Like Reddit, Lemmy is full of hive mind individuals who like to confirm their bias.
Upvoting a factually incorrect comment because it sounds nice, and downvoting a factually correct comment because it sounds bad.
Submitted 1 year ago by MrMusAddict@lemmy.world to mildlyinfuriating@lemmy.world
https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9c917780-1781-4a72-9919-1aefa51c56e8.png
Comments
BeefDaddySupreme@lemmy.world 1 year ago
ThePenitentOne@discuss.online 1 year ago
Most people are emotional and when challenged find it easier to justify their position rather than consider that they are wrong. So yeah, people will argue shit just to argue it.
Krauerking@lemy.lol 1 year ago
Damn did you drink a truth serum before writing that?
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Reddit had a lot of problems. Some of them were caused by having people as admins. Some were caused by having people as mods. Some were caused by having people as users.
Lemmy also has people as admins, mods, and users, so it will see many of the same problems.
Though Lemmy won’t necessarily turn into Reddit because it’s designed to have competition among the admins, so they are less likely to get a sense of “they don’t have a choice even if they don’t like what we’re doing”.
BeefDaddySupreme@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I’m looking forward to Lemmy growing and the freedom it provides. Being banned by rogue admins then to be unbanned then 3 months later being banned then unbanned, all with zero explanation was so irksome.
atticus88th@lemmy.world 1 year ago
A circlejerk community where facts are thrown out the window. Doesnt matter where its hosted, social media just going to keep doing what its doing.
I_Fart_Glitter@lemmy.world 1 year ago
It seems like there is at least one down vote for every comment that gets enough attention for a few upvotes. I assume there is someone here who just really likes downvoting.
That and, at least on Memmy mobile, you swipe right to upvote and swipe slightly further right to down vote. Also upvote color is orange and downvote color is blue, which is counter intuitive to me personally. So if I get a few downvotes on a comment I think is awesome, I just figure it was an accident and someone was trying to upvote me. Because I’m awesome and who would down vote me?
mikeboltonshair@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
I’ve def seen it both ways, lots of this person/this thing is bad types of threads on here with tons of people agreeing while spewing out pure nonsense
Like this lemmy.world/comment/3213143
I think Elon is a fuckwit but come on use some common sense it’s nowhere near treason this person has legitimately no clue what they are talking about and it’s upvoted to shit
On the other hand I’ve commented about stuff on here and if I had said the same things on Reddit I would have gotten downvotes, comments deleted or banned, and instead the comments were upvoted instead.
Idgaf about upvotes or downvotes it’s just interesting to see what the majority of people think is reasonable and that’s the way they show it.
BeefDaddySupreme@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Yea I saw that and thought about commenting but figured it would of been hitting my head on a brick wall. It’s funny how people went from loving him to despising him all because they were told to because he brought Twitter
Steve@communick.news 1 year ago
I can only imagine they meant 60% of the front view of the house. Otherwise that just seems insane.
thantik@lemmy.world 1 year ago
But the problem is, words mean things. A lot of people unfortunately, put the wrong words down - and they think internally that it makes sense, but there is context missing in the words they put down. I’ve had entire conversations that went on for days, only for me to be 20 threads deep, and the person say “I mentioned that!!”, and I ask for them to show me where…only for them to realize they’ve been angry this whole time over something they assumed I was ignoring or misrepresenting.
Steve@communick.news 1 year ago
We are entirely on the same page
sweafa@discuss.tchncs.de 1 year ago
square feet must look funny
somedaysoon@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The initial number of 42% isn’t that far off of reality. My own garage/shop is 36% right now. And I will at some point add onto it. Right now it is 25’x32’ and I would like another 20’ on it. Then it would be 25’x52’ and 48%. And I live right in town, on a 1/4 acre.
There are defintely houses and areas in Wisconsin here that are at 60%. I can go on realtor.com right now I find plenty with large pole sheds and garages… I know because garage and shop space was important to me when I was looking at houses last year.
PsychedSy@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
I don’t know if I’m supposed to upvote you because I like your comment or downvote you for being right.
LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Use one instance for the upvote, and one instance for the downvote, and then tell everyone Drew Carrie was right, the points don’t matter.
Cataphract@lemmy.ko4abp.com 1 year ago
unless you don’t consider steel frame buildings and pole sheds, but why wouldn’t you?
You do not, in fact, count those buildings towards your houses square footage. Doing so would open yourself up to all sorts of liability.
Covered, enclosed porches can only be included if heated and using the same system as the rest of the house. Garages, pool houses, guest houses, or any rooms that require you to leave the finished area of the main house to gain access are not counted in the square footage of a house. source
The only common situations in which the exact size of a home may be legally important would be:
- For tax appraisal purposes
- For qualifying for a certain mortgage or home equity loan
- If a buyer has already bought, or at least has signed a contract on a home, and now claims that fraud was committed because the home is not as large as advertised. source
For further considerations of those that are interested (ANSI Draft, figure 1, page 6, outside source as the real ansi website is just atrocious to navigate and I’m not gonna dox myself by loading up local code.)
As shown, the upper-level plan has an open foyer and a protruding window that does not extend to the floor; neither area contributes to the square footage of the upper level. The calculated finished square footage of the entry level does not include the protruding fireplace, covered patio, garage, or unfinished laundry. The finished area of the basement is counted toward the below- grade finished square footage in its entirety, including the area under the stairs that descend from the entry level. The area of the unfinished utility room is calculated by using the method prescribed in the standard but is not included in the below-grade finished square footage.
All that aside, you’re slapping a 25’x52’ shed onto your 1/4 acre property? That’s almost 20% of your land use not including lot encroachment setback, drainage, and basic driveway/building infrastructure. It’s your property so definitely do as you wish, but to think this is a common practice or a desirable thing outside of niche hobbyists or being used for work related activities/storage is nonsense. Neighborhood flooding, no natural green spaces for habitats, it all sounds like a horrible dystopia on your mini-compound.
somedaysoon@lemmy.world 1 year ago
You do not, in fact, count those buildings towards your houses square footage. Doing so would open yourself up to all sorts of liability.
You don’t count garage spaces as square footage of a house either, so what is your point? If he’s comparing garage space footage to overall living quarter footage, then you should also include pole sheds into that equation.
All that aside, you’re slapping a 25’x52’ shed onto your 1/4 acre property? That’s almost 20% of your land use not including lot encroachment setback, drainage, and basic driveway/building infrastructure. It’s your property so definitely do as you wish, but to think this is a common practice or a desirable thing outside of niche hobbyists or being used for work related activities/storage is nonsense. Neighborhood flooding, no natural green spaces for habitats, it all sounds like a horrible dystopia on your mini-compound.
No, not adding a shed, extending my garage/shop. Feel free to take a look at my YouTube videos to see how nice my garage/shop is setup now. How nice my fenced in backyard looks. And how nicely my 1400 sq foot house all sit on this property. Then you can stop talking about things that you have no idea about, thanks buddy!
MrMusAddict@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Excellent point. The initial intent of my squabble wasn’t trying to deny that counter-examples exist, just that when comparing 100 houses to 100 apartments, that there seemed to be losses in living space for the apartment (law of averages and whatnot).
I had made another comment on that /c/FuckCars thread that calculated that if all of the homes had 1-car garages (which is not uncommon for a lot of dense low-density suburbs), then the homes would be 1740 SqFt with the garage / 1500 SqFt Livable, and the apartments would be 1009 SqFt livable. So a 33% loss of livable space in the image with what I would consider a reasonable assumption.
somedaysoon@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Fair enough, but that is none of that is discernible from the post… you’re highlighting what they are saying. And all they are saying is, “Sometimes, the garage is more than 60% of the whole house.” And you are implying with this post that it is factually incorrect, when it is in fact, true.
AtomfriedMegaforce@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Downvoting it just for using imperial units✊
SwedishFool@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Fuckcars is just a cult anyway, they go REEEE at any suggestion that cars are a necessity for many people, and that no busses nor bikes will ever compensate for it.
Disk@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
I’ve followed the FuckCars community for a while (started on reddit). Being one of them car fuckers myself I would disagree. There certainly are people there who’s thought process doesn’t go much further than car = bad, but boiling the whole community down to that does a disservice to their more important points. I think most people there aren’t so much advocating for less cars as much as they are advocating for policy and societal change toward a world where we aren’t so reliant on cars. Obviously for a massive chunk of the world population (especially in North America) cars are a necessity like you said, but do they need to be? Wouldn’t we all be better off if the world was less car dependent? We aren’t saying that there should be no more cars, just that we shouldn’t continue to design our cities in such a way that you need a car to live.
If you are interested in more about where the fuckcars comunity is coming from I would recommend checking out the youtube channel Not Just Bikes. All of his videos are great but I think this one is a good intro to the channel. I also like this one because it outlines a lot of the specific “first step” type things that could be much better (most applicable to north america). Also, his Strong Towns Video Series is really good if you have the time.
(here are a couple more because I can’t help myself: Why it sucks to grow up in car-centric cities, How American cities are ponzie schemes, and His video about Stroads)
thefloweracidic@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Thank you for your well thought out, non-reactionary response. This is the energy we need on lemmy. Not more knee-jerk outrage.
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LazyBane@lemmy.world 1 year ago
As a European, its funny watching these guys talk about “Europe” as this pure implementation of their motorphobic utopia.
A lot of us still drive daily yanks!
Enkrod@feddit.de 1 year ago
Still. I live near Mannheim, out of the 8 people in my circle of close friends, 4 either outright do not own a car or share a car with their spouses, because their households can make do with one or less cars. They can absolutely make do with walking, bikes, tram, bus and train for everything in their daily lives. In many american cities of the same size, that would simply not be an option.
Hyperreality@kbin.social 1 year ago
On social media, many Americans aren't actually interested in discussing or learning about 'Europe'.
They only mention us, so they can talk about themselves and their own problems. That's why it doesn't actually matter what's happening here. Europe is often a homogenous blob in their imagination. A fictional land that changes depending on what US political argument they want to win or if they want to feel better about themselves.
It's not their fault. We get swamped with US news, media and culture. They rarely are in part due to the language barrier.
glassware@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Weird how it’s literally impossible to ever live without something no one had 100 years ago
Cryophilia@lemmy.world 1 year ago
People with chronic diseases: yeah, crazy right?
rexxit@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Are you going to be first in line to give up your computer? Your phone? Antibiotics? Vaccines? Electricity?
Innovation is real, even if you don’t personally like it. Motor vehicles are a legitimately good invention, arguably only becoming problematic due to increasing population and urbanization.
atticus88th@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Some of them are raging right now at the idea that not everyone who hates cars wants to live in an apartment.
Its like liberals screaming when they findout you can be a liberal and a gun owner.
Or conservatives when you express socialistic rights while also limiting government.
Halosheep@lemm.ee 1 year ago
I don’t think they live in the same reality I do, or maybe they’ve never seen Texas? Even if my local area was designed for foot traffic, the amount of space between literally everything here would make it impossible not to rely on a car.
In DFW you can sum about any trip to somewhere you want to be to a 30 minute drive. Favorite restaurant that isn’t literally right next to you? 30 minutes or an hour without tolls. Work? That’s another 30 minutes. Wanna go to a store nicer than a Walmart? You guessed it. 30 minutes.
Get home from work around 4:30? We’ll now you have a cool 5 hours of time until bed time. Subtract an hour of the gym, an hour of cooking and maybe you’ve got 3 hours of time to do anything else. Waiting for public transportation or wasting time walking would just cut down even more of the hours in your day. Maybe I want more out of life than sacrificing my time to public transportation and walking.
Disk@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Even if my local area was designed for foot traffic, the amount of space between literally everything here would make it impossible not to rely on a car.
If your local area was designed for foot traffic, then things wouldn’t be so spread out. One of the many reasons this is so bad in america (and this is the case in DFW) are the awful parking minimum laws that have ruined so many cities. Since the 1950’s new business developments have been required to have a minimum amount of parking so that even at max capacity there would be enough spots. In a less car-centric city almost any place you would need to visit regularly -be it a grocery store, a department store, or whatever else- would certainly be within walking distance of (or a short public transit hop away from) your home and work. But the parking minimum laws spread everything so far apart that to walk or bike anywhere is unimaginable, and it also isn’t feasible to build up good public transit because you would need stops at every major street corner (rather than in a reasonable city where you would be taking transit hops between dense clusters of businesses and other destinations).
In DFW you can sum about any trip to somewhere you want to be to a 30 minute drive. Favorite restaurant that isn’t literally right next to you? 30 minutes or an hour without tolls. Work? That’s another 30 minutes. Wanna go to a store nicer than a Walmart? You guessed it. 30 minutes. Get home from work around 4:30? We’ll now you have a cool 5 hours of time until bed time. Subtract an hour of the gym, an hour of cooking and maybe you’ve got 3 hours of time to do anything else. Waiting for public transportation or wasting time walking would just cut down even more of the hours in your day. Maybe I want more out of life than sacrificing my time to public transportation and walking.
You said “I don’t think they live in the same reality I do,” but not only is this pretty much exactly the case in the city I live in, but I have given very similar rants when complaining about living in such a car dependent area. Honestly I was confused for a moment because you have some great points on why living in a city designed for cars sucks so much. The reason I consider myself a member of the fuckcars community isn’t that I think people should walk/bike more or that I don’t like cars. It’s that I want our city designs to change. Walking, biking, and even public transit simply doesn’t make sense in most North American cities but it doesn’t have to be that way. With policy change and redesign projects over time our cities could be so much better.
For me, the dream is a place where I can take a 20-30 minute bike ride to work without worrying about getting run over. Instead of needing to make a big grocery “trip” every week or two it wouldn’t need to be a trip at all. Two or three times a week on my way home from work I could just make a 5-10 minute stop at one of the grocery stores that was already along my path. It would be a similar deal for the gym and other places I might visit on the average day. When I want to visit a restaurant that isn’t super close I could just hop on the tram or train and take a nice traffic-less ride to a stop within walking distance. I wouldn’t need a car, and I wouldn’t want a car. Why pay all the upkeep on a car when I could just rent a car for the handful of occasions a year I might need it.
Places like this do exist
Fuck I should just move to the Netherlands already.
bstix@feddit.dk 1 year ago
If they add in the driveway the area would probably be about the same as the house.
If we also add in the necessary roads and parking lots,it is pretty obvious that cars are creating a self-induced demand.
We need to have cars because we need to drive around space for cars.
ElderWendigo@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Still beats the space and maintenance needs of a horse and buggy.
SirHery@lemmy.world 1 year ago
You ain’t wrong.
pHr34kY@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Larger garages are more environmentally friendly. My garage is huge compared to my house. It has 2 cars, a laundry, and all of the stuff I don’t use every day.
This is an area that is not heated or cooled. By having all the storage in the garage, I can get by with less living space.
Garages are cheaper per square metre than rooms, so you save money there too.
You get all the stuff into the same size house, but with less building materials, less heating and cooling costs, and less clutter in your house.
Asifall@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Wouldn’t it be more environmentally friendly to store your cars outside and not have a garage?
pHr34kY@lemmy.world 1 year ago
My car is 20 years old and has zero rust. The environmental footprint of manufacturing a car is huge. They last much longer in a garage. It also doesn’t need to get washed as often. Washing has an environmental overhead too.
such_lettuce7970@kbin.social 1 year ago
Omg, who fucking cares?
Rentlar@lemmy.ca 1 year ago
Exactly, who cares about the arrows. Sometimes I vote, sometimes I don’t. Sometimes my finger slips and I hit the wrong arrow anyway. I don’t bother to change it so I take my place as an arbiter of chaos.
blazera@kbin.social 1 year ago
MrMusAddict@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Wow, what an awe-inspiring counter-example, lol
Rognaut@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Am I not supposed to like that? Cause I really like that house design. Garage for days.
BURN@lemmy.world 1 year ago
That looks amazing. I’d actually have space to work on a project car, plus store my daily, as well as extra storage, probably a server rack and a whole bunch of other stuff. One of the things I notice most about living in an apartment vs my childhood home is how much storage space we had in our garage.
Thorny_Thicket@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
Even there the house is a bit too large for me. That carage is nice though
blazera@kbin.social 1 year ago
Yeah the climates fucked with all this car worship
Voyajer@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Holy mother of a workshop
drathvedro@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Blame the system. Rating system was a good idea to encourage community self-moderation, but most people treat upvotes/downvotes as likes/dislikes, even when specifically asked to use them differently. And, because of that, places with rating systems inevitably boil down to circlejerking, infobubbles, and tribalism. Too bad the only alternatives are spamholes, chaotic messes with power-tripping moderators, and AI blackboxes designed to control your mind.
lugal@lemmy.world 1 year ago
AI blackboxes designed to control your mind.
They aren’t designed to control your mind but to make money. The mind thing is a side effect.
Muddydog@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 year ago
They wanna make paperclips. The money is a side effect.
Hyperreality@kbin.social 1 year ago
People are people. People like to feel good about themselves. Vanity is still the Devil's favourite sin.
Omgarm@lemmy.world 1 year ago
When you accidentally consider your hyperbole to be factual.
ryathal@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
This just gets worse when you use what developers call a two car garage now. 24x24 would be awesome, it’s more like 18x20 now despite bigger cars.
scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 1 year ago
We are in that bucket and in this stupid country there aren’t many smaller cars anymore. We’re looking for a decent EV that is small and would fit in our garage. I think we have like, 2 options. Everything out there is some crossover SUV bullshit. I don’t want a giant car, I just want something smaller and comfortable for 2 people.
Kolanaki@yiffit.net 1 year ago
I’m the blocked out poster in this.
You keep assuming that the living space is ~1500sq/ft for some reason; the houses I am talking about that are like this are not even half that size, but have 2 or even 3 car garages attached to them. Most of these are living quarters for field workers on the dairies and not even built to code.
MrMusAddict@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I mean, I’m not going to ask you to doxx yourself, but I’m extremely curious to know where you’re seeing these homes that are, as you describe them, like 150 SqFt of livable area with an attached 3 car garage.
Kolanaki@yiffit.net 1 year ago
I’m in a somewhat rural part of the central valley in California. Lotta dairy farms out here, and they have their own living spaces for the workers that are just absolute shitholes.
Cryophilia@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I’ve seen workers quarters like this in farms, oil fields, rural power plants etc. They’re usually supposed to be for temporary or seasonal workers. Just a simple sleeping area + room for vehicles to drive to the jobsite.
Just_Pizza_Crust@lemmy.world 1 year ago
This has the issue of always assuming a household will always live in the most space efficient way possible (2 adults in 1 bedroom with no children or others).
Assume you need 2 bedrooms (2 adults and 1 child): A 1,000 sq ft home in the USA is somewhere close to the 10th percentile in terms of size, so going down to 750 sq ft puts you near the absolute smallest 2 bedroom houses available.
SuperSwan@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
The first house I lived in after college was 950 sqft. Three bedrooms. No garage. It was also built in the 50’s. It worked for three (and then later four) people splitting rent.
Today developers wouldn’t dare put such a house on the type of lot it was on because it couldn’t be profitable.
ZodiacSF1969@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
This sort of thing has always happened.
I do find it particularly infuriating when it’s a topic I’m knowledgeable in/involves my profession. But then I remember most people are stupid and it doesn’t both me too much.
fushuan@lemm.ee 1 year ago
I’ve had the “You don’t work in X do you?” or the “tell me you don’t know about X without telling me you don’t work in X”. Oh boy my fucking bachelors and masters and years of experience in the field say otherwise FFS!
But then I remember most people are stupid and it doesn’t both me too much.
Great mantra to live by.
MBM@lemmings.world 1 year ago
r/ELI5 was terrible for this
tias@discuss.tchncs.de 1 year ago
/r/ArgueLikeYouAre5
gamer@lemm.ee 1 year ago
This seems very unhealthy. Maybe go take a stroll around the block?
Just_Pizza_Crust@lemmy.world 1 year ago
How exactly is doing the math unhealthy? This is like 60 seconds of math and a few minutes of graphics at most.
I’d rather have someone doing the math and posting it than people becoming misinformed on an important political topic. I think that’s what OP was after.
ExcursionInversion@lemmy.world 1 year ago
That’s exactly what came to my mind
Thorny_Thicket@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
Many users vote based on emotions here. I often see well written comments with the sources linked and everything, being downvoted, and some low effort reply with an opinion is upvoted, though factually incorrect.
Blamemeta@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Fuck /fuckcars
They actually want to bulldoze so much, just so we can cram more people in closer together. And no, no one wants to be walking around when its 90+ degrees out, or literally freezing.
TheControlled@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I applaud your bitterness. Bravo!
Odo@lemm.ee 1 year ago
🤓
CluckN@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I treat them like AntiWork, it’s fun to visit the zoo but living in one means dealing with a lot of random shit.
Rukmer@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I don’t know the full context of this conversation, but is it normal for homes to have large garages? I live in a 620 sq foot house (way too small, I have only one kid), and no garage. I wouldn’t even want a garage, I have a driveway? Some of my neighbors have garages but they are not that large, they certainly don’t make up 50% of their space, but some of them 1/3rd, if their house is smaller. Most houses in my neighborhood are bigger than my house but not huge.
zoe@infosec.pub 1 year ago
same as i have commented in another orange app, people aren’t supposed to make sense, so one should spare oneself the frustartion
vinceman@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 year ago
Ngl my dream house is a 400sq ft loft style apartment with an 8 car garage.
pjhenry1216@kbin.social 1 year ago
Doesn't the picture just prove both comments are wrong? And who the hell knows of they're the same person upvoting and downvoting? Does reddit show voters now?
Izzy@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I’ve been seeing this a lot lately. Lots of bandwagoning going on. It is what it is though. People are fallible and often just follow the herd instead of thinking.
Touching_Grass@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I agree
FatTony@lemmy.world 1 year ago
You agree