the game "Horses" now barred on Steam, Epic and Humble Bundle

Submitted ⁨⁨20⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨alehel@lemmy.zip⁩ to ⁨games@lemmy.world⁩

https://www.pcgamer.com/games/horror/controversial-horror-game-horses-gets-kicked-off-the-humble-store-one-day-after-launch-but-its-also-become-the-best-selling-new-release-on-gog/

Currently, only GOG and Itch are still selling this game.

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Kraiden@piefed.social ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

content that appears, in our judgment, to depict sexual conduct involving a minor

I’m assuming they don’t mean a suggestive camera pan, but actually something problematic on screen, in which case, I totally support the ban. Devs were given the opportunity to change it, and they said no. Ban away imho. The fact that this is considered controversial is pretty disturbing to me.

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- markz@suppo.fi ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  It was a child doing pony play, riding a naked adult man-horse. The dev claimed it was not sexual.
  
  This was removed later but it’s the build you send for review that gets reviewed. Other stores got a later version, hence why it passed on those.
  
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  - CileTheSane@lemmy.ca ⁨31⁩ ⁨minutes⁩ ago
    Considering there website proudly shows it is banned on Steam I’m sure this was done on purpose for the publicity.
    
    Why did Epic ban it though? They didn’t get the ‘tainted’ preview version and normally love to have games that aren’t on Steam.
    
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  - cronenthal@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    I haven’t heard about the details, what’s your source on that?
    
    As far as I recall, the developer said he didn’t know the actual reason for the ban.
    
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  - dukemirage@lemmy.world ⁨17⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    What’s CSAM?
    
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- REDACTED@infosec.pub ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  I’m almost thru the game and I did not notice any sexual conducts with minors
  
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  - Kraiden@piefed.social ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Yep, I’ve since read some other articles and it seems there’s more to this specific case
    
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- Deestan@lemmy.world ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  The devs were not told what needed to change even after asking, so they tried to remove anything that they suspected could be taken the wrong way, asked for reconsideration or clarification, but receive none.
  
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  - KaChilde@sh.itjust.works ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    This is false.
    
    eurogamer.net/its-extremely-frustrating-and-also-…
    
    They submitted to steam, who asked for a preliminary build of the game (one would assume due to concerns about the content). The build provided included a small child reading a naked man like a horse.
    
    Steam denied the game based on the inclusion of CSAM, and advised the devs directly of this decision in what the devs call “an automated email”, as if steam is out there personally hand writing rejection letters for every failed game out there.
    
    The devs claim to have changed the scene, but it seems that Steam has a zero-tolerance policy on games that feature CSAM. And, I mean, Fair.
    
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- Arcane2077@sh.itjust.works ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  Forming an opinion from your made up justification is a sign of poor judgement
  
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  - Kraiden@piefed.social ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    It’s a direct quote from the article you’re commenting on, and that my opinion is based on.
    
    But please, don’t let me stop you from attacking my character instead of my argument
    
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Ludicrous0251@piefed.zip ⁨17⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

Steam was the first major storefront to refuse to carry Horses, a first-person psychological horror adventure about “the burden of familial trauma and puritan values, the dynamics of totalitarian power, and the ethics of personal responsibility” set on a ranch where nude human beings in horse masks are treated as livestock.

Publisher Santa Ragione said in November that Valve declined to carry Horses because it contained “content that appears, in our judgment, to depict sexual conduct involving a minor.” Santa Ragione disputed that characterization, but an appeal was rejected and the ban stands.

Seems like it’s treading a very fine line…

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KaChilde@sh.itjust.works ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
The game company seems to have thought that they could drum up sales on other platforms by making this a media thing. Based on the additional platforms pulling out, it might have backfired. They could have let their little horse-porn game quietly release on every platform but Steam and made enough to get by. Instead they drew attention to themselves.

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- GreyCat@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  Good on you for dismissing years of work from a group of people as a “little horse-porn game”.
  
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- REDACTED@infosec.pub ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  Did it not work tho? This was my first itch.io purchase ever
  
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  - KaChilde@sh.itjust.works ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Not arguing the effectiveness of drumming up drama to sell your game, but they have also lost the accessibility of three major platforms in doing so.
    
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cronenthal@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Based solely off the trailer I can see how a big American storefront would err on the side of caution here. There is very little to gain from carrying a game decidedly built with controversy in mind, but a lot to loose.

With the publicity around it and sales still possible through alternative stores maybe things will turn out alright for the developer in the end. “Banned” media is always in demand, after all.

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- Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  Unless it unexpectedly sells gangbusters, the dev says they’re likely to shut down as not having the massive steam audience to sell to won’t net them enough to continue. And people are stupidly loyal to valve for some reason.
  
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  - Maestro@fedia.io ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    That's because Valve is privately owned and this has largely resisted the enshittification that largely plagues public companies and private equity frims.
    
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  - markz@suppo.fi ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    It very well could be true, but the dev also seemed full of shit in the first interview I saw, pretending that he had no clue why it was banned.
    
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  - yermaw@sh.itjust.works ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    They’d be as well carrying on. Its in a pretty unique position as being a game that people are talking about before its even finished, which is pretty uncommon for most titles, and can be “the game they tried to ban” which did wonders for Manhunt, GTA and Postal.
    
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  - cronenthal@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Valve is pretty upfront about being a business first and foremost. Their customers are loyal because they consistently provide high value at reasonable prices, even though they are in a dominating position in the market. They’ve taken unpopular decisions in the past, but never any that seriously alienated a meaningful chunk of their customer base.
    
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HollowNaught@lemmy.world ⁨8⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Wait, I thought this game was a depiction of what we subject horses to, using a horror lens to drive home the point? I’ve never heard of something less sexy?

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- Contramuffin@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  My understanding is that there was a scene where a young girl rides a naked man/woman around. Apparently it has since been changed to make the child older, but… I can perfectly understand why anyone would be hesitant to accept such a game based on that description alone. Even if it’s not intended to be sexual, the developers were certainly pushing the line
  
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  - notgivingmynametoamachine@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    That’s not how this works, you don’t get to decide what is acceptable for other people. It’s people like you who galvanize Mastercard and Visa in trying to control what kind of content we’re “allowed” to purchase.
    
    To be clear this all sounds repugnant to me, but i realize Im not the sole arbiter of taste and have no interest in telling other adults what (legal) things they are and aren’t allowed to do.
    
    If the game is so bad it’ll tank, it doesn’t need outside forces influencing it.
    
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Deestan@lemmy.world ⁨20⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Looks like it has triggered someone’s “we can’t be seen backing down!” reflex at Valve

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- alehel@lemmy.zip ⁨5⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  Doubt it. They probably don’t care enough to have a reflex. They denied it, and likely aren’t going to give it much more thought now that they have.
  
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- Goodeye8@piefed.social ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  What are you on about?
  
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  - Deestan@lemmy.world ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    The game being banned for a misunderstood piece of placeholder concept art in a Steam approval preview build, which was both removed, and explained. Then Valve refusing to reconsider it and rejecting all attempts to clarify their objections.
    
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jordanlund@lemmy.world ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Sounds like the gaming equivalent of the play “Equus”.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equus_(play)

I can see why some would shy away from it, but banning it is the sort of thing that will keep gaming from becoming a unique art form. 😟

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- dukemirage@lemmy.world ⁨17⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  It already is a unique art form. This is not defined by the commercial availability, and this game wouldn’t be the first art piece that understands controversy as part of its essence.
  
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- _cryptagion@anarchist.nexus ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  
  It was a child doing pony play, riding a naked adult man-horse. The dev claimed it was not sexual.
  
  I don’t think gaming needs CSAM to be a “unique art form”, but you do you.
  
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  - douglasg14b@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Y’all need to read what CSAM is. Questionable or objectionable art isn’t CSAM in the same sense that drawing a murder isn’t murder, or drawing Noncon isn’t rape.
    
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  - jordanlund@lemmy.world ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Read the plot summary of the play Equus linked above.
    
    Like I say, this sounds like the gaming equivalent of Equus, which, when performed, involves a character supposed to be 17 doing exactly that.
    
    The horses on stage are supposed to be “real” horses, but are performed by human actors. The male actor in these scenes is also typically nude.
    
    NGL, it’s a HEAVY play to read and even heavier to watch, but it also won the 1975 Tony Award for best play…
    
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Arcane2077@sh.itjust.works ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
No place for challenging art in video games. Books and movies have been pushing boundaries for millennia, but this new medium is way too effective at affecting people

-Valve, probably

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- markz@suppo.fi ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  I guess you wouldn’t be wrong to say that CSAM is challenging and pushes boundaries.
  
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  - Arcane2077@sh.itjust.works ⁨16⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    CSAM has nothing to do with this conversation. Are you lost?
    
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- cronenthal@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  It is available on other, quite popular, stores. GOG and itch.io are household names in PC gaming.
  
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  - Zorque@lemmy.world ⁨17⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    As long as that house exclusively uses Linux.
    
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clay_pidgin@sh.itjust.works ⁨20⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Is it actually any good? I don’t really play horror, but it mostly just looks odd in the trailer.

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- hexx@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨19⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  
  Making the matter even more frustrating is the fact that Horses is apparently quite good—or at least, it accomplishes what it sets out to do. The content is decidedly uncomfortable but reviews and reactions on social media are largely positive
  
  From the article.
  
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- Arcane2077@sh.itjust.works ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  It’s horrific, not horror.
  
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Kolanaki@pawb.social ⁨18⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
I am just gonna pretend like Epic and GOG banned it only after see all this PR work they’re trying to do to save this god awful looking piece of “art.”

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