You know, DOGE, fascist president and corporations dictating what people can do, institutions being ruined, laws being ignored. Is there any way out of that or is it over? Is the USA done?
It won’t end without armed conflict
So, is the USA screwed?
Submitted 3 days ago by tigerjerusalem@lemmy.world to [deleted]
Comments
HootinNHollerin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 days ago
EndRedStateSubsidies@leminal.space 3 days ago
Yes.
I’m the short term not much will change and no one will react. By the time they want to react, they’ll play into a fascist crackdown.
Look into the Business Plot. This is basically the result of a century of planning between business interests and religious fanatics with too much money.
As long as capitalism is propagandized as a good thing, civilization will continue to face this issue of the few exploiting the many.
Do you believe every human deserves the same rights and dignities? It’s not possible to make a cell phone without relying on slave labor in the supply chains.
Profit is unpaid labor. As long as we normalize giving at the profits to those that already have everything, civilisations will continue to implode until one makes a mistake of such hubris everyone dies. Look at PFAS. One day we will unleash something we can’t contain and we’ll be dead before we can detect it or treat it.
Our species simply will not survive because we’re too eager to shit where we sleep just so we don’t have to walk all the way to the bathroom.
Scott_of_the_Arctic@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Unless you get good with a sniper rifle its going to stay screwed for ever. Or if you actually have the gall to try to annex one of your neighbours. Then we’ll take care of your problem for you.
puppinstuff@lemmy.ca 2 days ago
I’d say he’s headed for his billionaire bunker but he likes golf too much to follow the scared dictator playbook.
WrenFeathers@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Short answer? Yes. Long answer? Absolutely.
breadsmasher@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Centuries to build
Weeks to destroy.
Good luck.
kitnaht@lemmy.world 3 days ago
To be fair, decades to destroy. This has been slowly culminating since before I was even born.
UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml 3 days ago
Slavery is legal in prisons, we built a circus tent.
Clown country
randon31415@lemmy.world 2 days ago
There is saying things, there is not doing things, and there is doing things.
Trump could say: “What if there was one day where there was no laws and people could just do anything, like the purge…” and… oh, he did say that during his first term. And democracy still survived. Saying things just make people loose respect for America. It is why Obama got the Nobel peace prize. Cause he stopped saying the shit that Bush was saying.
What people should be worried about is actions and inactions. It takes competency to do things. The more fascist a thing Trump wants to do, the more competent people leave and the less likely it is to be done. The true problem is it takes no level of competency to not do a thing.
So Trump’s end game is “Ask not what your country can do for you … because it can no longer do that.”
zqps@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
Unfortunately he’s following the playbook of people who do know how to do things and accomplish goals. And they were much better prepared this time than in 2016.
vsg@lemmy.world 2 days ago
I thought that Obama won the NPP because of Norwegian political stuff involving NATO.
randon31415@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Well, yes, but it was a very weak case - but people were so sick of Bush that that was enough.
Gammelfisch@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Yes and and beyond screwed.
some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 3 days ago
We’re on the way down. The Right in this country (well, really, everywhere, but it’s more maniacal here) are growing more unhinged. The Dems keep pulling to the right as a result (since at least the 80s). The overtone window keeps shifting. We’re absolutely fucked.
William F Buckley was a major source of inspiration for the Right for decades. I recently watched his debate with James Baldwin at Cambridge in 1965. He argued racist points about Black single moms, but he tried to sound compassionate and denounced racism. He hid his racism in plain sight but sounded educated. There’s nothing like that now. “They’re eating the dogs.”
LaLuzDelSol@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Kamala Harris and Biden before her ran on the most liberal platform in history
Skyrmir@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Bernie was more liberal, FDR ran and won 3 times on a more liberal platform.
PanArab@lemm.ee 3 days ago
Genocide is a liberal position? Now you tell me?
conditional_soup@lemm.ee 3 days ago
X
BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 2 days ago
Most neoliberal
ristoril_zip@lemmy.zip 2 days ago
I’m really hoping that Churchill’s quote about Americans doing the right thing is evergreen, because this first month (!!!) of Trump has been A LOT.
I feel like we’re really close to having tried every alternative by now, right?..right?
SabinStargem@lemmings.world 2 days ago
Bullet box has yet to be opened. But I can hear the hinges creaking.
samus12345@lemm.ee 3 days ago
TheReturnOfPEB@reddthat.com 2 days ago
It depends on if Baron is like his father or not.
BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 2 days ago
Source?
reiterationstation@lemm.ee 2 days ago
You’re sure? I’ve had this hunch because, well, obviously, but I don’t know for sure.
lordnikon@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Yes but we should still make them pay for every inch they take.
Adderbox76@lemmy.ca 3 days ago
More and more every day…
Treczoks@lemmy.world 2 days ago
As you failed to prevent fascism at the voting booth, you will have to learn how to stop it now. This is the situation the second amendment had been written for. After being abused to allow criminals and mentally retarded to get access to weapons they should never have, you can now put them to good use.
Aoife@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 days ago
Nah it’s gonna get looted and pillaged and generally go to shit but will be saved by the aheer economic power of being one of the few places left on earth with enough farmland to feed billions when the other breadbaskets start getting decimated by ecological collapse
uienia@lemmy.world 2 days ago
It is interesting that you assume that breadbasket will not also be decimated by climate change.
SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social 2 days ago
Enough farmland? I suggest reading up on the Ogallala Aquifer. Also, where the best climate zones for agriculture will be 50 years from now.
sanpedropeddler@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
Honestly we were screwed long before now, but yes. Its going to be a slow decline into fascism until we collectively wise up. I do think there’s a real possibility of that happening, but its going to take a lot of work.
expLogian@lemmy.world 1 day ago
My hopes are far lower than yours. Nazi Germany had just enough popular support to function without democracy and used heavy propanda to increase its support for a whole decade before it lost the war against all of its neighbors and itself. It took long years of foreign occupation to repair German society, and China isn’t looking like a good choice of occupier in the event a fully Nazified US loses. Many German people today remember their grandparents being ardent Nazis imuntil their deaths. I’m worried the same will be the case for me.
We need a big EU militarization, yesterday. Probably navally focused, treating the US like Imperial Japan and the rest of the Americas like its Manchuria. Russia is a more imminent threat but at least it’s a paper tiger in all things except nuclear. Still, armies are needed to defend against it as well.
sanpedropeddler@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
I’m just hoping we can sort things out before it gets as bad as Nazi Germany was. Maybe I’m being overly optimistic, but having a defeatist attitude certainly won’t help our chances.
takeiteasypolicy@lemmy.world 2 days ago
I wont give a knee jerk response to it. a country the size, economy, and history of USA doesn’t get done for by one President. While Muskrump will cause plenty of institutional damage and suffering on American and global populace, USA will come out stronger and better nation at the end of this (whenever this ends). Case in point, Germany before WWII and Germany after WWII
splendoruranium@infosec.pub 1 day ago
I know you’re trying to sound optimistix, but that particular example required significant (worldwide, in fact) external intervention…
GalacticGrapefruit@lemmy.world 2 days ago
I think we’re headed for balkanization. We’re seeing the breakup of the USSR all over again.
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 2 days ago
On one of the good timelines.
SupahRevs@lemmy.world 2 days ago
We need to weather the storm and come back strong. We need a FDR 2.0 to transition from chaos and oligarchy into a more equitable America with universal healthcare and more support for struggling Americans.
takeiteasypolicy@lemmy.world 2 days ago
agree. USA will need a project 2030 plan to restore and strengthen Democracy in way that it can’be be ever again compromised by one mad man
stm@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
USA will come out stronger and better nation at the end of this
damn
Jumpingspiderman@lemmy.world 1 day ago
One can argue that Felon 47 is a different president. Two bad presidents as evil as Trump and Musk will sink the US.
sumguyonline@lemmy.world 2 days ago
So long as there is people living in a place, having kids, and trying to improve their lives, the places will remain. The government may change, social structure’s get overhauled, but the same fact that people are having kids and building a life means those places are unlikely to go away. The old republic is dead. We have supreme court justices taking bribes then passing judgments saying they can. We have the position of President where anyone in it can legally say “I was doing it for my country the laws don’t apply.” And get away with it. The United States of America as a Democratic Republic, is over. But there still exists a United States of America that has transitioned to a Democratic Empire/kingdom. So to the question; “Is the USA screwed?” The simple answer is No. It will continue on so lobg as the population does. Is the Democratic Republic of the United States screwed? Bitch be dead, screw the corpse if you like.
JDPoZ@lemmy.world 3 days ago
[deleted]VerifiedSource@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
somehow he pisses off the base enough
Trump has to placate the billionaire class. If everybody is still making money and gaining power, they’re unlikely to break with him.
TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 3 days ago
100% cooked bruh. Get the fuck out while you can if you here.
MelonYellow@lemmy.ca 3 days ago
My partner and I are already brainstorming what countries we would go to if in the future shit really hits the fan. I mean just as a hypothetical. Mexico’s up there. We could easily pick up and go, trouble is it’d be harder to get the rest of our family on board.
TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Mexico is so fucking great bruh. Amazing culture and people. All the basic amenities.
tigerjerusalem@lemmy.world 3 days ago
I’m not in the USA, but I have friends that lives there and in Canada. I’m worried for them.
blasphemous@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Although there’s a lot of knee-jerk reaction in some circles, Trump issuing EOs that are illegal and unenforceable only go as far as all the other vitriol that slides it’s way out of his mouth creases. Plenty of things he does are blocked by judges, including his demand that only him and his AG are allowed to interpret the law. It just doesn’t work like that. Although the possibility of things being escalated and allowed through a compromised supreme Court still exists, it hasn’t happened yet. I’m not giving into the mania while checks and balances still actually do exist.
Corporations dictating what people can do has been happening basically my whole life.
DOGE is another story. It’s very bad, yeah, but I’m not sure how it affects me personally in my day-to-day.
GalacticGrapefruit@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Do you like cancer research? How about fighting forest fires? Averting mid-air plane collisions?
DOGE sure hates all of those.
blasphemous@lemmy.world 1 day ago
I believe most of those will get reinstated by Congress or judicial branch.
Katana314@lemmy.world 1 day ago
It’s erroneous to claim the judge orders blocking the executive orders have done anything.
As judge of Lemmy, I order you to stop posting. /s
^ There, that statement alone had just as much effect as the judicial orders. Fact is, DOGE still has extensive access to most of the systems that they breached, and judges have largely been ignored, or have given rulings complicit with Trump’s actions.
blasphemous@lemmy.world 1 day ago
AFAIK that hasn’t actually happened yet. Any search results I got were “what will happen if Trump ignores the court/what can judges do if orders are defied?” So, as a person who had to distance myself from sensationalized news for my mental health, I shouldn’t worry about things that haven’t happened. Especially things so far outside of my control.
StructuredPair@lemmy.world 2 days ago
All government services will start going to shit. You will not notice immediate effects of this, but roads will be worse, food and drugs will become unsafe as the already inadequate monitoring becomes no monitoring, etc. It just won’t all happen overnight and everything will slowly get more dangerous and shinier as all government oversight is destroyed.
Even more indirectly, data products that companies use for deciding investments will become increasingly unreliable. This will increase uncertainty and risk in any corporate investment and lead to decreased corporate spending and an eventual economic contraction.
More immediately, a large number of the people fired this week and last week work in rural areas and the sudden loss of so many jobs in those areas will lead to significant local recessions as the federal money being added to the economy through paychecks disappears overnight.
blasphemous@lemmy.world 1 day ago
This is a pretty good answer. I hope that the judicial branch (not just the top) will reverse many of these decisions, as DOGE really does not have the authority to remove things that Congress voted on…and hopefully Congress will reinstate some of the very important things when they inevitably have to do budget again.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 3 days ago
“screwed” seems a little mild to describe it
ivanafterall@lemmy.world 3 days ago
Yeah.
SabinStargem@lemmings.world 2 days ago
I would say so. The only question is whether the good guys win a civil war. My money is on ‘yes’, since Yarvin’s Cabal is hellbent on exiling all of the competent people from their society, along with being jackasses who have alienated many peoples. It will be a bloody struggle, but I think that Dogey America will ultimately receive the Old Yeller treatment. I only hope that every member of Yarvin’s Cabal are executed - Elon, Thiel, ect.
Let’s not make the mistakes of the 1st Civil War, 1st Business Plot, and 2nd World War, where many high ranking members were permitted to escape justice. These worms will insist on burrowing into the apple, and ultimately destroy the very thing that allowed them to live in prosperity.
uienia@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Who will fight that civil war? The American population is overfed and entertained and way too docile for such things.
Kit@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 days ago
It might take a long time to fix, but someday we will recover.
T00l_shed@lemmy.world 3 days ago
I think the US is over. There will be something else for sure, but i don’t know if the US is salvageable
treadful@lemmy.zip 3 days ago
I think you need some perspective. The situation is bad and seems like foreshadowing of worse things to come. However, we’re a pretty far distance from states pulling away or civil war breaking out.
BaroqueInMind@lemmy.one 3 days ago
If these things Trump is removing with presidential orders was so important, why the fuck didn’t Congress make them laws while Democrats had a majority in the past twenty fucking years?
This shit is infuriating to me that we only blame one side for these issues.
HighFructoseLowStand@lemm.ee 2 days ago
Unless there’s a coup when the Supreme Court finds against Trump and he ignores them and Republicans keep Congress from holding him accountable the only way the Court will let them.
southsamurai@sh.itjust.works 3 days ago
Not necessarily.
There are still legal routes, the chances of congress not laying down on the job, etc.
Then, you’ve got the first line of citizen action, protests and non violent direct action combined with people helping each other until the legal stuff has a chance to work.
Beyond that, right now, across the country, small groups are trying to organize. Most of them as a form of more assertive resistance and/or a safety net for trans people, immigrants, and other targets of the current administration.
There are also smaller groups than that organizing for the possibility of having to fight.
That does include people just as batshit as the more rabid right wing, but most of them are less eager than the crazies to get involved in an asymmetric civil war. So they aren’t very visible.
But there are people working at all levels to resist and turn things around.
The way out is for everyone that can to be ready. To take risks to protect each other, and to do what they can when they can.
TheCriticalMember@aussie.zone 3 days ago
I believe the US is a failed state. trump just decided that himself and his AG are the only people who can decide which laws apply to the executive, and ordered the termination of all remaining Biden era US Attorneys. I know we’ve been saying this a lot lately, but it feels like a mask off moment.
NoxAstrum@lemmy.ca 2 days ago
Not yet, not necessarily. The further this goes, the closer they come to the point of no return.
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 2 days ago
No, it is.
Unless the great unwashed Didn’t Votes wake the fuck up and absolutely destroy MAGA in 2026 America is trapped with fascists actively purging the government of anyone not a loyalist.
The voting blocs are completely partisan, and they fucking should be because MAGA is a fascist party.
When a political party comprised of about half of the voters in a state explicitly reject honesty, human rights, and democracy and gains control the state there is not a way out without a civil war.
aquinteros@lemmy.world 1 day ago
that is considering there are more elections
Azal@pawb.social 1 day ago
Oh we’re past the point of no return. The question we’re at now is how much damage can we mitigate from here forward.
The US has killed any of it’s power it’s had in the world beyond military and economic. The power it had through friendships and trade deals, they’re fucking gone. Trade deals have been shown to be temporary and based on whims so why would anyone do it. And friendships? HAHAHAHAH.
So now it’s economic… and oh look, we’re about to start tearing that apart and probably look at a depression that will be compared to the OG Great Depression, while the trade deals are going across the world and China is definitely willing to step up to the plate to be the “adult in the room” in trade deals.
So last it’s military power. And with getting rid of officers to only have loyal ones… that means strategy and tactics will be going out the window for “We have a big hammer.”
That’s the US’s interaction with the world, which most of our lives we’ve been in the dominant position. So that’ll get rough. Now on to the things internally that DOGE has gone through and cleared out, it’ll take years to unfuck the stuff already done.
VerifiedSource@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
A point of no return won’t be hit for a while. The buildings still exist and people with domain knowledge are still around.
CurlyWurlies4All@slrpnk.net 3 days ago
Going from decline to fall. To be fair it took Rome 200 years or so I’m sure the US will limp on for a while yet. But it won’t ever be what it was again.
Saleh@feddit.org 3 days ago
The “limping on” has been the past 40 years already. Ever since Neoliberalism became the dominant economic ideology and fully embraced by both mayor parties.
Capitalism declines into Fascism. The current administration is not the root cause of the US problems. It is a symptom that is accelerating the decline into Fascism. But the ground work was laid many years ago and defended ever since. We see a similar trend in many other countries that adopted the US Neoliberalism to various extends.
VerifiedSource@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
The Soviet Union as a credible major adversary meant the US couldn’t drop the ball too much. China is only now becoming a serious rival. Russia is totally changed player that sneaked up on the west. In the decades in between the US could fumble, drop, and lose the ball without much immediate consequence.