I am about to board a flight. What sequence of events would occur if (by chance) for no apparent reason a window got completely smashed out?

Comments

• Ziggurat@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  In flight?

  1. Musk would fall down

  2. The crew will start an emergency descent to a breathable altitude

  3. The crew will call a may day and reroute to the nearest suitable airport

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  • PM_Your_Nudes_Please@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Worth noting that the masks in the cabin aren’t designed to keep you awake. They’re just designed to keep you alive. They’re basically just hydrogen peroxide and a catalyst, which mixes when you pull the mask down. The resulting chemical reaction produces a small amount of oxygen for a short time. This is also why the instructions say to put your own mask on before helping any children; You only have 15-30 seconds of usable consciousness before you pass out, so you need the mask to stay awake long enough to help anyone else. The pilots are the only ones who actually have masks good enough to stay awake, and that’s why they immediately dive to a breathable altitude.

    Also, the entire cabin would immediately fog from the sudden pressure and temperature change. We’re talking “can’t even see your fingertips when your arm is outstretched” levels of fog.

    And while we’re talking about it, the cabin would suddenly be cold. Like absolutely fucking freezing.

    Lastly, your ears will painfully pop, and will likely ring for a while afterwards. The sudden pressure change will feel like you got slapped on the ears.

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    • LostNetizen@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Concise, interesting. Will pm you a nude.

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    • AlecSadler@sh.itjust.works ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Tell me more about this immediate fog thing, what causes it and what doesn’t it clear quickly?

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  • valkyre09@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    That’s exactly what I want in a situation like that, the crew to respond like it’s any other Tuesday.

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• NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  It depends very much on the height.

  If we assume a jet flight at around 30.000 feet:

  The cabin pressure goes down immediately, that means, a very strong wind goes out of this open window. Several eardrums burst. Afterwards people cannot breathe normally because of the low pressure… They need these air masks.

  Then the pilot descends immediately to something like 5.000 feet - I don’t know exactly - where everybody can breathe normally again.

  And then you land at the next airport.

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  • chillinit@lemmynsfw.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Halfway decent comment so adding more:

    The emergency descent altitude is almost always 10,000 feet. This is because most people will be able to breath without the oxygen mask at this altitude. But, do not take off your mask.

    They do not descend lower because, succinctly, what if all engine power is lost? If that happens then the pilots want enough altitude to have enough time to try and restart the engines and, failing engine restart, to extend gliding range in effort to maximize choices of where to land.

    Qualifications: expired VFR license (not a commercial pilot)

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    • SzethFriendOfNimi@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      And to add to the dialog (if there’s anything incorrect please let me know) from videos I’ve seen by MentourPilot, Captain Joe and online sources

      The process will most likely look like the following:

      • They will put on their own o2 masks (it’s critical to do this as you can lose consciousness in under a minute)

      • They will radio the distress both for ATC but also nearby planes to give them a heads up that they’ll be rapidly descending. If it’s in a high traffic area they may wait for approval to begin descent (and you can be sure ATC is going to be moving planes out of the way.). If it’s taking too long they will begin descending anyway.

      • They will start a rapid descent to 10,000 ft (if terrain allows it, otherwise down to whatever they can safely get to). This is because the emergency o2 is limited to about 15 minutes.

      Some interesting things I learned about this.

      They will often use autopilot for the descent and level flight. This is because of limited visibility and a risk of possible issues caused by low o2.

      This descent will be really unpleasant. Not a gentle descent but the safest one (especially if they’re unsure if there’s any structural issues) they can do. Which will be quite a bit steeper than anybody is used to.

      So passengers on the plane will experience this as:

      • Loud rushing noise. Possible moisture filling the cabin now that you have outside cold air mixing with
      • Masks dropping and seatbelt signs
      • The sound of the wings adjusting for speed brakes, shuddering from the flight profile change,
      • Flight screw scrambling to seats and putting on masks
      • The nose of the plane tipping down. It will feel like it’s faster than it really is with the shift in gravity followed by being pressed back due to the increase in speed during descent.

      Not a fun experience I’m sure

      Some sources to check out

      Emergency descend!! Cockpit video

      Pressurisation Problems: Guidance for Flight Crews

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  • glimse@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Stupid people panic and cry

    I’m not sure I’d call it STUPID to panic when something extremely scary happens to you…

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    • Dark_Arc@social.packetloss.gg ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I mean, I wouldn’t exactly call it smart either. Panic is pretty useless in situations where flight is not an option.

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    • NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Would you agree that it is wise not to panic?

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  • Skunk@jlai.lu ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Standard procedure is max FL100 or 10 000 ft.

    But if you are flying over mountains (FL180 for the Alps highest safe flight level) you are fucked.

    Well no, there are oxygen masks and the pilots will immediately put them on and then dive toward a safer altitude at a controlled but fast rate of descent (more eardrums bursts).

    Airbus Procedure is basically “Pull everything on the MCP !”:

    • masks on for both pilots,
    • checks interphone com with your Captain/FO.
    • On the MCP, autopilot set altitude to max FL100 or below (above if mountains), pull for open descent,
    • pull for HDG and go off track (outside the airway to avoid collisions).
    • Pull for max Speed or appropriate (not in managed mode anymore, this will change your rate of descent).
    • Speedbrakes max.
    • Transponder 7700
    • Then you can call Mayday on radio.
    • You also check that the masks had been automatically lowered in the cabin at that point.

    And A320 should descent at around 7000ft per minute. Could be more or less, it’s the pilot choice and how much he is willing to stress an airframe that just had an explosive decompression.

    Rapid decompressions are very rare events tho. Except maybe on 737 max.

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• spankmonkey@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  DISCLAIMER – I am not planning on smashing the window on an airplane.

  That’s what someone who plans on smashing the window on a plane would say.

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  • NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    That’s what someone who plans on smashing the window on a plane would say.

    I disagree, respectfully.

    If I were planning on smashing the window on a plane, then I would say:

    …

    …

    …

    (drums rolling)

    …

    …

    …

    Nothing at all.

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    • CuddlyCassowary@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Stupid sexy Flanders.

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    • Natanael@slrpnk.net ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      A drum roll can’t break an airplane window

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  • sem@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Nah they wouldn’t post at all

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• adespoton@lemmy.ca ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Worth pointing out that it is highly unlikely for an airplane window to either smash or pop out — they’re multi-layered Lexan reinforced panes mounted from the inside. And they’ve all got a hole on the inside pane so that a controlled decompression with a loud whistling would happen long before the entire pane would give way. This would likely provide time for the masks to drop and the pilot to adjust altitude long before any explosive decompression (if that even occurred).

  Likewise, doors are designed not to open at altitude.

  So the only weak spots these days are door plugs and the bathrooms.

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  • TedZanzibar@feddit.uk ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Pedant, but the pressure difference between 1 atmosphere and zero isn’t all that great, so explosive decompression wouldn’t happen even in the worst case scenario. Rapid yes, explosive no.

    To be explosive you need something like the Byford Dolphin diving bell incident, which was 9 atmospheres to 1 in a fraction of a second.

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  • LordWiggle@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    True, unless it’s a Boeing.

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  • Pika@sh.itjust.works ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    out of personal curiosity, why is the bathroom concidered a weak point? I understand the door plug but I figured the bathroom is a locked down area

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• ProfessorScience@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  They probably wouldn’t take off.

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  • nuez_jr@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Absolutely won’t be taking off on that plane; it’s not going to be a 30-minute Safelite AeroGlass™️ appointment. And airlines don’t keep planes sitting around not making money so they won’t have a spare aircraft available to fly that route so all the passengers will likely get hotel and meal vouchers and changed tickets for the next day.

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• litchralee@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I’m assuming your question pertains to a window failure while still on the airport grounds prior to takeoff. If instead you meant a window failure while airborne, I would suggest this Mentour Pilot video about Southwest Flight 1380 where an engine defect threw shrapnel at one of the cabin windows, smashing it open with disastrous effects.

  Supposing the window failed prior to opening the jet bridge to allow passengers to board, it probably would have been noticed by the flight crew – ie the pilots, cabin staff – while doing their preflight preparations and checks, or by the ground crew, while loading baggage or food/supplies. Once notified, the boarding process would be delayed as the pilots assess whether the flight can continue – definitely not – and then the captain would use their authority to reject the aircraft for that flight, calling in the maintenance team and the airline so they can take the next steps. Practically speaking, this flight will be either heavily delayed or outright cancelled.

  If instead the window failed after closing the doors and the aircraft has started taxiing to the runway, then there are some complications. With everyone seated for taxiing, passengers are not supposed to start walking around to notify the cabin crew. But the cabin crew may already be walking the aisles to check for stowed trays, seatbelts for takeoff, baggage obstructions, etc. So if they see a smashed window, that’s an obvious sign that the cabin is not secured for takeoff. At the end of the cabin checks, the cabin crew would normally telephone the pilots to convey a secure cabin. Here, they would explain the situation and the pilots would contact ground control to return back to the terminal.

  But supposing the window broke after the cabin was declared secure, and the aircraft is about to line up onto the runway. In this case, everyone including the cabin crew are sat down, so a passenger who sees the window can’t really get the cabin crew’s attention by pressing the overhead button. Barring some sort of additional malfunction that the pilots could notice – like a major engine malfunction – this aircraft might actually take off.

  When taxiing, the pilots have a number of things to do, and so the “sterile cockpit” rule means that no non-operational chitchat is allowed, to allow them to focus. Mentour Pilot has other videos on what happens when the rule is violated. Likewise, the cabin crew are trained to not disturb the pilots unless something absolutely flight endangering is happening, at least for the first few thousand feet of takeoff climb.

  The theory is as follows: if an aircraft is on the ground and stationary, it is safe. If the aircraft is at cruising altitude and cruising speed, it is safe. But if it’s at low altitude (<1000 ft; 330 m), then it’s very easy for the flight to go sour. Hence, once an aircraft has reached a certain point in taxiing, it will basically want to take off. And we still have the problem that the pilots don’t even know the window broke.

  So the aircraft rolls down the runway and takes off. Crisis? Not really. The plane will climb quickly up to some 3000-5000 ft, at which point the plane is configured for a steady climb to cruise. This is when the pressurization system would engage, since cabins need to keep the pressure to a breathable level. Although the system may also have noticed that the cabin pressure stayed the same as the outside air pressure for the entire climb. That’s a clear sign of a cabin air leak, and the system would indicate to the pilots of a pressurization failure.

  This is the first indicator for the pilots, although at this stage in the flight, the cabin crew may also phone the pilots since they start walking around earlier than 10,000 ft altitude. A pressurization failure or broken window means the pilots must halt their climb and remain below 10,000 ft, which is the upper limit for human breathing without supplemental oxygen. The pilots would radio to ATC and request a return to the airport, or another nearby airport if need be. A pan-pan or mayday could be declared, depending on the captain’s assessment of the situation, or to obtain priority over any other aircraft wanting to land.

  The last scenario before the Flight 1380 scenario is if the window broke just as the aircraft was passing 10,000 ft altitude, so there was no earlier indication of a cabin leak. In this case, there will indeed be a cabin depressurization, although it won’t be as severe as at cruise altitude. Some aircraft will automatically drop the oxygen masks, and the pilots will don their own masks, now cognizant that a full-blown emergency is underway. This is handled the same way: bring the aircraft down to a breathable altitude and call ATC. The oxygen masks are good for some 20 minutes, which is well more than enough time to return to a lower altitude and make a plan.

  TL;DR: the entirety of Mentour Pilot’s YouTube back catalog truly sheds light on how the aviation industry keeps people safe. I highly recommend.

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  • Ziggurat@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    safe. But if it’s at low altitude (<1000 ft; 330 m), then it’s very easy for the flight to go sour.

    When I talk about paragliding, normal people are weirded out when I tell that I am safer 1000m agl than 30m AGL. But we call the 5-50m aglthe death zone. If shit hits the fan, I have no time to react nor to pull the reserve. Lower, helmet and airbag would limit the damage,higher I can try something, but at low height you don’t have much time to react and need to be 100% focused

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    • litchralee@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I’m only a passive yet very interested observer of aviation but am also a fairly avid cyclist. I think the equivalent analog for bikes is that it’s much easier to track a straight line when doing 50 kph than at 5 kph. Just like airspeed is needed for rudder surfaces to work, cyclists need speed to maintain horizontal balance and manoruverability.

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• therealjcdenton@lemmy.zip ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  That one right there officer

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• schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  At what point in time? If the aircraft is still on the ground, it wouldn’t take off in that condition, i.e. you would be ordered to leave it again and need to take a different one. The explanation by @NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world is, I think, correct for what would happen if that happened during the flight.

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  • NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    At what point in time? If the aircraft is still on the ground

    As I said, assuming a height of 30.000

    I admit that I don’t know if there’s any airports where the ground is at that height… ;-)

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    • schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I was replying to OP, not you. OP didn’t specify this.

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• NutinButNet@hilariouschaos.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  There’s a YouTube video on one time this happened and a woman was sucked out of the window partially and ended up passing away as a result. She was seated directly beside that window when this happened and others were trying to pull her in. The plane took an emergency action to land as soon as possible. She didn’t completely exit the window, but was partially out of the window.

  Sorry I didn’t give you a story with a nicer ending, but just know that this is rare and doesn’t happen often. The odds of this happening are almost similar to winning the lottery. People are scared of flying, in general, but you’re generally safer in the air than in a car, statistically speaking for something to happen.

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  • NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    you’re generally safer in the air than in a car, statistically speaking

    Yes, m very much so. The airplane is the second safest means of transportation.

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  • I_Miss_Daniel@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Similar happened to a pilot some years ago when the windscreen ejected itself. (wrong bolts if I remember the air crash investigation episode.) He survived though. Was held by co pilot.

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    • TheRealKuni@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      That story is REMARKABLE. I’ve seen the Air Disasters version and the Mentour Pilot version and both are told very well.

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  • Golfnbrew@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Yep, something like one plane per day would have to go down to equal US auto deaths.

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• jeffw@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  It would suck stuff out, the oxygen masks would drop, they’d land the plane

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  • NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    By the way:

    Does anybody know if it is actually oxygen that comes out of these masks?

    I think it could also be normal clean air at a suitable pressure.

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    • Munkisquisher@lemmy.nz ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      It’s pure oxygen skybrary.aero/articles/aircraft-oxygen-systems

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    • IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I think its a chemical generator that activates then you pull on it and genderated oxygen for up to 10 minutes, but that’s enough tine for pilots to get the plant to 10,000 feet or below, which has breathable air.

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• HowManyNimons@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Mr Goldfinger would fly arse first from his seat to plug the hole.

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  • hakunawazo@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    No Mr. Bond, I expect you to FLY.

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• PixellatedDave@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Always have your belt on.

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