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nooo my genderinos
Submitted 2 weeks ago by fossilesque@mander.xyz to science_memes@mander.xyz
https://mander.xyz/pictrs/image/7d3a2d0d-03de-4734-b9b5-f9aa4aacd49a.png
Comments
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
skisnow@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
A lot of problems in the world can be attributed to people who think “if I don’t understand something, it must be because the experts saying it are all wrong”.
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Spot on
serenissi@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
though the meme is cool, gender isn’t particularly a biology (or ‘advance biology’) thing. biology deals with sexes, their expressions and functionalities. gender is more of a personal and social concept but often related to sex characteristics (cis).
and yes, advanced biology tells sex determination isn’t as easy as XX or XY or even looking at genitals like a creep.
and oh, for giggles consider fungi :)
oyfrog@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Adding to this: XX and XY works for mammals, but not for other vertebrates (fish, birds, reptiles, amphibians). Birds and reptiles have Z and W chromosomes, and unlike in mammals where females are homozygotes, males in these groups are homozygotes. Some reptiles have temperature dependent sex determination, where ambient temperature above some value will produce males or females (depends on species). Some reptiles are composed entirely of females.
Some fish will straight up change sexes depending on age and male-female ratio in a social group.
In other groups it’s not even different chromosomes but simply copy number of specific genes.
Plants can do all sorts of whacky things like produce seeds and pollen in the same individual.
Fungi are an entirely different cluster fuck because they have mating types which are not simple binaries.
Eukaryotic sex determination isn’t a binary and it isn’t even a nicely categorizable spectrum. It’s a grab-bag of whatever doesn’t perma-fuck your genome.
Source: me, I’m a biologist. Though admittedly I work on animals so my understanding of fungi and plant stuff is fuzzy at best.
squaresinger@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
And bee queen generate full-animal-sized flying sperm, aka drones.
AdrianTheFrog@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I would say gender is probably centered about around psychology, ranges mostly from sociology to biology, with a just little bit going into chemistry
maybe like
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today 2 weeks ago
Slime mold(which is not a mold or fungi) looks around nervously in it’s 13 different sexes.
jsomae@lemmy.ml 2 weeks ago
I don’t entirely agree, because gender identity is known to be at least partially biological, e.g. there are correlations between transgenderism, skin elasticity, and hyper-flexibility.
dandelion@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
just FYI, “transgenderism” is a word to avoid
and yes, gender identity seems to be biological, and genetic.
icelimit@lemmy.ml 2 weeks ago
What kind of fungi should I consider for the maximum giggles?
TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
plenty of animals can gender swap, be hermaphrodites, or produce asexually.
joyjoy@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Psychology is technically a branch of advanced biology
Bennyboybumberchums@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
But it easy, we just make it complicated with social bullshit and attention craving. The fact that no one is exactly set to be perfect copies, doesnt mean anything. The fact that outliers exist, doesnt mean anything. You ask the owner of a dog if its a boy or a girl, they will tell you. And you wanna know how they know? They looked between its legs. It really is, that easy.
The kind of logic being pushed today, is basically saying that you cant class human beings as a bipedal species because 200 per million people are born with no legs. Which is dumb as fuck.
Lyrl@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
I think things get taken too far in some contexts, but the underlying sensitivity is when you are talking to a person who considers themselves an outlier. Like telling someone with no legs that they don’t meet the definition of human and ADA is an abomination that should be repealed. Or telling someone diagnosed with conversion disorder that they can’t receive any physical accommodations, and can’t have any medical consults to check if their symptoms might have a different cause. I hope we can agree those would be insensitive positions to take.
CarbonIceDragon@pawb.social 2 weeks ago
A genderino sounds more like something you’d find in particle physics than biology anyway
BartyDeCanter@lemmy.sdf.org 2 weeks ago
Considering the names of the types of quarks, I recommend renaming them genderinos.
KSPAtlas@sopuli.xyz 2 weeks ago
finally, we found what genderfluid is made from
Una@europe.pub 2 weeks ago
Physicists are freaky, like who was out there going and asking quarks what is their power dynamic in sex?
jimmux@programming.dev 2 weeks ago
“I’m a charm in the streets, and a strange in the sheets.”
gaybriel_fr_br@jlai.lu 2 weeks ago
Right alongside gender fluid.
UnpledgedCatnapTipper@piefed.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
It also kinda sounds like a Pokémon!
affiliate@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
i think that if more people were exposed to advanced math there would be a reactionary trend of people going around and asking mathematicians “what is a number?”
dandelion@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
sort of like the reactionary trend of pulling your kids out of school because Common Core is putting emphasis on teaching math in conceptual ways rather than just by rote memorization?
Droggelbecher@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I’m shocked that the US only adopted this in 2009. I’m pretty sure my mum, who went to primary school in the 70s, recognized number lines when I was taught to use them on 2005ish. I’m having a hard time imagining how else you’d explain it.
Squirrelanna@lemmynsfw.com 2 weeks ago
So, I understand that the number line is a way to conceptualize relational distances between numbers, but in that example I’m struggling to see the relation between 57 where the line ends and 111, the answer. If you have insight, do you mind elaborating?
ricecake@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I believe that’s what happens anytime they say that we probably shouldn’t focus on memorizing a multiplication table, or try to teach anything in a way that puts more focus on understanding how numbers work than on symbolic memorization.
And that’s like… Elementary school.GorGor@startrek.website 2 weeks ago
The whole new math everyone was complaining about is trying to do this. Granted teachers are human and flawed so sometimes it has not been implemented well, but it is aimed in the right direction.
I am absolutely going to start responding to questions / statements about gender with this concept though.
“There are only two genders”
“Yeah, and there are only 3 states of matter! These woke scientists with their DEI alphabet soup of mattet B-E Condensates, and QSL, and DEGERATE MATTER! Its suck intell you”
TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
have you taught?
anytime you give people a new metaphorical hammer, they want to go around banging everything they can with it. then they get bored and forget about it.
x0x7@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
There is a slight difference though in that complex numbers are a part of math but gender isn’t really a part of biology.
monotremata@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Also the mathematicians wouldn’t decline to give an answer.
Are you sure? I only minored in math, but even I would struggle to provide an answer to this. It would have to be something incredibly vague, like “a number is a mathematical object that has certain properties that has certain consistent properties relevant to the field of study.” Because otherwise you get situations like “is infinity a number?” and you can’t answer categorically, because usually it’s not, but then you look at the transfinite numbers where you can indeed have omega-plus-one as a number. And someone asks if you can have an infinite number of digits to the left of the decimal place, and you say “well, not in the reals, but there are the P-adic numbers…” and folks ask if you can have an infinitely small number and you say “well, in the reals you can only have an arbitrarily small number, but in game theory there are the surreal numbers, where…”
So yeah, I’m not sure “what is a number” is even a math question. It’s more a philosophy question, or sometimes a cognitive science question (like Lakoff and Nuñez’s “Where Mathematics Comes From”).
Jason2357@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Gender isn’t part of biology (as a social construct) but the complexity of sex absolutely is.
homura1650@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I was going to make a comment about surreal numbers not being numbers. But I did a bit of fact checking and it looks like all of the values I was objecting to are not considered surreal numbers, but rather pseudo numbers.
I find this outrageous. Why can’t ↑ be a number? What even is a number that would exclude it and leave in all of your so-called numbers?
Inucune@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
IzzyJ@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Can confirm. I was already struggling. But I just straight up refused to math with i
Siethron@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Advanced mathematicians see a numeric digit and ask “what’s that?”
szczuroarturo@programming.dev 2 weeks ago
Ehh not really its just to old if a concept for us to be appaled by that. Its not 15 century for imaginary numbers to cause riots.
ZoteTheMighty@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
I’m a career physicist, and I honestly have no idea what a state of matter is anymore.
la508@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Can I offer you a nice smectic B3 liquid crystal in this trying time?
MycelialMass@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
You may not.
axont@hexbear.net 2 weeks ago
yeah i have a bachelor’s in chemistry and I remember a professor earnestly saying the phrase “metallic phase nitrogen” and I think I went home and stared at the ceiling for an hour
MonkderVierte@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Loads of pressure? Even Quarks get metallic with more pressure.
outhouseperilous@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
An abstraction used for grouping kinds of things together for the purposes of making thinking about them a lot faster.
nova_ad_vitum@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
I would wager you have more of an idea of what a state of matter is than biologists do of what a species is. Humans like to put things into nest boxes but nature is under no deal obligation to cooperate.
ricecake@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I’d actually argue the opposite. With states of matter, we’re attempting to delineate how reality groups together sets of related properties that vary between conditions in similar ways for different substances.
Looking for the edges that nature drew.With species though, we drew the lines. We drew them with a mind towards ensuring it’s objectively measurable but it’s still not a natural delineation. Taxonomists (biologists are actually a different field) mostly run into uncertainty with debating which categorization property takes precedence, and what observations of species have actually been made.
So while they debate which system to use, the particulars of the systems are pretty concrete.
gjoel@programming.dev 2 weeks ago
Honestly, people would probably object more to advanced math than advanced biology if they were exposed as much to it. Or basic math. Or elementary math…
Rozz@lemmy.sdf.org 2 weeks ago
If certain people could almost understand they would be very upset
undergroundoverground@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
So true and it’s a great to remind them of that sort of thing.
You know, you’d think all of the people who say it’s purely down to genetics would be natural allies with, you know, molecular biologists (applied genetics). They’d be all like “it’s a Y chromosome or nothing” and the biologists would be all like “yeah chromosomes!” because we fucking love chromosomes but no. In fact, it’s noticeably absent when you start to think about it.
I wonder why that might be?
The short answer is “because it’s infinitely more complicated than that.”
Just because you carry the genetic code for anything at all, it doesn’t mean you’ll express it. The default setting for our DNA is off. So, if something isn’t telling it to transcribe, it won’t do it. A whole load of reasons could cause that, even before we get to mutations and partial expression or chimeras etc.
Anyway, what i mean is yeah, this meme!
SoftestSapphic@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Bigot: “trans people aren’t natrual according to science!!”
Scientist: “we’ve learned that trans people are natrual and this has helped us broaden our understanding of gender and human psychology”
Bigot: "stfu!! >:c
k4gie@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Do the two tails left of M and right of F mean there are males more male than cis males, and similarly with females?
m8052@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Sqrt(-1) is still wrong tho. I’m commuting a sin by writting it. Correct expression is i^2=-1
panda_abyss@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
The problem is those morons haven’t taken any of the advanced classes and probably got D’s in the basic ones.
Bronstein_Tardigrade@lemmygrad.ml 2 weeks ago
Always wear your glasses. Sans glasses, I read the Advanced Math panel saying the square root of -1=1, and thought, “that’s doesn’t sound right.”
Katrisia@lemmy.today 2 weeks ago
Advanced whatever will always lead to philosophy, and there are no definitive answers there or elsewhere. You can debate the meaning of a state of matter, of gender, of life, of number, etc. (That’s why there is philosophy of physics, biology, mathematics, chemistry…). So I don’t think that’s the point.
Yes, both sex and gender get complex, but the answer to conservatism isn’t to say that advanced science has it all figured out because that would be a lie. They’ll ask us to demonstrate ontological categories that we cannot demostrate through science. It might be true sometimes the: “you are conservative because you rely on basic science, and progressivism and other leftists ideas lie on advanced science”, but ultimately, the debate is open and we need to be careful not to bluff about science being on our side because science has its limits.
Philosophy is the final battleground, and in there we do have strong arguments, but still, I feel this “smarter than thou” attitude is not it.
SanndyTheManndy@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
It is well known that the sex chromosome exists in a superposition of X and Y chromosomes, after all.
Ricochet@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
From ChatGPT: “So, biologically there are mostly two (with natural variations like intersex), but socially and culturally, there are multiple genders depending on how people understand and express themselves.”
ch00f@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
When Newton worked out the laws of motion, he figured they had to be correct because they were so simple and elegant.
He had no idea that relativity was going to come in and fuck his shit up.
chiliedogg@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
And then there was quantum.
elvith@feddit.org 2 weeks ago
Do you have any idea how fast you were going?
No officer, but I can tell you exactly where I am!
panda_abyss@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Which is also simple and elegant
ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
“Noooooooooo!” -Albert Einstein
LodeMike@lemmy.today 2 weeks ago
TBF the laws of motion are still correct.
lime@feddit.nu 2 weeks ago
it’s not that they are “correct”, it’s that they are a close enough approximation to work well enough at the scale they’re used. it’s not like the universe runs on math.
NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 2 weeks ago
I mean relativity is elegant enough in its own right; it's just Newton's laws plus the constancy of the speed of light and the equivalence principle. These two additions are enough to make everything an order of magnitude more fucked up, but that's math's fault, not relativity.
ch00f@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
now do quantum
cheese_greater@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
He definitely miscalculused the turntables…
TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
relativity only applies at large scales and quantum at small scales.
ch00f@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The point is that he just assumed there was nothing more to know. And he was wrong (tho I’m not gonna knock the dude who invented calculus too hard).
The comic is trying to point out that bigotry is generally born out of a lack of curiosity.
ricecake@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
“applies” isn’t the word I would use. It’s not like nature has a line that once you pass some threshold of mass, acceleration or distance it needs to flip the relativity switch.
Probably say “becomes noticable”.