Political discourse
Submitted 5 weeks ago by jaupsinluggies@feddit.uk to [deleted]
https://feddit.uk/pictrs/image/c755d594-6f02-4a42-830c-eaab8f05d408.webp
Comments
Tippy@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
trxxruraxvr@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Can I be a leftist without being a tankie then?
Tippy@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
Yes? You do realize tankies are a minority group and that in many nations “leftist” is just a normal political position?
I’m honestly not sure what you’re trying to say here
TheMinister@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
Trying anarchism. Goes down smooth
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
tankie is, as i understand it, a combination of authoritarianism, leftism, and some weird nostalgia for the soviet union i’m not entirely sure i’ve just been casually trying to pick stuff up.
Juice@midwest.social 5 weeks ago
Yes, you can even be a communist without being a tankie.
BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 5 weeks ago
Not now that the term has expanded to mean everything to the left of Kamala Harris.
kadaverin0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
Absolutely. There are numerous strains of leftist philosophy that are anti-authoritarian.
YourMomsTrashman@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I’m too uneducated on politics to even know what left and right means. Where do I land
Tartas1995@discuss.tchncs.de 5 weeks ago
Well they are slightly vague terms, so please don’t feel stupid. A shocking amount of people who think they know, don’t know.
Left wing politics are generally about a rejection of hierarchy of people. Consequently, they tend to be interested in an international community because we are all the same and deserve the same. As freedom is something that everyone wants for themselves, the left tend to be in favor of an equally free community, e.g. freedom to love.
Right wing politica are generally about hierarchy of people. But not because the hierarchy is necessarily the point, but it tend to be in favor of maintaining the current state, Which just happens to be hierarchical. And usually everything get viewed from a hierarchical pov. E.g. nationalism is a hierarchical view of country and people, your country and its people above other country and their people.
Obviously you could point at the historical stance of us republicans that they want a small government and argue that a small government creates less of 2 class citizens, the law markers and the citizens. But the left would point out that a small government just enables the powerful people to exploit the weak people and create more 2 class citizens.
On the left: The strong hierarchy in the previous attempts of “communism” is the reason why some people will say that true communism was never tried. Other will argue that you need a little bit of authority to run a communustic state.
So the whole thing is a little more complex than “freedom” and “restrictions” and who supports what “restrictions” when.
mathemachristian@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
Right: in favor of privately owned means of production.
Left: in favor of publicly owned means of production.Juice@midwest.social 5 weeks ago
Most people have confused politics. If you want to land somewhere you need to educate yourself and develop principles so that instead of not knowing where you’ll land, you’ll know exactly where you stand
jaupsinluggies@feddit.uk 5 weeks ago
Six strawmen in a single post! Well done, that must be some kind of record!
Tippy@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
Reeeeeeeeeee I spouted centrist nonsense in a leftist space and I’m getting ratio’d reeeeeee
ZombiFrancis@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
It is clever, you see, that any disagreement must be done online, therefore reinforcing the premise of the meme.
NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 5 weeks ago
Uh... fucking cope hard. The Nazis won't care about your enlightened centrist when they arrest you for being brown and/or the wrong kind of white.
kadaverin0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
“I think we need a mixture of both!”, he shouts while be loaded into a cattle car.
surph_ninja@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Anyone who stands against genocide and opposes war has been lumped in with “tankie” for a long while now. That centrist is empowering the Nazis.
grumpusbumpus@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Thank you.
Because being a passive centrist while the world slides towards authoritarianism, global conflict, and environmental holocaust is not morally acceptable.
You don’t have to be a Tankie to want to fight these fascist fucks and their suicidal agenda.
surph_ninja@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Well if you say anything like ‘we shouldn’t give weapons to Nazis,’ you’re going to be labeled a tankie, too.
didnt1able@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
I mean a lot of people don’t want to have their way of life userped by these radical idiots. One side is calling for a civil war and the other side is effectively campaigning for concentration camps. Normal people don’t want to engage with either brand of insanity. They just want to go to work and go home, spend time with their family.
Star@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
Someone misinterpreted the post.
surph_ninja@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Another centrist who thinks the left just doesn’t get it.
missfrizzle@discuss.tchncs.de 5 weeks ago
if you were a centrist before 2020, and you still are in 2025, then you’ve moved Right, since the Overton window shifted Right.
if you kept your principles you’re now Left. that’s how the window works.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 5 weeks ago
tankies are such a small niche group, i dont think theres enough of them to have a significant on policy, unlike right wingers have real numbers on thier hands.
finitebanjo@piefed.world 5 weeks ago
They run TikTok among many other CCP funded operations, I wouldn't disregard them personally.
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 5 weeks ago
Lol
The tankies engaged in hypercapitalism
frostedtrailblazer@lemmy.zip 5 weeks ago
You’re not wrong. Many of them are exposed to propaganda on TikTok and it is a growing issue. Espionage is being done to divide the left and consolidate the right. Just because it’s not as noticeable as the propaganda from the right doesn’t mean that it’s not having subtle effects. If it gets people to disengage or not look out for their best interests then it is effective. All this to say, there is a way to bring about positive change that has to do with being involved locally.
Highlandcow@feddit.uk 5 weeks ago
Isn’t there a difference between the right and the far right though
finitebanjo@piefed.world 5 weeks ago
I wouldn't say so, I'm a consequentialist so when I see a pedophile felon in the white house removing the 14th amendment while not a single GOP congressman opposes him, I feel like the entirety of the US right is effectively gone and only the far right remains.
Gold_E_Lox@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
the one’s who do the bad shit and the one’s who support it. sure if thats enough difference for you ig
Juice@midwest.social 5 weeks ago
In many cases, I think so. People everywhere get their morality from culture. Since many people are raised conservative, and risk damaging their social connection in their community by straying from conservative values, people can be very protective of certain social conventions and perspectives, out of fear of social isolation or even alienating themselves from their actual nature in order to adhere to social convention.
Its an understatement to say that the far right/fascism weaponizes this fact. But many many conservatives are workers which means that they share lived exploitation with the rest of us. Capitalism is the force that divides the working class, and when we participate in divisive/sectarian tendencies then whatever ideology we claim, leftist or whatever, then we are carrying water for the billionaire class.
Its not always that simple though. Many people experience real trauma by having conservative values thrust upon them. Objective morality is a plague, but so is dualism. We need to think completely differently and work with others to navigate these dynamics
Nalivai@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Thanks for the grasroots money, this small group is actually very loud. The loudest of them all. They maintain the illusion that communism is when you like Russia, and that’s their entire purpose
BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 5 weeks ago
Imagine looking at the current state of the USA and saying “communists are the problem!”
TheDemonBuer@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
If you think the next US civil war will be fought between Nazis and Marxism-Leninists, you don’t understand American politics very well. The US in 2025 isn’t Stalingrad in 1942.
NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 5 weeks ago
Nitpick: They're Marxist-Leninists, not Marxism-Leninists.
blarth@thelemmy.club 5 weeks ago
HappyFrog@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
!enlightenedcentrism@lemmy.world
finitebanjo@piefed.world 5 weeks ago
Let's be honest, the Nazis and Tankies align on like 98% of policy. They both support Donald Trump, for example. They both enable ethnostates to send minorities to camps. They believe in a nation ruled by one supreme absolute leader.
Alcoholicorn@mander.xyz 5 weeks ago
They both support Donald Trump, for example.
lmao what?
They both enable ethnostates to send minorities to camps.
lmao what?
They believe in a nation ruled by one supreme absolute leader.
Dictatorship of the proletariat doesn’t mean total rule by one dude named proletariat, it means total rule by the people.
TurkishKebab@lemmy.zip 5 weeks ago
These liberals and their “both-siding” will be the death of us all
finitebanjo@piefed.world 5 weeks ago
Tankies support China and the USSR, neither of which have ever practiced rule by the proletariat, and of which the remainder is committing their own little genocide at home.
kadaverin0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
Dictatorship of the proletariat doesn’t mean total rule by one dude named proletariat, it means total rule by the people.
Tankies want a vanguard of the best brightest to lead and educate the proletariat into a new “socialist” future. Conveniently, the best and brightest happens to be them and their homies.
They also just so happen to have a new vision of socialist utopianism of you working in a sweat shop for 14 hours a day and eating rationed food while they sip fine wines and write bullshit very online mutants will recite as scripture in the future.
Juice@midwest.social 5 weeks ago
The ACP is the only american so-called communist org that supports Trump, and virtually every other segment of the serious organized left considers them a fascist org. Don’t buy into fascist framing of issues or you are working for the fascists when you spread them
finitebanjo@piefed.world 5 weeks ago
And Chinese state run TikTok promoted him and Hexbear was singing his praises. Bottom line is anybody who opposes "us imperialism, capitalism" is happy to see Trump make cruelty the point, happy to see Americans suffer in decline.
Tankies aren't far left, they're just the CCP's tools of war.
Mubelotix@jlai.lu 5 weeks ago
And they are both downvoting you haha
Auntievenim@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
There is literally only 1 downvote
Jinarched@lemmy.ca 5 weeks ago
FreshParsnip@lemmy.ca 5 weeks ago
When I have centrist views about anything (not just politics but more trivial matters like pop culture), I’m reluctant to share them online because extremists on both sides interpret you as an extremist on the opposing side
BaroqueInMind@piefed.social 5 weeks ago
Centrist views such as? grabs popcorn
No seriously, what do you happen to be sitting on the fence about?
Ek-Hou-Van-Braai@piefed.social 5 weeks ago
Daniel Sloss has a funny bit about exactly this.
https://youtu.be/O-qcXpapsoY
Sadly it’s so true
RizzRustbolt@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
The very model of the modern major liberal.
passepartout@feddit.org 5 weeks ago
Regardless of online / offline, this can be attributed to a method of gaining and maintaining political power called divide and conquer.
devolution@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
It’s not a bell curve. It’s a trumpet headed to the right.
Ek-Hou-Van-Braai@piefed.social 5 weeks ago
Wait does bellend mean at the end of a bell curve?
DmMacniel@feddit.org 5 weeks ago
No its what german dogs do.
BlueCanoe@lemmy.ca 5 weeks ago
Ideological polarization is actually pretty low among average Americans. It’s mostly felt among the highly politically engaged and politicians. So to that extent, this image seems accurate.
QuinnyCoded@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
it is very clear you don’t live in a small southern county
FridaySteve@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
People need something else to focus on. When everything is politics then politics is everything and it’s stupidly difficult to get people interested in doing anything positive.
astutemural@midwest.social 5 weeks ago
It’s hard to avoid politics when giving kids lunch at school is fucking political for some reason.
There is a group to blame for politicizing everything, and it is disingenuous to blame ‘people’ in general instead of that group in particular.
NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 5 weeks ago
I mean, everything is politics whether anybody likes it or not, because politics is just what you get when you have a hierarchical power structure.
TowardsTheFuture@lemmy.zip 5 weeks ago
Maybe if you mean this as the left vs the left… sure.
Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
The enlightened centrism is strong in this one. No, the US don’t have a conflict of left vs. right. The conflict is between the right and everyone else. And most of the right are just rubes who think they being part of some kind of movement but in reality are just being fleeced by a bunch of grifters
halvar@lemy.lol 5 weeks ago
I’d say the curve it’s much flatter on the left side. As in right side is shouting tankie, meanwhile there are like 2 tankies and the right wants to set the whole barn on fire to get them both.
finitebanjo@piefed.world 5 weeks ago
Meanwhile thr Tankies are in the Right's barn the entire time.
kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
Not just the right vs. everyone else, the right vs. everyone. The right is also fighting itself.
maus@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
The left is also fighting itself. Literally the comment chains in this post are prime examples.
People who probably align with the majority of the stances, tearing each other down with bad faith arguments, grandstanding over the remaining things they disagree on.
“Perfect is the enemy of good.”
I might not politically align with the average .ml user, but my views are a hell of a lot closer aligned with them than MAGAt views.
Xanthobilly@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Grifters? They’re hellbent on christofascism.
No_Eponym@lemmy.ca 5 weeks ago
And if they suffer under that Christofacist regime they helped bring about? That is righteous and holy suffering, and their reward will be eternal in Heaven.
Voting against their interest? No, they are voting in their eternal interests, so what does it matter if they endure poverty, violence, sickness, famine and the destruction of our biome in this life? 'Tis but a moment before the beauty they have earned in the Here After brother!
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 5 weeks ago
also the usa has never had a true left to begin with, being the most right wing of the western countries should be telling.
Katana314@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Perfect example of this was Jimmy Kimmel. He openly said that shooting a commentator was a horrible thing, and tried to call for moderation. MAGA declared that wasn’t enough, and ordered him fired.
They have specified that if you’re not with them, you’re against them.
Canconda@lemmy.ca 5 weeks ago
Kimmel got fired for pointing the spotlight back at Trump and Epstein. Had nothing to do with Kirk.
GreenShimada@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Doesn’t directly bringing up “enlightened centrism” (I assume sarcastically) from a non-right position indicate disdain for centrism? That would be a conflict between whatever you are and both centrists (for not being where you are - right of you, but to them, still left of the Right) and the Right.
Also, if you’re aware of the Three Percenters and their claim that only 3% of colonial America supported the revolution, it means that even if they’re off by a factor of 10, with 30% for the revolution, and 30% against, it leaves 40%, a plurality of people, who have the sentiment from this meme where they just want to be left alone and not forced against their will into a conflict that indroduces instability and violence to their lives.
Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
“Enlightened centrism” is not the same as centrism and yes that label is meant to be sarcastic. There are basically two kinds of enlightened centrists. One are right-wingers who want to avoid the social stigma of being far right. The other one are people who close their eyes to the blatant attempt by the right wing to destroy democracy and pretend everything is normal. That’s what basically the corporate media are doing.
chuckleslord@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Letter from Birmingham Jail, MLK Jr.