Juice
@Juice@midwest.social
- Comment on Funny this never made it into a James Taylor song 1 week ago:
I see lots of references to John Denver, Country Roads, but I present:
“Bye, bye Miss Bologna Pie”
- Comment on imagine 2 weeks ago:
GMO skepticism or not, Monsanto is one of the most evil companies in the world and a perfect example of what makes the profit motive such an inefficient organizer of production and distribution
- Comment on Electoral politics doesn't get the job done 2 weeks ago:
Get organized with a progressive or socialist organization. DSA, PSL, or just you and some homes. If you’re completely isolated, an org like DSA is good because they have a lot of “at large” members that aren’t in formal chapters, but at large members have access to national resources too (not in day 1, its a political org, but DSA is good for at large membership). But the people who seem “the most organized” in your area, who have good politics and active membership, is the best org for you to join since these things can vary drastically from place to place.
From there, get involved in local labor organizing, your group might even have like a labor group that focuses on it.
If you live in a place where you can get a job that is a part of UAW Union, you can try to get it and “salt”, which means adding radical militant labor organizers to existing stagnant or bureaucratic unions, and start mobilization campaigns.
A pretty easy thing that would be super helpful, would be to fundraise for materials to create “strike-ready” kits, basically 5 gal bucket and lid full of supplies for an extended period, since strikes are long, difficult, protracted affairs. People get hungry, they get cold and wet, etc., mutual aid has a very low barrier to entry. I’m not a mutual aidist, but its something you could start basically today and have a bunch ready by that time.
If you can, don’t go alone, bring like minded people in or find like minded people. The best individual thing you can do is to educate yourself so when the time comes you can educate others. Read! Class Struggle Unionism is a classic, but there are probably books about UAW specifically. Another favorite of mine is “Teamster’s Rebellion” if you can find it
- Comment on Don't forget where we came from and what shaped us as a species. The Jungle. 3 weeks ago:
Wait that isn’t what I meant at all, I was contrasting the “return to nature” view with the vegan view.
- Comment on Don't forget where we came from and what shaped us as a species. The Jungle. 3 weeks ago:
Where we came from is less important than where we are going. The problems with veganism are not that they don’t eat animals, in fact I don’t think the problem is with veganism at all but with moral imperatives in general that promote black and white, oppositional political positioning. But moral imperatives are one of the most popular and effective rhetorical methods to make a point (and split opposition) so we are just kind of raised in it. If you’re someone who has strong opinions you learn to express them in a certain way.
But veganism is good and primitivist “return to nature” types have a dubious track record aka they tend to be chuds or on their way to chuddening. “Retvrn to the past” is a conservative talking point, but what separates us from nature is capitalism, not veganism.
- Comment on You wouldn't even need to stop going to work! 3 weeks ago:
I mean I guess as a Marxist there are just some things we have fundamentally different understandings? The way you talk about consumerism and alienation, is fundamentally opposed to a Marxist’s definition. To a Marxist alienation isn’t subjective, it is material; a result of workers slavish relation to commodity production, as the relation that generates surplus value.
But I’m trying to back off of explicitly anarchist critiques, and kind of begrudgingly think about your basic conceptions. I’ve spent enough time around anarchists and Marxists to know that there’s something sort of broken there, broken by history. And I know enough about anarchists, who kind of effortlessly organize circles around us, and the history of anarchism as it relates to various socialist projects of the 20th century, than to do what many of my comrades do, and just like quote “On Authority” to y’all as if it has ever made a lick of difference. I guess to put it plainly: I can understand why an anarchist wouldn’t necessarily be all for a Marxist or Leninist conception of revolution, might advocate for a measure of caution and search for a “third way”. I won’t be convinced that money is anything other than a mechanism of class oppression, and the value form itself is actually a tremendous mind fuck, accounting for the alienation that workers experience.
What I think I really don’t understand, is the anarchist conception of the individual, like, in a scientific way. There’s something “in the sauce” that I can’t account for in our analysis, something that overlaps with a great deal of the working class. But if we are comrades in sharing and binding ourselves to the struggles of workers then that’s basically what’s most important. And demanding that you adhere to “correct” theoretical analysis when there is something I dont understand about like one of anarchism’s fundamental concepts, something that seems to be very “right” that comes from your tradition, something that I can’t just dismiss as “petty bourgeois” or liberal.
So more power to ya, friend. I’d love to read anything you come out with.
- Comment on You wouldn't even need to stop going to work! 3 weeks ago:
You had me till your last sentence which I think is reformist, but since you stated your position so well im sure we could (hypothetically) work together in coalition.
I think its clear that there is a great deal of consumerism that exists in excess of peoples needs, but without a means to replace it with anything, since the consumerism is an expression of people’s social alienation, then there’s no material incentive for people to make these changes. It seems like the thrust of your ideas would work well along side certain anarchist and social libertarian ideas of dual power, which I think is also worth of criticisms but also is a step closer theoretically to a correct formula for change.
Confusion about the government’s role in class oppression, unawareness of what money is and how it operates, these are big questions that took me a long time to find sufficient and satisfying answers for them. If your like to share your zones or writings I’d at least give them a look! I read and contribute political and economic articles to some zines too, and frankly I’m just a fan of the form. I’m a bit older and diy zines were the first polisci I ever encountered, and now I’m a smelly commie, on watchlists and everything
- Comment on You wouldn't even need to stop going to work! 3 weeks ago:
You wont weaken the government by not paying biills. We don’t want a weaker state we want to smash the state and create a new one for and by workers not billionaires. How does weakening the government weaken their power? Right now the government is weaker than its been in 70 years and the billionaires are more powerful than ever.
I agree that a united, militant workers movement will weaken various structures that the rich use to reinforce their rule, including parts of the government but I think you need to develop your view of the state under capitalism because you still subscribe yo many false illusions. Its like people saying Luigi is going to tip the balance in class relations for the workers. Its just a kind of reformism or false.co sciousness that hopes that there is a step before what is necessary that would be good enough.
Like organize bill ass payment strikes, I think strategically, like in healthcare, a mass movement could shake some things up, but likely it would just result in increased violence against the movement. Individuals not paying bills will literally not do shit. Individual action is basically worthless. In order for it to reach a critical tipping point, where a quantity of individual action transforms into change in political or economic quality, will take a lot of organization. And more power to you! Organize it and I’ll likely join. I’ll throw you a bone, but you have to provide the meat. Personally it’s not what I think is going to lead to greater worker consciousness and emancipation, but I’m just some guy. Organize it and prove me wrong.
- Comment on You wouldn't even need to stop going to work! 3 weeks ago:
What would crippling the government do other than massively harm regular people? Fight the real enemy
- Comment on You wouldn't even need to stop going to work! 3 weeks ago:
I’m all for an organized, mass bill payment “strike” and some businesses would be effected, though not really any very large companies, who would benefit the most from having their competitors go out of business (and forced to sell or merge their assets for a fraction of their value) than we would by saving $100-200 per month, which we would spend, corporations would raise prices, and all of that money just flows back to the banks anyway.
Now tenant organizing and rent strikes, that’s where you can actually fuck shit up and make demands many times. But like your gas company doesn’t give I shit, you just won’t have heat, fuck you.
It would be nice if this was true but it still based on the illusion of a free market
- Comment on Amish virus 3 weeks ago:
The last time my wife and I went through Amish country, I saw a sign stapled high on a telephone pole, written with marker on pink poster board that said like “Yoder’s website design” and the number to call to presumably ask Yoder to make you a website.
People may not be familiar with Amish country, but there are tons of like construction companies, cabinet shops, etc., because people out here really like Amish made carpentry, so there’s lots of little businesses set up. Yoder is an Amish/Mennonite name, so I can imagine some young Mennonite guy selling like basic HTML/ CSS or like WordPress sites to all these little businesses that probably want a website but don’t use the internet themselves.
Or who knows maybe their web design is as good as their carpentry?
- Comment on Does the US really have no instruments in case a newly elected president immediatelly and openly exposes he's a nazi? 4 weeks ago:
Did you just throw communism under the bus to promote Marxism? Bravo BTW, I’ll probably steal your last paragraph
- Comment on Does the US really have no instruments in case a newly elected president immediatelly and openly exposes he's a nazi? 4 weeks ago:
The state is the historical apparatus that manages the inherent contradictions between classes. It administrates capitalism for and by the ruling class.
Capitalism is a form of class domination, various forms of slavery stitched together to exploit the masses for the benefit of the few. Only a democratically organized working class can “fix” capitalism, by eradicating it. The government is the apparatus that temporarily fixes the contradictions of capitalism, but the relations defined by this irrational, inefficient social system (unless you consider monopolies efficient) are what state governments under capitalist rule try and eventually fail to “mitigate”. The contradictions compile until you have an economic crash, which is actually good for monopolistic capitalists who can purchase productive capital at a fraction of the cost while the rest of the population suffers recession, inflation, and mass indignity.
The poor exist because there are rich. The capitalists are in control, as a class, and governments merely mitigate the worst tendencies. This is why reformism isn’t a long term strategy. Capitalism can’t be reformed, it can only be replaced.
And if we, the working class will be able to replace it with a system of greater democracy, then the aims of socialism will have been reached without the “authoritarian” tendencies becoming reified in any significant way.
You can have your doubts about this, but your libertarian perspective is one of false appearances. If you want to understand the state and the economy, it must be considered as a series of relations brought about by human activity, using the tools laid before us by history and nature. If you think of the world like this, considering the subjective nature of politics and the economy, such as incentives, motives, etc., then your investigation will uncover the true relations that comprise this mass wage slavery to the billionaire class, known as capital.
- Comment on Does the US really have no instruments in case a newly elected president immediatelly and openly exposes he's a nazi? 4 weeks ago:
In 1776, people didn’t know what fascism was. Hell there wasnt iven consensus on what vapitalism was, Wealth of Nations was published that same year. They had never seen a capitalist system degenerate, as would happen in France under Louis Napoleon in the 1850s.
They knew what feudalism was, which was bad and a form of authoritarian autocracy, but this isn’t Fascism. They were afraid that the kings and queens would get restored, as revolutionaries (and capitalism was revolutionary and progressive at that time) they were safeguarding against a counter revolution which would come from monarchists.
There is no way they could conceive of a movement to overthrow capitalism, which they barely understood although being the revolutionary capitalist class, that would come from a greater demand of social reforms, one where the class they were a part of would rule society rather than just administer it as they had for centuries, one where a class that they didn’t even know about, the proletarian working class, would supplant them and bring greater prosperity and equality. This movement developed fully in Russia and Europe after the first world war when the last of the weakened feudal aristocracy destroyed their own continent to fight over scraps of colonial internationalism. A revolution in Russia inspired the global working class, especially where they were highly organized and industrialized such as Italy and Germany, and terrified the ruling capitalist classes of those countries.
In the shadow of the emerging workers movement grew the dialectical opposite and evil twin of German and Italian communism: Fascism. Fascists gleefully fight and kill communists, and desire power above all else, exploiting contradictions in liberal democracy (that’s “liberal” meaning supports private property, not cool liberals that like freedom and justice) to confuse the masses and gain power. The ruling classes, weakened by decades of militant worker struggles, assented to the will of the fascists and in a last ditch effort to preserve their dwindling control, handed power over to them. The rest is history.
The founders couldn’t conceive of the conditions you describe as they either didn’t exist or wouldnt be developed enough to study for 50-70 years. Not all forms of authoritarianism are the same. They thought they were doing away with their version of it. Besides, the “founding fathers” gags violently would have fucking loved Trump
- Comment on Disney sued for $10billion over Moana 2 5 weeks ago:
- Comment on Disney sued for $10billion over Moana 2 5 weeks ago:
I feel like this thread is full of Disney lawyers trying out arguments to help them prep
- Comment on What's the endgame when the rich have all the money? 1 month ago:
They have to keep a lot of it circulating. As it zips around the economy, it is used to purchase capital, which soaks up the value of workers labor power by converting it into commodities, sells those commodities on a market for a higher price, and then returns profit to the “owners” of the capital.
Capitalism isn’t neutral, the system creates the rich and poor and delivers the value of worker labor power to the rich owners. The rich can’t control it any more than we can. They have their hand on the wheel through the state, which is just a mechanism that solves problems created by capitalism that can’t be exploited for profits, to violence. But they’re as ensnared by the system as we are. It robs them of their humanity the same it does ours.
We don’t overthrow capitalism to punish the rich, we do it to save everyone from it, and try to restore peoples humanity. The greed of the rich almost doesn’t matter, the system has a logic all its own.
The social system similar to what you describe, which is basically feudalism of nobles and serfs, has its own rules and arose out of its own conditions, like capitalism arose from the revolutionary overthrow of feudalism. Maybe capitalism will give way to some worse form of social relation, I suspect many people are working on that as we speak. But that’s why we have to fight and win for a better system
Socialism or barbarism!
- Comment on Anon's PC works 1 month ago:
I buy old electronics for 1/10 of what new stuff costs, install Linux or Foss os, keep it for years without problems until hard drive goes
I don’t game on PC but neither do a lot of people who pay $2500 for a laptop, people who inevitably call me for tech help for basic shit.
What’s the point? I’d rather have the commons than like a mountain of consumer goods that all suck and are getting worse.
- Comment on Communism 1 month ago:
For Marxists, the state is the institution that tries to resolve, with violence, the contradictions that are inherent within class society. So when class society no longer exists, then violence is no longer necessary, hence the state is no longer necessary, hence “withering away”.
This isn’t an all or nothing situation, just a theory. The laws of uneven and combined development indicate that this withering would happen in different ways at different rates. this process wouldn’t even begin until the whole world has become some form of socialism, and the social relations governing society would be much progressed. Its hard to imagine how this would work compared to our current situation
- Comment on Communism 1 month ago:
I disagree, but I appreciate you walking back the anticommunism. Paul LeBlanc covers about every argument for Lenin’s “opportunism” in great detail, I would recommend Lenin and the Revolutionary Party for a good description of Leninism before 1921. If you mean Leninism like “Foundations of Leninism” then yeah I’ll join you in calling Stalin an opportunist. But not even Paul Averich, anarchist critic of the Bolsheviks and historian, was willing to lay the authoritarianism of the USSR at the feet of Lenin. But I don’t want to legislate the tragedies of 20th century socialism. I’ll study it, but there’s plenty of reasons to be skeptical.
I recently read a couple books by Cyril Smith who is pretty negative toward Lenin, and while I don’t really buy his premise, I think his emphasis on what was missing (an analysis on “sensuous human activity,” like in Theses on Feuerbach) from the Plekhanov-Leninist tendency of Marxism holds water.
- Comment on Communism 1 month ago:
If you want to discuss the history of the Russian revolution, I saved but didn’t post several paragraphs, but deleted them for the sake of brevity. Flattening the whole 100 years of Russian “socialist” history to highlight it’s worst abuses is just as intellectually lazy as flattening it to only highlight the best parts of it. I’m not going to apologise for Kronstadt or anything that came after, but the civil war period was horrible. And had the Bolsheviks not taken power, Kornilov or Kerensky would have, and instituted far more brutal oppression; if not just tried to restore the Tzar.
The organizing principles of the Bolsheviks and RSDLP should absolutely be studied leading up to Oct 1917, as well as Rosa Luxemburg, and Anton Pannekoek’s criticisms of Lenin.
But saying “firing squad” doesnt prove that communism leads to authoritarianism, although it references a time in history that was very brutal and oppressive. However, Its not as good of a criticism as you are capable of. I’m used to having discussions with people who probably aren’t critical enough of the Bolsheviks, so its refreshing to hear from you, in a way.
- Comment on Communism 1 month ago:
Communism is the struggle for a moneyless, stateless, classless society.
There’s no connection between a supposed ideology of communism, and authoritarianism. The “authoritarianism” arose as a result of material circumstances, not ideology. I’ve looked into the histories a lot and its very complicated. Not like you wouldn’t understand it, just that it can’t be reduced to a simple truism, cant be made succinct.
Let’s just say that the capitalists who hoard all the wealth and do nothing to earn millions and billions, who own the media and for whose benefit the state represents, aren’t too keen on movements that sometimes overthrow them. So it’s in their interests to paint socialism and communism in as bad a light as possible.
- Comment on USA Air Force issues new guide regarding acceptable phrases to be used when on duty 1 month ago:
Your great great grandmother cheated on your great great grandfather with this joke. So fucking old
- Comment on Hypothetically, if some mysterious force started to jam every radio frequency, how would modern day society adapt to this? 1 month ago:
At what point does an EM jamming signal just become electricity running through the wires? That’s what would happen in a so called Harrington event, right?
- Comment on Well, I guess that settles it 2 months ago:
Publish this everywhere to get musk dumped on day 1
- Comment on Pretty interesting when you really think about it. 2 months ago:
Yeah its been interesting to see the development of the BRICS coalition as a counter to US trade hegemony. It makes one optimistic, but there’s still so much uncertainty. Venezuela’s economy is imploding due to some amount of mismanagement by Maduro’s admin, and not diversifying their economy like 10-15 years ago. And some very recent and concerning chatter coming from international contacts who would be fairly in the know and historically over optimistic about the tenacity of the Cuban revolution, are signalling that the Cuban government is extremely close to collapse (although we’ve been hearing the same from bourgeois media for 60 years, so its kind of hard to swallow.) Columbia is more social democratic than it has been in decades, Argentina is more exploited, Brazil is doing a wild flip from one extreme right wing president to a moderately progressive labor president. And developments on the African continent such as trans-national coalitions are reclaiming the Sahel. The US lost much of its ideological lustre it enjoyed during the cold war, but it makes up for that with naked violence. Our flagging superpower is still like historically the most powerful force in history, even as the international ruling class strips every last stick of profit out of our deeply paralyzed and ineffective political system. And our brainworms are still our #1 cultural export.
Its gonna be a crazy ass decade
- Comment on Pretty interesting when you really think about it. 2 months ago:
Well… some capital. Don’t try to order anything from Cuba or Venezuela or Russia and expect it on your doorstep any time soon.
This is a pretty interesting exception. The reason why Cuban or Venezuelan or Russian capital isn’t very available internationally is because of embargoes. These embargoes and sanctions operate for the benefit of western imperialism, itself just another form of capitalism.
So the reason why national capital isn’t available to international capital is because international capital prevents it from being available. Compare this to many post-colonial African and south american nations. The ones that towed the line of western imperialism, who politically nurtured a national ruling class to benefit and oversee the exploitation of the vast majority of their population in order to provide cheap labor and commodities, have “open” economies. Countries that attempt to provide for the social welfare of the masses (Cuba, Venezuela) or countries who pursue their own internationalist, “imperialist” agendas counter to the western consensus (current Russia) face embargo and sanction.
This is not to deflect any and all criticism from Cuba, Venezuela or historic Soviet Russia. It is an interesting condition to think about.
- Comment on Pretty interesting when you really think about it. 2 months ago:
I really wanna read that book, maybe this year :) I almost stole it from my wife’s cousin at Thanksgiving this year
I don’t think what you’re saying contradicts me, I agree my explainer is one view, one which addresses political economies, and the GrabGrow view is another more anthropological view. Unfortunately Marx never finished his anthropological works although there are a lot of notes from the end of his life that are worth parsing.
Saying it’s this one thing, when it can be scientifically understood as either or both things, is more like orthodoxy which I try to avoid. Both views help to understand a complicated topic made of historically shifting dynamics and changing aspects.
What your explanation doesn’t address that mine does, is what is the “social power” that congeals into these forms? It takes different shapes throughout history, but can be understood coarsely as “wealth”, which is the accumulated value of human labor. My explanation better reflects the class character of the state. However if we are to try and actually affect the world for the better, as we should, we would be better equipped with both views (and likely a few others) with which to determine truth in the functioning of political economy, than one or the other alone.
- Comment on Reading into something that is said 2 months ago:
Wealth is pinned to production and currency is pinned to wealth. You fundamentally misunderstand what wealth, money, and power are and how they function in society. Alienation from society and idealism distort the nature of these subjects. You’re right to question the way these things function, but you’ll not get much further than MMT or other idealist cul du sacs. If you want to understand how wealth operates as a basis for society, they you’ll need to start to study https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/wage-labour/.
- Comment on Pretty interesting when you really think about it. 2 months ago:
The state is formed by the historical mode of production, its like a contradiction that is the resolution to all of the other contradictions present in market social relations. In other words the state is based on how stuff gets made, and who accumulates the value inherent in the stuff, which is in essence the congealed work that went into making that stuff.
Politics and culture is always a factor in what shape the state takes, since politics and culture are social structures and sources of power themselves, bug politics is downstream from production
