For context: The thread was about why people hate Hexbear and Lemmygrad instances
People hate hexbear and memmygrad because they are annoying.
[META] Never change, lemmy.ml
Submitted 11 months ago by Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee to mildlyinfuriating@lemmy.world
https://i.imgur.com/1pxAyiq.jpg
Comments
fhek@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 months ago
I left lemm.ee after a mod told me not to use profanity.
lud@lemm.ee 11 months ago
What? I assume you mean admin.
They haven’t told me anything and I use profanity all the time.
It’s also not in the instance rules.
fhek@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 months ago
Admin/Mod whatever. This is the message I got after reporting a troll and telling them off.
NatoBoram@lemm.ee 11 months ago
A mod? It’s not like changing instance will do anything in that case
Jackthelad@lemmy.world 11 months ago
I’ve always found it odd why we don’t treat communism in the same vein as Nazism.
They’re both horrific ideologies that have led to the deaths of millions, but one is considered trendy.
ChicoSuave@lemmy.world 11 months ago
They are radically different but authoritarians have corrupted both to be the same brute force regime. Communism shouldn’t have any specific single leader. It should be a conference of lots of little communities that participate together to make a state work. Sadly authoritarian ideals corrupt politics and make people want to rule that should never be leaders in the first place. Those leaders install their own friends who run the government into the ground - and it’s the government model that is to blame?
pleasemakesense@lemmy.world 11 months ago
communism has somehow become synonymous with marxism-leninism, it’s very sad
Tedesche@lemmy.world 11 months ago
and it’s the government model that is to blame?
Yes, because it leaves itself so prone to authoritarian takeover. As I’ve said before, this is a feature of communism, not a bug. A single, one-party “transitional” government is intended. You might as well just put up a sign that says “Dictator Wanted.” This is why there isn’t a single instance of communism on a nation-state scale that hasn’t quickly devolved into an authoritarian state. It’s not hard to understand this. Your government model has to account for the reality that people are going to disagree on things and faction out. Your model has to be able to manage that process. Communism insists everyone adhere to the same ideology, and those that don’t just get “re-educated.” It’s a horrible ideology, a horrible government model; naïve utopian fantasy at best, cynical authoritarian scheme at worst.
Eldritch@lemmy.world 11 months ago
You are spot on on just about everything. The only thing I take issue with is saying that both werr corrupted by authoritarians. Fascism doesn’t exist without authoritarians. It’s just a shame that in America, especially as well as plenty of other places in the west, we are miseducated if we are educated at all on the subject.
snooggums@kbin.social 11 months ago
Communism scales horribly and practically begs for intolerant authoritarians to take over because the structure promotes compromise and compromising with intolerance ends up with intolerance. It works well when a small group voluntarily creates a small commune and everyone is on the same page. Everyone being able to see the overall community is pretty important for them to see how they fit in.
Capitalism also scales terribly, but when approached as a competition that requires regulation at least it can scale better because everyone can be watchful of bad actors. It still scales poorly because large companies can gain undo influence over government, but at least that influence tends to be about business and profit and not ethnic cleansing of the 'wrong people' that tends to be inherent to large scale communism. Yeah, that can also happen for profit with capitalism too, but again the acknowledgement of necessary regulations can mitigate that for the most part.
Everything tends to fall apart at a large enough scale though.
DreamerofDays@kbin.social 11 months ago
If the model realized at scale repeatedly results in the same or similar effects, maybe there is something wrong with the model.
(Be those inherent mechanical flaws, flaws of ignoring parts of human nature, flaws of a model designed to work in a vacuum, or flaws of intricate and fragile necessary rules)
relevants@feddit.de 11 months ago
It’s not “considered trendy”, your understanding of communism – an economic system – is just conflated with authoritarianism – a political system. You can advocate for one without advocating for the other.
That said, capitalism also leads to the deaths of millions, but somehow that’s just an unquestionable fact of life.
solivine@sopuli.xyz 11 months ago
I honestly don’t see how the idea of everyone getting an equal share is an extremist idea in the same vein as a racist ideology. I’m also unsure why you’re being downvoted for pointing out the obvious there.
Shiggles@sh.itjust.works 11 months ago
Oh gee if only there was a single example of communists that actually acted on some of these purported principles instead of turning authoritarian the first chance they get
No, social democracies don’t count. They are what tankies SHOULD strive for, instead of sucking off… checks notes famous beacons of liberty Russia and China.
Jackthelad@lemmy.world 11 months ago
capitalism also leads to the deaths of millions
Citation needed.
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 11 months ago
Perhaps it’s us greedy humans that’s the issue and the economic model only limits how completely we can fuck things up. Badly if it’s up to capilatism and really badly if we go for communism.
kSPvhmTOlwvMd7Y7E@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Because one of them promoted racial superiority in its main book, while the other equally hated everyone? Do your research!
constnt@lemmy.world 11 months ago
I completely understand where you are coming from, but you got to realize that that concept of communism has been warped by western propaganda and selective education.
People hungry for power will use what ever ideology appeals to the people to gain power. Look at Donald Trump. He was historically a Democrat from New York uninterested in politics. He ran as a Democrat the first time but made no headlines. He switched parties and started talking pro-christian rhetoric. He is very obvious no Christian.
You see it with “Protect the children” anti-abortion groups. Who have no interest in actually protecting children. Groups that target trans people with the same stance have no interest in actually protecting children. Groups who are say they want to stamp out pedophilia use it to target privacy laws.
And you have groups like Nazis and Lenist who used socialism and communism as a means to an end. Those groups used those movements to consolidate power and wealth to the 1%, and used violence against others as a way to ensure their continued control, they were neither communist or socialist in practice, only in their speech.
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 11 months ago
Well they’re considered just as fringe group by pretty much everyone else except for the people subscribing to it. Ofcourse they’ll soon rush to tell you how their idea of communism is different and will actually lead to utopia but just imagine a noe-nazi trying that same argument.
sinedpick@awful.systems 11 months ago
It would do you a lot of good to actually read about communism and political theory in general instead of acting as a conduit of brain rot.
skullgiver@popplesburger.hilciferous.nl 11 months ago
Criticism of communism on Lemmy is like criticising the far right on Truth Social. Whether or arguments are good or not (“communists are basically nazis” just isn’t true), you’re criticising ideals on a platform mostly set up for people disenfranchised for those ideals.
While I don’t exactly agree with your comment, I find it quite ridiculous that your comment was removed. Just let the downvotes do their job, this didn’t need mod intervention.
It’s quite unfortunate that so many normal people and communities have concentrated on .ml, unlike Lemmygrad you can’t really defederate .ml without missing out on valuable interaction.
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 11 months ago
[deleted]wildginger@lemmy.myserv.one 11 months ago
Then you need to review your understanding of common english words, because thats what the comment you made says.
Tedesche@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Lemmy overall is just difference shades of red. Picking your instance just allows you to select pink vs. crimson.
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 11 months ago
lemmy.world mods will probably soon prove you right
moosetwin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 months ago
EDIT: Users were quicker
that is actually really funny
grff@lemmy.world 11 months ago
It’s great. The more you get down voted the more you are proven to be right LOL
HarkMahlberg@kbin.social 11 months ago
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 11 months ago
Thanks! I didn’t know about that one
Non kbin link:
!meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works
metaStatic@kbin.social 11 months ago
I'll just leave this here
HarkMahlberg@kbin.social 11 months ago
Thanks. I tried to post the original link but it just says "No posts." Weird.
alienanimals@lemmy.world 11 months ago
The comment might be controversial, but it shouldn’t be a bannable offense.
TSG_Asmodeus@lemmy.world 11 months ago
It sure is a Blockable one though.
A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 11 months ago
So many people here trying to argue dictionary definitions and hide behind technicalities to make their little slice of authoritarianism better than that other slice of authoritarianism.
Globulart@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Welcome to lemmy.
Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
You compared communists to ethno-staters. There’s extremist and there’s radical.
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 11 months ago
I didn’t claim they’re the same. They’re all extremist however. Wanting to overhaul the entire economic system is kind of extreme, don’t you think?
Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
Its radical, not extremist.
homicidalrobot@lemm.ee 11 months ago
The comment literally reads “they would hardly be any different”. What’s your point? That sweeping change is “kind of extreme”? Is this satire?
Fades@lemmy.world 11 months ago
30 days, how kind. Looks like you have something to do 12/23
crystal@feddit.de 11 months ago
What do you expect to happen when you call a group of people “hardly any different [to nazis]”?
Communism does not advocate genocide any more than capitalism does. A capitalist society may commit genocide, a communist society may commit genocide. Neither are required to by their economic systems.
National socialism directly advocates for genocide.
It’s a ridiculous statement to compare communists to nazis and it’s not unsurprising that insulting communists like that will get you banned.
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 11 months ago
They’re all fringe extremists groups.
Ibaudia@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Not everything outside the Overton Window is equally bad
Grimy@lemmy.world 11 months ago
Red scare
FrenLivesMatter@lemmy.today 11 months ago
So “eat the rich” is just edgy humor or what?
Weird, because somehow, every time that every time communism has been tried, it involved massive genocide, though perhaps one could argue that the majority of it was the result of incompetency, because the majority of the victims starved to death as a result of disastrous agricultural policies.
The Holodomor in the Ukraine killed about 3.5-5 million people. The Great Leap Forward killed somewhere between 15-55 million. The Khmer Rouge killed about a million. And I’m not trying to make excuses for National Socialism here, but you have to admit that even when taking to low estimates, communism’s death toll is far higher than that of the Nazis. OP is correct, they’re all evil ideologies.
Sources: en.wikipedia.org/…/Mass_killings_under_communist_… en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_Fields en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 11 months ago
I’m pretty sure “eat the rich” is not comparable to “kill 5 million Ukrainians.”
And I’m also pretty sure ‘rich person’ is neither an ethnicity nor a nationality.
crystal@feddit.de 11 months ago
Wait til you find out how many people were killed by capitalist governments
xor@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 months ago
This argument is so frustrating, because it totally ignores the fact that the common thread, both for communist countries and capitalist countries, and both for intentional genocide and crises through incompetence, is the consolidation of power in a small set of individuals or group that prioritises their own self interest over the common good.
The big issue with “trying” communism is that it historically has only really occurred through violent revolution. The political instability in these situations gives a perfect opportunity for the seizing of power by exactly those kinds of people.
Never mind the fact that genocide is absolutely not limited to communist countries, and that genocide goes against the actual fundamental principles of a communist system, which is centred on equality.
Yes, the USSR committed genocide - so did Britain and America, and so are modern capitalist Russia and China right now.
There’s loads of good reasons both for and against every economic system, communism included. But “communism=genocide lalalala” is just a cheap excuse to totally avoid considering the merits of a different economic system. Doing that denies yourself the opportunity to genuinely consider how a different economic approach, whether that’s communism or just using concepts from the ideology, could improve the lives of citizens in a healthy democracy.
wildginger@lemmy.myserv.one 11 months ago
Every time capitalism has been tried, it also involved massive genocide.
Funny, but it turns out that every economic system invented by humans has massive genocide in its history.
Wild, its almost like the genocide was a power grab tactic, and not something inherent to these economic systems.
TopRamenBinLaden@sh.itjust.works 11 months ago
Rich people are not a race. So “genocide” doesn’t really make sense there. “Eat the rich” does not mean “kill the rich”, necessarily, either.
SCB@lemmy.world 11 months ago
I report every “guillotine” comment I ever see but don’t care enough to look at the modlog to see if any action was taken