California law would give employees the 'right to disconnect' during nonworking hours

Submitted ⁨⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨Stopthatgirl7@lemmy.world⁩ to ⁨workreform@lemmy.world⁩

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2024/04/02/right-to-disconnect-bill-california/73175821007/

Anyone tired of answering emails and calls from their boss after work may soon be protected by law in California.

A bill has been introduced in California legislature that would give employees the “right to disconnect” from their jobs during nonworking hours.

Assemblymember Matt Haney of San Francisco first introduced the bill, Assembly Bill 2751 in February, which would allow employees to disconnect from communications from their employer during nonworking hours.

If passed, California would be the first state to create a “right to disconnect” for employees. Similar laws have already been enacted in 13 countries, including Australia, Argentina, Belgium, France, Italy, Mexico, Portugal and Spain.

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starlord@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
This isn’t already a right?

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- Landless2029@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  In my state being called into work requires a 3 hour minimum payment.
  
  So a manager texting me to go respond to an email would be a 3 hour charge.
  
  Our work culture was set to leave people alone off the clock due to this.
  
  Now that I’m a salary employee I can see this being an issue. When I login in the morning I can see chatter at 11pm on work stuff.
  
  Thankfully I’m not expected to answer to anything until my normal hours.
  
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  - Pyr_Pressure@lemmy.ca ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    There needs to be legislation to reign in salary type work as well.
    
    It still needs to be based on hours, like an average of 40 hours per week sort of thing.
    
    Yes your pay cheque will be the same every week for simplicity, but you shouldn’t be expected to work 60 hours just because you’re salary. If you work one week 50 hours, you should be able to tell your boss you are only working 30 hours the next week.
    
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- Kase@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Pfft, I’ve had friends who worked fast food jobs where they regularly got called in during their off hours/days. From what they told me, they had to commit to not just answering the phone, but showing up anytime their employer asked them to, no scheduling or prior notice required. This was apparently something they could get fired over refusing. It’s bonkers.
  
  This is in the US, but not California.
  
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  - Mirshe@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Yup, my old grocery store required this as a part of being full-time. You couldn’t refuse a shift, couldn’t swap hours, and had to be able to come in when asked unless the absence was preplanned or a medical emergency.
    
    Needless to say, almost all of the full-time people had no lives outside work, at all.
    
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PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Middle Managers in shambles over this

“But how will I get my rocks off to knowing I can strangle my underlings with infinite meaningless metrics‽”

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- krashmo@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Is it really a widespread thing for people to get in trouble for not doing this? I’ve never answered an email or phone call while off work or on vacation and not once has anyone brought it up. The only people I see doing this are the people that do it of their own free will.
  
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  - TexasDrunk@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I used to get in trouble for missing calls and texts out of hours because they expected it. They expected it because I usually answered. I stopped and got in trouble a few times. Then they started calling someone else.
    
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  - PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Likely you’ve suffered in less noticeable ways, like delays in promotion or pay increases
    
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  - Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    Is it really a widespread thing for people to get in trouble for not doing this
    
    Yeah it is. Remember the whole “quiet quitting” bullshit panic? That way about people doing this and bosses (plus the pro-corporate billionaire-owned mainstream media) pretending that it was the death knell of businesses.
    
    I’ve never answered an email or phone call while off work or on vacation and not once has anyone brought it up
    
    Good. That’s exactly how it should be. If they’re not paying you for it, you’re not on call. That should be a given.
    
    The only people I see doing this are the people that do it of their own free will
    
    Unfortunately, that’s far from true. Lack of regulations. An obscene power imbalance stemming mainly from lack of unionization. A business culture that heavily encourages ruthless exploitation.
    
    These conditions combine to make many if not most bosses abuse their workers in any and every way not specifically illegal and oftentimes even THAT doesn’t stop them.
    
    This law and effective enforcement of it is VITAL for labor rights and the mental health of workers
    
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- Sakychu@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  /c/RareInterrobang
  
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g0d0fm15ch13f@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Imagine what hellscape would need this to be a law

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- Signtist@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Ultimately, it should be a law. Companies will always want to exploit their workers whenever possible, and the entire point of a government is to enforce the will of the people against things like corporations that are too big for any single person to fight. It’s basically the concept of “If you’re not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to fear,” but applying it to companies instead of people, because the people should be free, not the corporations.
  
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- AdamEatsAss@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Welcome to the “land of the free”.
  
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  - Ultragigagigantic@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Land of the fee, home of the slave.
    
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some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
California trying to make life better for workers. I’m here for it.

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_sideffect@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I never give my personal phone number to coworkers, and my work laptop is shut down for the night

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BallsandBayonets@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
None of these laws would be necessary (I would hope) with a proper safety net (universal healthcare, UBI, etc). A job does something shitty, you can afford to leave! When we support people we empower them to stand up for themselves.

At least, these are the things I think about as my “no one wants to work anymore” boss rants at me about how everything would be better if the government wasn’t involved in capitalism.

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- Mostly_Gristle@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  I’m pretty sure that’s the exact reason why we don’t have those things. Harder to exploit people when they’re not scared and desperate.
  
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Unpigged@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I’m working in a European branch of an American business with headquarters in SF. We have to provident call support for software services that we create. Engineers from the European office are paid for on-call duty shifts, however American engineers are not paid for the same job. I wonder whether this law will change things.

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Sanctus@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Me getting called four times a night by random coworkers asking for random shit:

Image

Worker protections are necessary. Without them our employers would all treat us like Frieza did Krillin

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- TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  Frieza did Krillin
  
  Too soon.
  
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  - Pyro@programming.dev ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    It’s been close to 25 years…
    
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- CarbonatedPastaSauce@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  What in the hell am I looking at here? My brain is not processing this.
  
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  - Feathercrown@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Took my eyea a long time too. He’s being sliced in half
    
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FeelThePower@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Holy shit i really need this. Ever since my manager quit, my supervisor has basically decided to go total anarchy and do whatever she wants. Including adding us to the schedule without saying anything then deducting points for no-show, or blowing up our phones about said situation.

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- Semi-Hemi-Demigod@kbin.social ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  Including adding us to the schedule without saying anything then deducting points for no-show
  
  IANAL but that sounds like a labor law violation
  
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  - FeelThePower@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Well, I did get mad and read the california labour laws one night in their entirety and sadly it was within legal grounds SOMEHOW. But doesn’t surprise me either considering this new law seems to allow calls about that still, too. Which i would imagine is the main gripe people would have with out of hours contact. Fucking bullshit, man.
    
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- antlion@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  The law as proposed allows them to contact employees for emergencies or for scheduling. So as long as it’s about scheduling employees can’t safely ignore it.
  
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  - FeelThePower@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Yeah, I sadly realised this and mentioned it in my other comment. It’s really unfortunate.
    
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- KevonLooney@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  deducting points
  
  My friend, everything’s made up and the points don’t matter. Just need to look for a similar job. Ask your friends and former coworkers.
  
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  - fubbernuckin@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Man, if only similar jobs even existed in some fields. Friend of a friend wrote a script to apply to around 1000 jobs per day last year (comp sci roles) and still took around 6 weeks to get their first interview. Other friends in the field have been searching with no luck for months now.
    
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njm1314@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
This is one of those things that you shouldn’t have to have a lot of protect, that right seems inherent and inalienable. Yet we do we so do.

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MedicPigBabySaver@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
More than once over the years I’ve told admin, “not interested”, when they asked me about taking a Supervisor position.

Nope, I punch out and clear my mind about work. I guarantee that wouldn’t be possible at the Supervisor level. I won’t even work as a Field Training Officer. The little bump per hour isn’t worth the hassle of doing evals and discussing each newbie with management.

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- Fredselfish@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Even if this law were to pass. California governor bet you will veto it. He got to cater to the 1% if he plans run for president.
  
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catloaf@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
What is going on that this is necessary? I’ve never been expected to be reachable outside my working hours.

I’ve been on call, but those are scheduled, and I got paid if anything happened. I can only think of a very few unscheduled calls, including one where I had to call in and didn’t even have to unmute, but you bet your ass I still counted that time on my timecard and got paid for it.

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- ChapulinColorado@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  From previous experiences, it is the shittiest jobs that have the highest expectations. Regardless of what anyone might think, at least this puts it on paper.
  
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- BaldProphet@kbin.social ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Salaried workers have no specific hours. Their employers own them.
  
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  - viking@infosec.pub ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Wait a second, you don’t have working hours in the US just because you’re receiving a salary? My contract states that I have 8h of work per day, 5 days a week, and that office hours are understood as 9 AM to 6 PM with 1h for lunch, and that’s that.
    
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Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I’d answer if my boss called outside of working hours. But only because I know he’d never ever do that if it wasn’t really urgent. But I’m under absolutely no obligation to do any work related stuff when I’m not clocked in.

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Copernican@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
I thought they already had that during working hours. I swear sometimes while I’m working on the east coast hours, my west coast colleagues signs on at 12PM EST and signs off of 530EST and aren’t around to answer my 6:30 EST pings. Meanwhile I’m waking early for EU client calls, and handling 9PM meetings with Asia offices. So it goes. I don’t think we can have it both ways where you can be remote working from anywhere yet not be on the hook to work hours during the defined operational times. I’m not working 9 to 9EST, and take long breaks mid day if I have evening meetings, but there are operational realities of needing to talk to people to get work done and those times need to be defined.

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PatFussy@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Can you imagine being on a global operations team in California? Looks like a bunch of job openings

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- AdamEatsAss@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  It just means that employers will have to pay employees for the work they perform. I dont think there will be major changes. It will just require companies to better define the hours their employees are expected to be working.
  
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  - PatFussy@lemm.ee ⁨8⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Again, ops teams usually work way overtime. California is special because we don’t really have an overlapping working time with Asia or EU. This means we either have to not work a regular 9-5 time zone or the company is going to have to open a bunch of positions to make up for the difference.
    
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