Money doesn’t buy happiness.
What it does is eliminate and prevent most causes of human unhappiness, and practically all unhappiness based in meeting basic human needs.
I'm not asking to be rich.
Submitted 1 year ago by FlyingSquid@lemmy.world to workreform@lemmy.world
https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/47c38023-7a23-4102-b6dd-29e9f1bad522.png
Comments
AllonzeeLV@lemmy.world 1 year ago
lanolinoil@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I think this assumes there is some universal scale for suffering though – Like, if you aren’t physically tortured (or whatever you think worse suffering than you’ve had would be) does that mean you suffer internally less than those that have?
I feel it’s more some internal scale created on your experiences. I wonder if there’s any studies on people suffering objectively vs subjectively.
sweetdude@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Yes it does. I would be extremely happy if I owned 100 acres of land, owned an indoor pool, hot tub, insert whatever thing you want. Seems to me like money would LITERALLY buy me happiness.
13esq@lemmy.world 1 year ago
For me you’re not quite right.
I own a nice house with a big garden and a decent car. And whilst I’m happy that I don’t have to spend money on subsidising a landlord or have to rely on public transport it’s not the owning of the assets that bring me joy within itself.
I’m at the point where a bigger house or a better car would absolutely not make me happier, they might be nice, but that’s it.
Money only brings happiness as much as it can reduce the causes of stress in your life. Thinking “when I can buy that, I’ll finally be happy” is a dangerous mindset, because unless you’re Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos, there’s always going to be someone that has bigger and better things than you.
AllonzeeLV@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Having what you want is nice, but it doesn’t replace connection.
I say, this as someone who can’t afford what they want and sometimes even need. Having enough money is the hardest checkbox to happiness, but material possession alone isn’t the only ingredient unless you’re truly a clinical sociopath.
The joy of stuff is incredibly fleeting.
BigBlackCockroach@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Freeganism: Are we a joke to you? 😂🤣😅
UrPartnerInCrime@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Money doesn’t buy happiness, it buys away the unhappy
yote_zip@pawb.social 1 year ago
I used to be on medication for depression until I got a high-paying job. Turns out being poor was the root to most problems in my life.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 1 year ago
It’s expensive to be poor. That makes things very depressing indeed.
TWeaK@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Is that the Terry Pratchett boot thing? I’ll be disappointed if that isn’t mentioned.
Pistcow@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Same friend! Constant panic attacks that send me to the ER which would leave me with a giant bill. Making 3x my former income and life is good and got off all the meds. Money solves a shitload of problems.
FinallyDebunked@slrpnk.net 1 year ago
Is it sarcasm?
yote_zip@pawb.social 1 year ago
Actually not sarcasm. I literally was on medication and then I got a good job and I don’t need it anymore. I’m mildly sure I still have depression but I’m much happier in my life and nowhere near risk of self-harm anymore.
kaffiene@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Money does not buy happiness. But poverty sure causes a lot of misery.
Nobsi@feddit.de 1 year ago
Money does buy happiness. A lot of happiness. I am happy as fuck.
heavy@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
You ever been so happy you had to say it out loud so everyone knows? Lol
Squirrel@thelemmy.club 1 year ago
Money may not buy happiness, but it certainly reduces suffering.
sloppy_diffuser@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Money maximizes the opportunity for happiness.
Someasy@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Getting it as a tattoo on my ass.
Squirrel@thelemmy.club 1 year ago
Oh, I like that one.
Not_Alec_Baldwin@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Money can’t buy me happiness, but I’m happiest when I can buy what I want, any time that I want, get high when want…
name_NULL111653@pawb.social 1 year ago
“To live is to suffer; to survive is to find some meaning in that suffering.”
That said: It takes a good deal of money to fund any search, especially enough time to actually contemplate meaning… This, money, to some extent or another, is necessary to truly survive - and the extent of that money greatly contributes to the extent of survival. It does not guarantee survival - but it is required to have the opportunity.
unfreeradical@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Since money of course is just the means of exchange, having it prevents the suffering resulting from deprivation being imposed.
Breve@pawb.social 1 year ago
Relevant study: princeton.edu/…/deaton_kahneman_high_income_impro…
tl;dr: Happiness increases logarithmically with income, leveling off at about $75,000/year (at least in 2010).
Pickle_Jr@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 year ago
That’s about $105k in today’s dollars.
You know, typical middle class income. /s
jaybone@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Lol in some places that’s considered low income.
OwenEverbinde@lemmy.myserv.one 1 year ago
Oh. Just over the median income in America. So literally half the population of the most powerful country in the world is insulated from the problem.
Ummdustry@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
I mean, cost of living is higher than america than other parts of the world and other parts of the world have state-funded security programs that take some of the anxiety away from living.
Here in (western) europe I’d wager at half of people (including me) are insulated from “poverty induced misery”. There are an awful lot of stupidly big and expensive cars on the road.
Am I glad that ~400 million ::: spoiler spoiler (200 mill in north america, 100 mill in europe, 100 mill everywhere else)::: people total live in that state of freedom? Yeah, but it is ever so depressing to think about what a minority of humanity it really is.
maniclucky@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I feel like the mean is rather skewed in the US. It’s almost certainly less than half that are insulated.
maniclucky@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Ummdustry@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
#NO IT’S NOT, THESE ARE TWO DIFFERENT PHENOMINA.
Diminishing returns: My first dollar buys a loaf of bread necessary for my survival, my millionth buys me 0.01% of a sports car.
Hedonic treadmill: Neither my sports car nor loaves of bread seem as wonderous to me after they’ve become a part of my routine.
ohlaph@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I grew up dirt poor. It wasn’t until I worked my way into a better career and now make decent money. Let me yell you, having enough money to cover bills and eat healthier does solve most problems.
Deftdrummer@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Who would have thought it took a little work?
Vampiric_Luma@lemmy.ca 1 year ago
Probably my father who had everything handed to him in his (still objectively shitty) upbringing before kicking me out with nothing and expecting me to flourish because it’s apparently just a matter of putting in some elbow grease.
I’ll just do that with the lack of knowledge they provided me and the lack of skills that the education system gave me.
Thank heavens I’ve met tons of understanding people that provided me the tools and support I needed to uplift myself without money. I can be much more productive to society and the people I love and care about within without having to worry about garbage like money or failing; I can keep getting back up and learn from my mistakes without suddenly going homeless one day.
But no, I was just “lazy”. Still apparently am.
Soulg@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I guess the homeless people working 60+ hours a week are just lazy
13esq@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Yep. Not being constantly petrified of an unexpected bill is a type of happiness!
boatsnhos931@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Please don’t yell at me
Pfnic@feddit.ch 1 year ago
I think the amount of improvement to your life, money brings is on a logarithmic curve. The more you have the less it matters. So it seems logical to take from those where the impact on life is least and give some of it to those it matters most
confusedbytheBasics@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Nah. Money buys physical security. Happiness comes from within.
Oh and everyone should have a fair wage and physical security.
pomodoro_longbreak@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Happiness can be elusive and multidimensional, but money sure gets rid of a lot of daily stress. Like most of it. And when you get rid of stress, that relief can sure feel like happiness by comparison to what you’re used to.
confusedbytheBasics@lemmy.world 1 year ago
100% true. The absence of pain can feel like pleasure for a time. All senses including our emotional sense work by contrast.
Anyone with rich friends knows that money doesn’t buy happiness. I have two friends who retired with $70 million in the bank 10 years ago. They are miserable. They spend money like mad trying to feel happy and it does not work. Meanwhile I work full time and have a fairly good salary for my area and feel happy more often than not.
ChexMax@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Happiness comes from within only after your basic needs are met. I don’t care how Zen and optimistic you are. At a certain point chronic hunger makes it too hard to feel happy.
confusedbytheBasics@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Thanks for agreeing with me. :)
figaro@lemdro.id 1 year ago
And not enough money makes you unhappy, but money does not make you happy.
There’s a study done a while ago that said something to the effect of: do you need at least 50k per year. Up until then, the money increases your ability to be happy. But after that point, it doesn’t make you any more happy.
Happiness comes from being able to take care of your body, mind, and spirit (spirit not in the religious sense, but in a feeling of having purpose and understanding oneself).
Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 year ago
I read it was 70k, even.
Ignisnex@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I would argue it depends where you live, and the cost of living in that place. There isn’t a specific dollar value, but it’s simply the ability to live comfortably and take care of yourself properly. If you made $100k USD/year in one of the more poor countries of the world, you’d be considered fabulously wealthy and could buy pretty much anything you could ever want. That would be well in excess of being able to live comfortably.
adrian783@lemmy.world 1 year ago
inflation
TheDannysaur@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I would love to see more intelligent conversation around this topic.
There’s absolutely rock solid research that money contributes happiness to a point (I think it’s $75k household income per year, but that’s likely outdated now).
Beyond that, it’s not a key differentiator. People take the second half and generalize it, which is incorrect.
Change the narrative. Once people are paid a fair living wage, incremental happiness comes primarily from other places. But until that point, money absolutely brings happiness.
tburkhol@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Excess money may not buy happiness, but lack of money causes a lot of unhappiness.
The study you’re referring to was basically that. There has been some follow-up, including www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2016976118 that suggests any plateau, if one exists, is more like $400-500k. The latter study used continuous sampling via go.trackyourhappiness.org, where the former did retrospective, daily, binary sampling, so they’re not exactly comparable. i.e.: if you ask someone 6 times a day to rate their happiness 1-10 right then, you’re going to get different results than if you ask them whether yesterday was a good day.
There’s a whole weird thing people do where they can be quite satisfied with their life at any particular moment, but dissatisfied when asked about their life overall. I suspect that the $75k plateau is more of the latter, where the lack of plateau is more of the former.
PaupersSerenade@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
A lot of people have brought up the point that money can buy safety and security. I just wanted to refence Maslow’s heirarchy of needs as that solidified my understanding some time ago.
Happiness is a constant struggle, and if your foundation is weak and crumbling the whole pyramid will suffer for it.
Chetzemoka@startrek.website 1 year ago
As a nurse, the reactionary response of anti-vax conservatives to the pandemic really put the lie to Maslow. Human beings absolutely prioritize belonging above their basic survival needs.
unfreeradical@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I think the HoN is useful as a rough guide for how people often feel, think, and act in various conditions.
I doubt it may be useful for a making any firm predictions, or for asserting any unalterable quality of humanity.
rustyriffs@lemmy.world 1 year ago
interesting that ‘belonging and love’ comes before ‘esteem’
AnarchoSnowPlow@midwest.social 1 year ago
It’s not unusual to desire love of family and friends before the respect of the community and colleagues.
Enkrod@feddit.de 1 year ago
Money don’t buy happiness, but no money buys a lot of misery!
MooseBoys@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Yep; money is necessary but not sufficient for happiness. Source: I have money but am miserably depressed.
wrinkletip@feddit.nl 1 year ago
This is exactly it. It doesn’t really buy happiness to a large degree, but it does remove so many problems and worries that you get to spend time on your happiness.
Grizzly_Biscuit@lemmy.world 1 year ago
“Money doesn’t buy happiness” was first coined when people could afford a house with an average income. We’re starving and that one time our grandparents over-ate at a buffet is being shoved down our throats.
Jake_Farm@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
If you are starving, I can suggest several resources.
Grizzly_Biscuit@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I’m curious what’s at the other end of your analogous remark, go on.
Ilflish@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Money can buy you the time to do the things that make you happy
TheSanSabaSongbird@lemdro.id 1 year ago
This has been studied pretty extensively and it turns out that money definitely does buy happiness, but only to a certain point after which you get diminishing returns and eventually no increase in happiness.
It’s been awhile since I’ve looked at the literature, but if memory serves, most people max out on happiness with an upper middle-class income, so probably 3-4 hundred thousand/year for a couple in the US. After that you don’t get any increase in happiness and are actually better off giving any extra money to charities and/or sharing with friends and family.
ShustOne@lemmy.one 1 year ago
Money doesn’t buy happiness but it does remove money related stress.
Regardless everyone should be paid a fair wage and in an ideal world money should not be a concern for day to day life.
blanketswithsmallpox@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Everyone here is just saying money buys happiness with more words than needed lol.
snownyte@kbin.social 1 year ago
I don't want to be filthy rich because I think I'd do a lot of dumb things more than I would doing charitable things.
I just want to be paid enough so it doesn't feel like I look at how little I have left to play around going "eh, I'm okay with this" when I know I'm not okay with this in the back of my mind.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
When I was in college, they were still teaching Maslowe’s Pyramid as textbook knowledge. I’ve since heard people try to walk it back as a flawed model, but…I think it’s a useful concept here.
If you are struggling to meet your biological and safetey needs, you bet your scrotal meat money can buy happiness. Too many people on this earth could have their lives permanently changed for the better with 2,000 American dollars.
On the other hand, the set who scolds the piano tuner to make sure BOTH full grand pianos in the main hall are in tune with each other this time, who legitimately struggle to think of anything else they could actually buy and end up going to restaurants where they pour chocolate sauce on your bare hands for you to lick off as an “experience” genuinely aren’t made happier by addition of cash…they’re operating at the interpersonal and self-actualization levels, and not particularly well because, well…they’re deeply flawed humans whose dads can afford generations of yes men. Nothing can buy these people happiness, especially money.
Tygr@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Not to worry, the goal post on “fair wage” will always be extended. I remember fast food protests for $15/hr. You got it! Only now rent has doubled.
tory@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I buy my groceries without concern for price, my bills are all on auto pay and my bank account balance slowly increases. Money has bought me freedom from unhappiness at the very fucking least.
buzz86us@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I’d be in favor of a UBI, and Universal healthcare in addition to a fair wage…
stoy@lemmy.zip 1 year ago
Money doesn’t buy happiness. However is does buy opportunities to experience happyness, if spent well.
My camera itself doesn’t bring me happiness, but the enjoyment of using it to take photos and later look at them brings me happiness.
HawlSera@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Money “doesn’t buy happiness” was a relic from a time when minimum wage could buy a house and get you through college.
Hard to be much happier if you’ve got that.
TangledHyphae@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The bankers are lying to everyone, money does buy happiness.
Tischkante@discuss.tchncs.de 1 year ago
Money solves existential dread.
cooopsspace@infosec.pub 1 year ago
I’ve got 99 problems and at least 98 of them can be solved with a fair wage and eating the rich
lugal@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
That’s the point. There is a limit. If you below, you’re not happy but you can’t extrapolate that too much
PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee 1 year ago
The actual fact is that Money buys happiness but in diminishing returns 10k extra a year makes a lot more difference to a minimum wage worker than it does to a 6 figure software developer
TWeaK@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Money might not buy happiness, but it sure as hell solves a lot of problems that make people unhappy.
MotoAsh@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The question is whether someone has “enough” money. Until you can live comfortably, more money DOES buy more happiness. Once someone can comfortably live and engage with interests, more money doesn’t buy more happiness.
When someone says, “money doesn’t buy happiness.” what they’re actually saying is they have enough money and they do not understand how poverty works.
TWeaK@lemm.ee 1 year ago
A billionaire doesn’t buy billion times as much clothes or food more than a comfortable middle class person.
angrymouse@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Money solve a lot of problems we aren’t trying to solve (as society) collectively.
TWeaK@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Well, as a society we could solve the problem with money. We’re all too happy to print more money for people who already have lots of it, why not do so for people who don’t?
unfreeradical@lemmy.world 1 year ago
To some degree money is creating problems and obstructing solutions, but as long as ut is use, it s necessary to antagonize wealth consolidation and to support universal income.
Bobble9211@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago