Submitted 22 hours ago by Don_Dickle@lemmy.world to [deleted]
Nazis do this dumb thing where they go “hey that small and therefore relatively defenseless group (badassness of individuals aside) is the cause of all our problems, let’s kill them to solve everything!”
Surprisingly, it never works.
So they do it again with somebody else, and somebody else, and somebody else, until everybody on earth is killed by nazis or somebody stops them.
As for why anybody is dumb enough to fall for it in the first place…it’s anybody’s guess.
Surprisingly, it never works.
The Holocaust happened and Trump got elected. If those two things don’t count as examples of this hateful strategy working then idk what does.
I think they meant it doesn’t solve any problems because they never were the problem.
Uneducated people in rural areas struggle very much with understanding their experiences of others, and have very strange ideas about how the world works. I told my grandmother I wanted to move to Chicago - she’s convinced I’m going to get gang murdered. (She would be horrified if I told her about wandering around LA on foot)
The idea that there are options other than cisgender heterosexual people is threatening to their understanding of their world. Many have not thought about their gender or sexuality; it’s assumed that you’ll get married to the opposite sex, get gender appropriate jobs, have kids, and go to church on Sunday. That’s what life is in Anadarko or Siloam Springs. Many also struggle with unaddressed trauma from the opioid/fent crisis, or military service - so they think the appropriate response to anguish about your body should just be to just cope with it.
Many of these men are secretly bisexual. Many, many, many heterosexually married men seek out sexual encounters with gay men on the side. They would never want to be in a relationship with a man or someone they perceived as a strange, mentally defective man - for many of them that would also assault their understandings of a relationship as more of a property thing. They feel guilty about porn usage, especially the Christian ones, but externalize it as hatred.
The woman are miserable and are committed to making everyone else miserable as well. You gain power in those communities by policing others, especially young women. They are threatened by the idea that they weren’t locked into compulsive heterosexuality and performative femininity. There was a possibility that they could have graduated college, or not had children.
They get the program though. They’re proper Puritans. If life is suffering then the only joy to be had is in watching other people. And what better target than those who are defying our most basic sociological roles? These are the same people who host gender reveal parties - it matters to them. So it must matter to everyone else.
That’s my guess as a trans man at least, obviously I’m biased.
Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.
And the twist is 99.9% of Republican voters think they are in the in-group just because the leopards haven’t eaten their faces yet.
I’m going to get all sorts of fun responses for trying to empathize with those with whom I disagree (instead of just writing “dumb bigots”) but here goes:
First, remember that even gay marriage is fairly new to America, it’s been around for less time than the MCU.
There are a lot of folks who almost have mental whiplash, gay marriage went from illegal to “you could get fired for being vocally uncomfortable about it” in fairly quick order.
Now, to make things even more wild for those folks, mainstream culture is pretty insistent that gender isn’t even a thing anymore. Add in some pretty wild news stories/videos*, worries for their kids and the notion that the Left refuses to say there might be any issues whatsoever and you can kinda see where a backlash could crop up.
Can we compromise? No trans people in sports and trans people have their own unique prison or cell block and young teens can take puberty blockers and estrogen so they don’t need to try to pay 150,000 in facial feminization plastic surgery at 18 or 19, money of which they can only get quickly from sex work and not going to school? Sound like a good compromise?
You were doing reasonably well, until you diverted to pure transphobia in the last paragraph
The listing of the news/videos they may have seen?
Bruh check out the guys post history, read their comment history, they arent exactly a trans ally
This aligns with what I have heard from folks I know in that world. Fear motivated by exaggerating one off and isolated incidents. The information silos in the conservative world (especially news) is frightening.
Which I don’t get because they’re all about rape as a jail punishment
I’ll try actually answer the question and get hated for it I’m sure rather than circle jerking something to the top. But I think it goes like this.
Imagine you had a ball and a cube. Then everyone agrees the ball is a ball and a cube is a cube. Been like this as long as anyone remembers.
Then suddenly someone comes around and says one of those cubes is special and is actually a ball. Then everyone agrees that person is mental. Years go by and more people start saying that some cubes are balls and you feel like you are losing you mind. You know what a ball is, everyone knows what a ball is! How can anyone say a cube is a ball. People attack you for it. People say you are wrong that you are hateful, horrible but you know! Surely everyone knows this is a joke.
They started painting cubes to look like balls and everyone acts like they are balls. But you know they aren’t balls.
You are happy to group them on different measures. Sure some balls and some cubes are red, some are yellow. Both balls and cubes can be spiky, sure balls are more often spiky but there is nothing wrong with a spiky cube. Each to there own. Most cubes are smooth but some balls are smooth. That’s fine.
There are a million and one ways to group these shapes. But at the end of the day a cube is a cube and a ball is a ball. Anything else is madness and you’re not standing for it. You can group them however you want, choose whatever is the most important, fine is doesn’t matter. But don’t say something that is obviously a cube is a ball and what is obviously a ball a cube. You can’t change the definition of a cube to be what that shapes feels it is, that’s meaningless. It defeats the purpose of the word. Sure make a new word but don’t use that word.
what a shit analogy
But at the end of the day a cube is a cube and a ball is a ball. Anything else is madness and you’re not standing for it.
This is the crux of where you are wrong. There’s more than just cubes and balls, but because of society, stigma and restrictive laws in some countries, everyone has to try and fit themselves into a cube or a ball, even though they might be egg shaped.
genders are not defined by shape of the human but by biology
Why would you ask this question on Lemmy. You will get few, if any, legitimate answers. This platform is an echo chamber.
Remove the bottom 75% of IQs in the bell curve, then take that group and choose the top 1/3 of the most technologically literate, then you have lemmy
It’s just that extremely high intelligence and extreme knowledge about tech happen to correlate with certain views that aren’t based on mythological bullshit. But yeah, I guess you could call that an echo chamber?
Fucking lol. Thanks for that.
Yeah, such a shameful lack of bigots’ POV.
Most platforms are echo chambers but this one is a chamber without many conservatives.
To be fair, every platform is an echo chamber. The only differences are to what degree.
Probably true enough, but I’m sure there are a few that are a mixed bag.
What?
They’re a convenient political target because it makes insecure men not want to be associated with them. Believe it or not, a similar thing happened last time Republicans won the popular vote in 2004 - back then the issue was gay marriage. Bush went hard on opposing that and it helped him win.
FYI
nbcnews.com/…/nashville-christian-school-shooter-…
They’re people, just like the rest of us. Some are great, some are not.
yeah, was going to say - there have been trans mass shooters, lol
Another notable case:
en.wikipedia.org/…/Colorado_Springs_nightclub_sho…
Aldrich’s attorneys have said in court documents that their client identifies as non-binary and uses they/them pronouns, preferring to be addressed as Mx. Aldrich. Neighbors allege Aldrich to have made hateful comments towards the LGBT community in the past, including frequent usage of homophobic slurs. Aldrich never mentioned being non-binary prior to the shooting and was referred to with masculine pronouns by family members. Police testified they found rainbow-colored shooting targets in Aldrich’s home. Experts in online extremism have voiced the possibility that Aldrich’s proclaimed self-identification could be disingenuous, while the Center for Countering Digital Hate acknowledges the suspect’s past actions and impact on the LGBT community.
I am personally inclined to agree that the self-identification is likely disingenuous, a stunt for the courtroom.
Fear, control, indoctrination, tribalism, double standards, poor mortal character, hypocrisy, and because it ‘makes them feel icky’ and so they have to be loud and obvious about it so that they’re community sides with them and doesn’t suspect that they’re (allegedly) total closet cases.
Unless I am wrong I never heard of one shooting up a school church or whatever.
Even by population ratios, that’s gotta be really rare.
Outwordly trans people make up like 1% of the population. So one incident could screw with the stats more than you’d like.
After it became less acceptable to explicitly hate the gays in public they needed a new target. There’s a lot of people who like being riled up with hatred, who are fearful and need a bogeyman, etc. It’s either human nature or something deeply embedded in our culture. Eventually they will move on and find a new target to focus their hate on.
Since when do conservatives care about mass shootings?
Because conservatives are smooth brained and small minded
Not many are against trans people but rather against the ideology, for example most people are against suicidal ideation while supporting mental health treatment and feeling empathy toward those who are suffering.
What is the ideology you’re talking about? I’m not sure I follow your example, are you comparing suicidal ideation to being trans and suggesting the same treatment?
You’re fucking gross
It seems that way because the minority of people who are against trans people are very loud and obnoxious, and their voices are heavily amplified by sites like Facebook and Twitter.
Ok, am conservative.
I’m going to give my thoughts.
So I’m fine with most things between consenting adults. The problem is when there isn’t consent and in a larger group, a lack of consensus.
Kids can’t consent, and despite claims to the contrary, there’s been a couple of trans kids. The issue I see is the amount of push back on passing laws against trans kids. Why on earth do y’all care so much about banning something that isnt happening?
I’m not into sports, but I can see how unfair it is when a bio man fights a bio woman. Even if they’re taking mtf hormones, there’s still a ton of testorone. Just from a safety aspect, they shouldn’t allow bio men in women’s boxing or MMA or anything like that. Chess and stuff of that nature doesn’t really care about the sex that much. And there’s been more a couple of sports women who are against it too. There’s a lack of consensus.
As an aside, we were making a ton of progress against gender roles, and now here we are reinforcing them. Can’t even wear drag now without being called trans. It’s annoying.
Why are you guys so obsessed with labels? Let dudes wear dresses and women wear whatever. You don’t need a label for it.
Trigger warning: this is a very graphic response. In a bad frame of mind? Emotionally upset easily? Just don’t read it.
The thing that conservatives don’t understand is that if someone is clearly trans at 14 and they start taking puberty blockers and estrogen, they sometimes wind up looking like Kim Petras. Kim Petras sort of looks slightly trans, but mostly, she just looks like a hot chick. She will not have the same easy life a naturally born hot chick would, but it’s going to be much much easier because of what happened when she was an early teenager.
Now let’s say you wait until 18, because kids shouldn’t be pushed into things. Now you have adams apples, larger brow ridges, and worst of all, there are different midface ratios you can’t really correct even with surgery. At a certain point, even will all the estrogen and feminizing surgeries in the world, you will still look like a dude taking estrogen wearing makeup. A person in this situation will have a much harder life. The respectable and admirable Kaitlen Jenner is an example of someone who had tons of money and even then, the facial feminization with all the money in the world can’t change certain ratios when someone transitions at a certain age.
Neither person “passes.” Kim Petras from certain angles occasionally looks Trans. But if she wore conservative makeup and a conservative outfit, she could go somewhere and do something without getting mean dirty looks.
Do you know what it’s like to get mean stares and glares all the time? If you are conservative, you don’t. Any mean look inherently makes a person with any normal limbic system feel bad. Do you know how many dirty looks conservatives gives to different looking people every single day? All these conservatives talk about Bible this and Jesus that and protecting children this and that. A lot of children who feel trans blow their brains out, hang themselves, or jump of tall things once they are adults because they didn’t get puberty blockers and estrogen before their face looked manly and it would require hundreds of thousands of dollars of plastic surgery to correct and the dirty looks and meanness wear them down and eventually, they are just done.
This is not about protecting children, it’s about protecting conservative religious beliefs.
The conservative fear that some woke snowflake mom is going to push her confused depressed kid into chopping of his genitals and pretending to be a woman doesn’t line up with reality and it’s a flawed argument. Being trans is a hard and miserable road and no parent or kid wants it, it’s something that happens, like cancer, that people deal with, but at least with cancer, you get sympathy from everyone, instead of your family disowning you if you are conservative.
I understand the “moderate” perspective on this, but you are totally wrong.
Except for the part about sports. Transgendered people just shouldn’t be able to compete in sports or should have their own league. And liberals arguing otherwise detracts credibility from the much more important issue, which is trans kids should be able to get medical care before they get huge adams apples and brow ridges and longer midfaces and sharper cheekbones and wind up much more likely to commit suicide.
The more important part of the equation is being able to use puberty blockers and take estrogen prior to developing even more manly characteristics. Genital surgery could be done as an adult, but that’s not actually what conservatives want, they want no medication intervention before 18.
If there are concerns about making young teens who are confused infertile, then conservative religitards can subsidize these people freezing their eggs or sperm, but the reality is not that many people change their minds on this. For every random YouTube special filmed by a hardcore catholic showing a schizophrenic female who regrets lopping off her breasts, you have thousands of women who are now trans men who are less likely to die, but the Catholic documentary filmmakers don’t add that in, do they?
Conservatives often point to the horrors of the surgeries. They are horrific. Sometimes if someone reverses their penis and scrotum, hair can grow on the inside of their constructed “vagina” and the whole thing is horrific. But the math is evident: the trans people who do these surgeries are less likely to blow their heads off.
People act like this is an ivory tower debate, but really it’s often there are 2 outcomes: outcome 1 is that Billy with a large browridge, adam’s apple, and manly cheeks, who doesn’t have 150,000 for facial feminization surgery, lays down in front of train tracks at 19 and splat, OR Billy takes puberty blockers and estrogen at 13, becomes Billie, and ends up marrying a mathmatician who doesn’t want to have children for some reason and they live happily ever after despite being an unusual couple.
The fake empathy and outrage Christians have neglects to look at the statistics and the actual outcomes and relies on the availability heuristic/bias to make assumptions. It’s all fine and well to do such ivory tower debates, unless you’re the transgender teen who ends up dead because of it.
Even if they’re taking mtf hormones, there’s still a ton of testorone.
This is factually wrong. Trans women on HRT statistically have far less testosterone than cis women, purely for the reason that it is a hormone all humans create but we are actively suppressing it.
Ok, tentatively, that’s a small sample size, but if it scales up, transwomen still have higher absolute handgrip strength, lower forced expiratory volume in 1 s:forced vital capacity ratio and lower relative V̇O2max. They still went through male puberty and are reaping the benefits.
This video explains it better than me, but mostly a combination of religion being against trans people and bad science.
i believe it, the bad science is here in this thread!
“Religion” is too broad a term. Conservatives like to call what they practice Christianity, although it would have appalled Christ. They also like to represent themselves as the mainstream of Christianity, but they are very much in the minority. They just get on the news more often.
You need an enemy who can't fight back... So it's never: The white male millionaires are coming for us [...]
At this point I’m assuming that loads of them either want to be trans, want to have sex with a trans person, but they feel they can’t do either because they were told it’s evil
It’s the same as the gay hating, any guy very visibly hating gays always ends up snorting cocaine from a gay escort dick.
Not that it really matters as a legitimate cause to dislike trans people, but the 2023 Nashville shooting at a school was done by a trans person.
Because the science ia highly debated and we are yet to come to a real consensus on the issue. From what ive seen most people really dont gives a fuck about being anti trans they give a fuck about trans intervention with children.
Not most. Your premise is faulty
Prove it
It’s on OP to prove. But reasonably most people aren’t transphobic considering how big of s topic, if you will, transsexualism had become lately. I don’t think most conservatives are transphobic either.
Kind regards, someone who would be very liberal in the US.
Gender and separation of humans based on those lines have been a thing for longer than humans even called themselves “humans”, and transpeople threaten that. So it triggers a flight or fight reflex in people who aren’t used to the concept.
I find when people know me for awhile and THEN find out I’m trans, their reaction is less “I’m scared”, and more “That’s neat”, but if people find out I’m trans before they get to know me, they will be hostile the whole time.
It’s who their owners say to hate, so they hate them. Could be anyone and for no or any reason. They’re cultists and they do, say, hate, and fear who they’re told to.
I see a lot of mostly correct answers here, but as a trans person myself I can’t help but feel they are all missing the core concept.
People hate trans folk for the same reason “get back in the kitchen” is still said to women in any non-“traditional” role or the “angry black man/woman” is said about anyone advocating for their own rights. There are strict gender and racial roles that are enforced by our society so rigidly, that many have assumed them to be naturally correct laws of the universe. Anyone existing outside of those roles is seen as either mental illness to be corrected or malicious evil-doers wanting to cause trouble. When in fact the reality is much simpler, that being human is a more diverse expressive and dynamic experience than those holding on to those “natural laws” would like to admit. Conservatives are more prone to this, but liberals are absolutely not immune. To exist outside the role you were “assigned” is a threat to society that assings the roles, ergo a threat to the very way of life for those who see them as innate truths.
some schmucks want to exploit the very basic fear of the unfamiliar, and they pointed it at trans folk to get votes or whatever.
Largely because it’s very obviously being used as a political propaganda tool, and any criticism at all is being treated as a horrific crime.
I only know of one, and she’s an expert at everything related to fiber channel and tape drives. So I guess it might be that US conservatives are ideologically opposed to cheap long term offline storage.
This is America, we store things in the iCloud or the garage.
First, I’d challenge the ‘most people’ part. In my experience most people really, truly do not care one way or the other if someone is trans. But to be fair, this may vary between countries, societies, etc.
Next, aside from its obvious use as a political wedge issue, and generic fear of the unfamilar, I’d argue that a decent portion of conservatives (in a North American sense) fancy themselves as Christians. There are ideas in the bible re: the ‘place’ of men and women in relation to one another that make deviations from this (gender identity not match genitals, homosexuality, etc.) aborrhent. I personally think those people are missing the actual good things to take away from Christianity, but I’m also not a Christian, so idk.
I think it’s silly, really - coming out and living as a Trans person, if that’s something folks feel they want/need to do, is one of the most radical exercises of a person’s autonomy and personal freedom. I’m for it.
Complete aside, but it’s always weird to have conversations with folks who like the idea of transhumanism who are transphobes. Met more than one conservative person who is like this, which is really the only time I give trans people much serious thought beyond “Oh look, a fellow human. Neat!”
I live in texas and transphobia is prevalent enough that misgendering is the norm once people hear my voice. I get looks of disgust often enough that I’m used to it, so yeah it varies from place to place and some people don’t know how bad it is because they dont experience it.
Ugh - that’s fucking gross of people, and I’m sorry to hear that.
My argument was more when considering ‘most people’ - most people is a lot of people. An individual doesn’t really interact with most people. But that said, you can certainly interact with ‘enough people’ that an expectation of shoddy treatment is pretty reasonable (if a pretty bullshit set of circumstances individuals shouldn’t have to suffer).
Pedantry on my part, I guess, along with likely blindspots I have as a cis male. Fuck transphobes…such meaninglessly hurtful bullshit.
MaxPow3r11@lemmy.world 6 hours ago
It seems like it’s always projection with these fascists.
They are the ones whose “party” is full of violent sexual predators. They will never bring up the monsters (including their “president”) on their own “team”.