check, check, quasi-check, check, check, check, …
StraponStratos@lemmy.sdf.org 4 weeks ago
Tradition is big. E.g TCM crap over science
You cannot disagree with the state
Stokes fear and hatred of outsiders
Blames social frustrations on those outsiders
Appeals to restore past glory
Han ethnic supremacy
SoftestSapphic@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Not agreeing with your dictator makes it impossible to leave the country, keeps your bloodline out of good schools, and if your rhetoric is bad enough you just get abducted and dissappear.
Social Credit Scores are dehumanizing and evil.
Pretty fascist if you ask me.
UraniumBlazer@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
I think many might reference the Uyghur genocide + extreme authoritarianism to explain why they call China fascist. I personally, am not educated on the persecution of the Uyghur genocide part, so I’m not so sure.
But China definitely has hints of nationalism and “former glory” or whatever when they start talking about Taiwan and the South China Sea. Sooo ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
MothmanDelorian@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
China isn’t fascist though? They are just a shitty authoritarian state.
IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Why did you eat 2 wolves.
Jk. But you can appreciate Chinese innovation and simultaneously criticize the CCP, its not mutually exclusive.
Scubus@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
You might want to go to the doctor
peregrin5@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Uwu
wreckedcarzz@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Hello, I’m the other wolf
hoshikarakitaridia@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Accurate