To be fair, a Person with a PhD still can have Dunning-Kruger on other subjects.
Ben Carson is a great Neurosurgeon, but dumbass on politics.
Dunning-Kruger
Submitted 4 weeks ago by fossilesque@lemmy.dbzer0.com to science_memes@mander.xyz
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/pictrs/image/5331ef2a-131e-4e0e-94e7-3f56c0897076.webp
Comments
IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Neil deGrasse Tyson and literally anything other than astrophysics
smeenz@lemmy.nz 4 weeks ago
And sometimes also astrophysics
bradd@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
They can also on their subject.
EnthusiasticNature94@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
Yeah, both sides are wrong here.
Dunning-Kruger is bad, but so is credentialism and appeal to authority.
flambonkscious@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
I guees it needs (relevant) inserted?
excral@feddit.org 4 weeks ago
Even Noble Prize winners are surprisingly often affected by this -> wikipedia:Noble disease
Blazingtransfem98@discuss.online 4 weeks ago
I think a lot of these XX XY “only two genders” people aren’t just dunning Kruger, they’re transphobic idiots with an agenda. So even if they had the science and knowledge it wouldn’t matter because they’re pushing their hateful stupid agenda, facts and logic be damned. They don’t care, they just want to rationalize hating us trans people because we make them uncomfy.
AdrianTheFrog@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I would honestly be very surprised if any Republican politicians actually care about sex or gender. I think they’re just evil and those are convenient issues to divide the working class. When you don’t have popular policy in real issues, you need to make up some fake ones to get people to still support you.
drthunder@midwest.social 4 weeks ago
The current moral panic about queer people is definitely manufactured, but the hatred that it’s stirred up is still real. All the religious psychos in power (including Speaker of the House Mike Johnson) really believe that stuff and want to enforce their hierarchy.
HawlSera@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
What really bothers me is that they seem to be winning on the “Trans Sports” issues which sucks, it’s such a blatant distraction that I’d let them just “have that”, but… you know damn well that’s the floor and not the ceiling, and even then their wins are based on lies.
There are less trans athletes in the world then there are kids with measles in Texas, but the Right would have you believe ever Macho Man Randy Savage type is getting into sports and just blowing records clean away. Hence the push to “Ban transwomen and revoke their records”
What records? Even Lia Thomas, the closest they’ve gotten to finding an “Evil Cheating Trans!!1111” only came in 4th place…
JackbyDev@programming.dev 4 weeks ago
Exactly. They just don’t care. They’re not necessarily ignorant and participating in good faith.
Blazingtransfem98@discuss.online 4 weeks ago
They’re guaranteed to not be participating in good faith if they’re angrily debating sex and gender like that.
MiniMoose4Free@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Is there some third gender that trans people can transition to that I’m unaware of? I’m afraid I don’t follow the whole situation all too well sorry. My partner has some transgender family members, but i’ve never i’ve seen anyone that isn’t male to female or female to male. I guess non binary exists, but doesn’t that mean no gender or both?
I’m afraid I don’t know much on the subject It’s unfortunate.
Ziglin@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Fear not I, a still rather confused individual, but with slightly more knowledge on the topic shall answer thy call (I seem to suffer from the curse referred to as “being genderfluid” by the scholars of that gender stuff)!
Somebody who is non-binary is just someone who does not feel like they are entirely male or female. This can mean that they are both, neither or a different gender not connected to either but also not entirely absent or of course any combination of the previous examples.
In my case (genderfluid) I just flop around on the gender spectrum, mostly not having a gender or feeling a bit feminine but sometimes I do feel male or like some other gender. Though genderfluid just means that the persons gender changes over time, it doesn’t have to be the same genders that I experience.
Hope this helps :)
InputZero@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
You’re confusing sex with gender. Both are a spectrum but sex is a biological spectrum of sexual organs in a living creature and gender is a quality, projection and performance of a person that also lands on a spectrum.
The confusion is because they both use male and female but sex and gender are different things. Gender can change throughout a person’s life. A person’s sex is consistent throughout life and can’t be changed. A person’s gender can’t change their sex. Sex also isn’t as simple as xx is female and xy is male, there’s a whole bunch of things that can’t put a person in one, both, or none of those categories. Gender is even more complicated.
ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
The current doctrine is that there are unlimited genders, if you can think of one you can call yourself that, they call them “neopronouns” and aren’t simply relegated to xe/xer but include things like wolfkin and dragonfucker. There’s also plurals which to the best of my understanding feel like there’s multiple people usually with multiple neopronouns inside their head simultaneously.
I’m not either of these so maybe someone who is can elaborate better, but that’s what I’ve been told and I hope it helps.
IZZI@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Tell us what the 3rd gender is please.
~95% of all animals in the world, including humans, are gonochoric, have only 2 sexes.
Turner syndrome and klinfelter syndrome are exatly that, syndromes
uniquethrowagay@feddit.org 4 weeks ago
Gender is not sex. Have you ever, in good faith, talked to a trans person? Have you ever, in good faith, talked to an intersex person?
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 3 weeks ago
lmao, you’ve had multiple comments deleted for being bigoted
good job bigot
Ephera@lemmy.ml 3 weeks ago
Those are classifications made by humans. Nature doesn’t have a concept for sexes and even less so for syndromes. If it became evolutionarily advantageous to have a dick and a vagina, nature would be onto that.
Voyajer@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Wait until they learn about XXY, XYY, and XO individuals.
AtariDump@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
There hugs AND kisses people?
RizzRustbolt@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
We prefer “asexual” or “ace”.
joelfromaus@aussie.zone 4 weeks ago
I swear I was learning about extra X and Y in high school 20 years ago and that studies (at the time) were showing correlation between different traits displayed by effected people. Just that alone shows incredible gender fluidity.
So where we are, 20 years later, you’d think we’d have a better understanding within society but instead somehow it’s literally regressed since then.
x3x3@lemm.ee 3 weeks ago
Are there cases that these are none sterile? I know 1/4 of trisomy 21 moms can get pregnant but klinefeld and other gonosomal trisomy were taught being sterile when I last looked.
AbnormalHumanBeing@lemmy.abnormalbeings.space 4 weeks ago
While this is very funny, and definitely representative of a sort of ignorance/arrogance commonly found in ideologues - I recently learned that most people talking about the effect have, in fact, been Dunning-Krugering themselves.
Insightful video on the topic.
What most people expect the effect to look like:
ImageWhat the actual results were:
Imageanthropomorphized@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Fig 1 is a modified emotional change curve applied in learning and business settings. The term “Valley of Despair” is used in both concepts, and it’s cool, memorable verbiage, but it shouldn’t imply relation between Dunning-Kreuger and the change curve
forfengdesigns.com/tips-on-clawing-your-way-out-o… Image
Image description: A modified emotional change curve from Evocon with Y-Axis being “attitude during change process” and X-Axis is time. There are 6 emotional phases described on this chart: 1. Neutral attitude, no knowledge; 2. Initial excitement, motivated; 3. Denial, indifferent, passive, apathy; 4. Resistance, frustration, doubt, anxiety (this phase falls below neutral and is described as “The Valley of Despair”); 5. Exploration, energized, small wins, creative; 6. Commitment, enthusiasm, problem solving, focus, team work.
TimewornTraveler@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Yeah, it’s really frustrating and quite ironic that pop culture keeps using this obscure scientific reference, that they don’t really understand in its intended context, to describe something that really ought be plainly said: that we all have a tendency to overinflate our competence. if anything Dunning-Krueger showed that only the most seasoned experts judge themselves modestly, and then we’d likely only find their modesty in that particular area of expertise. it’s a commentary on all of us!
But no, people name-drop this research just to dunk on people and feel smugly superior. (and I am glad I agree with the politics of the intellectual in the OP, that means it’s okay and I’m a bit more competent too!) ugh. I cringe every time i read someone say Dunning-Krueger.
Korhaka@sopuli.xyz 4 weeks ago
While I know of the proper dunning-kruger effect chart, that still doesn’t help me out of the imposter syndrome valley of despair
holdstrong@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
“It’s basic biology” mfs when advanced biology
pyre@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
it is basic biology, ie biology simplified to teach a kid in middle school. the thing is sciences don’t stop at middle school level. a lot of university education is about clarifying that things you learned before were simplified to the point that they’re practically useless if not outright wrong.
Squizzy@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Light travels in straight lines, next year its a wave and then its particles. What you said isso true about uni rethreading.
matlag@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
“Yeah but science can be proven wrong an change over time, while my beliefs and biases are forever!”
LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Bayesian updating converges, surprisingly, to that idiot’s belief system.
psoul@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Can I get a T shirt that says “I have Dunning-Krueger and your Phd looks cute”? I just have a lot of BS to share and I don’t want to be sorry about it.
miraclerandy@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Actually, the science says you will feel regret and will grow to resent that shirt over time. /s
RizzRustbolt@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
That’s because today’s t-shirts are made of such poor materials.
jol@discuss.tchncs.de 4 weeks ago
But the economics says I should print them and make a fortune selling them to idiots. Hmm decisions, decisions.
HawlSera@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Dunning-Krueger effect is the delusion that you are smarter than a serial killer who stalks teenagers in their nightmares.
alykanas@slrpnk.net 4 weeks ago
How do you know if someone has a PhD.?
They tell you
SoleInvictus@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
I never tell people I have a PhD. It’s rude, plus I don’t have one.
ygajbm2sjcxbggbc0zfb@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Tbf, they kinda earned the right to brag.
papertowels@mander.xyz 4 weeks ago
I mean yeah, if you spent 5 years of your life pushing the edge of human understanding on a subject, and a shithead tells you to do the science on your research subject, it’s relevant lol
Franklin@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
True, but I do think it was warranted in this case.
thevoidzero@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Well you don’t know people with PhD that don’t tell you they have one
RizzRustbolt@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
An unknown-unknown?
dQw4w9WgXcQ@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
This is putting confirmation bias to the extreme.
drtaco@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Sometimes they don’t tell you and just quietly update all of their usernames…
xthexder@l.sw0.com 4 weeks ago
Do you by chance have a PhD in food science?
Doctor_Satan@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Right? It’s really weird…
TwistyLex@discuss.tchncs.de 4 weeks ago
Funny enough, my boss has a PhD in Evolutionary Biology. She never tells people because they start referring to her as Doctor, and she hates that. I don’t think I’ve actually ever heard her bring it up on her own.
EnthusiasticNature94@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
I agree with Dr. Jey McCreight on the science.
But for determining truth, both sides are wrong here.
Dunning-Kruger is bad, but so is credentialism and appeal to authority.
Many people with PhD’s have had Dunning-Kruger. Someone else mentioned Ben Carson being great at neurosurgery, but not politics.
A PhD doesn’t make you infallible.
I am saying this as someone who is taking graduate-level courses and will be pursuing my PhD. When I’m correct, it’s not because my future PhD causes reality to magically conform to my opinions - it’s because I rigorously looked at the evidence, logic, and formed my own conclusion that better aligns with reality.
HawlSera@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
One time a woman told me that my lack of a second X Chromosome meant I would “always be a man”
So I gaslit her into thinking her husband had klinefelters.
I hate how Republicans think transphobia is science
Zzyzx@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
You know how a bunch of villains are Dr. So-and-So? I bet it’s dealing with morons talking about your area of expertise that leads to one’s villain era.
OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml 4 weeks ago
Can someone explain to me how some XX people become cis male?
missandry351@lemmings.world 4 weeks ago
People who see gender as a F or M binary in 2025 are willingly ignorant to the bone.
4oreman@lemy.lol 4 weeks ago
grammar is not science
nimble@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
The phrase is funny but you wouldn’t catch me dead wearing a logical fallacy
rambling_lunatic@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
I’m a bit uninformed on this; it seems fascinating. Do these things happen due to something unusual during the growth of a fetus? What’s the name for this phenomenon?
LongLive@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
I hope this criticism is valid :
realclearscience.com/…/debunking_the_dunning-krug…!
and
realclearscience.com/…/debunking_the_dunning-krug…!
…
There is a “people think they are better than average” rule, rather than whatever Dunning-Kreuger suggested.IZZI@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
XY it’s man, XX it’s woman, nothing will ever change that…
There are intersex people, of course: Klinfelter syndrome (XXY) Turner syndrome (X) There is also XXXY which brings serious disabilities
So you as a man puttin on a wig WILL NEVER make you a woman.
“~95% of all animals in the world are ghonocoric in which individuals are either female or male sex” - “Genome evolution and mating systems in plants” Aline Muyle and Gabriel Marais
You are either a man, a woman, or you have a syndrome, a genetical mutation, a birth defect. It’s a delusion to believe that you can change your biological sex during your lifetime.
I will never hold anything against these poor souls, it’s not their fault for how they were born. But people cutting up their genitals and saying they are a woman now while stuffing themselves full of hormones are simply delusional.
I’m so glad that were I live there are virtually 0 “trans”. Only time in my life when I had to say “Please stop talking to me and imagine I don’t exist” was with a dude cosplaying as a woman.
And no, you won’t change speech, you are a man and a he, a woman and a she. That’s it, you can get as angry as you want, nothing will ever change that.
Djinn_Indigo@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Honestly, it would be a pretty lame T-shirt.
Acinonyx@lemmy.sdf.org 4 weeks ago
you just know that 75% of people who would wear this don’t really have a PhD and 90% of those don’t have a PhD in the right field
RumorsOfLove@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Critically thinking now, how strong is the evidence here?
Zerush@lemmy.ml 4 weeks ago
xye@lemm.ee 3 weeks ago
Darn that science, keep that liberal where it belongs, in the humanities.
ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
I was unaware that an X chromosome could mutate into a Y over the course of a lifetime. Do we know what causes that?
crazyhotpasta@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
Dunning-Kruger reminds me of this one president and his cabinet.
F_OFF_Reddit@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
That’s the fallacy of authority
elfpie@beehaw.org 4 weeks ago
Reading the discussions and some of the disagreements, a correction is needed to be more precise.
Some XX people will be Assigned Male At Birth. Some XY people will be Assigned Female At Birth.
Sunshine@lemmy.ca 4 weeks ago
Go Stephanie!
WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today 4 weeks ago
Cis men and women? How does that work? Does he mean in the womb? I thought the entire problem was that trans surgery was never quite good enough to make you truly male or female.
Ngl, even if I’m more than fine with my gender, we where all curious what it’s like to be the other gender, so if you could do it at a press of a button…
LadyAutumn@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
Note how they always enshrine gender in biology, but then make all kinds of non-biological statements about what gender is.
“XX is woman”/“Large gametes is woman”/“can conceive is woman”
And then they’ll say
“Women aren’t as aggressive”, “women are more emotional”, “women like being in the home more”, “those are women’s clothes”, etc.
The only reason it’s so important for it to be biological is because of how it punishes gender non-conformity and makes the lives of trans people hell. Like it isn’t ideologically consistent and they know that. They just don’t care. If it was just about genitals or chromosomes, then why is it that gender dictates all these social things about us? The only reason to root it in how you were born is to ensure gender roles are as rigid and immutable as possible.
LH0ezVT@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
Fit the mold or die. Always the same.
HawlSera@lemm.ee 4 weeks ago
This, this right here, that’s the game, that’s the whole game. They want to punish transness and then start changing what the definition of trans is.
“Your daughter was wearing pants, and said no when my boy asked her out, that’s trans behavior and it’s unAmerican, might have to report you.”
RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works 4 weeks ago
Aren’t there more than two sexes in biology?
LadyAutumn@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 weeks ago
Yes, there are many species that have more than 2 sexes. Those are decided by scientific consensus.
But sex is ultimately a category to describe the process of reproduction. By definition, this is exclusionary. It’s why conservatives fumble so much when trying to describe sex in terms of actual definitions. Inherently, it is not possible to fit every person into a table of 2 columns in that way. Sex is not a binary because human beings are not binary. There is an incredible amount of variation in our bodies.
Krik@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 weeks ago
Relating to humans?
Yes but they are mutations (e. g. XXY, XXX, etc.) that often give rise to numerous biological problems or death.
I don’t know if there are species that require more than two sexes to propagate. I never head of them.
RizzRustbolt@lemmy.world 4 weeks ago
Depends on how you’re counting.