What the hell is this shit? Instead of pushing for the return to traditional pensions, capitalism is celebrating the idea that Millennials & Gen Z may simply never be able to stop working.

Submitted ⁨⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨ASK_ME_ABOUT_LOOM@sh.itjust.works⁩ to ⁨workreform@lemmy.world⁩

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/10/23/soft-saving-trends-reshape-gen-z-millennials-personal-finance-goals.html

Traditionally, retiring entails leaving the workforce permanently. However, experts found that the very definition of retirement is also changing between generations.

About 41% of Gen Z and 44% of millennials — those who are currently between 27 and 42 years old — are significantly more likely to want to do some form of paid work during retirement.

…

This increasing preference for a lifelong income, could perhaps make the act of “retiring” obsolete.

Although younger workers don’t intend to stop working, there is still an effort to beef up their retirement savings.

It’s ok! Don’t ever retire! Just work until you die, preferably not at work, where we’d have to deal with the removal of your corpse.

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theodewere@kbin.social ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
greedy people have all the money, you just have to take it from them.. they're not going to give up their wealth and power because it's the right thing to do..

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- TinyPizza@kbin.social ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  Would be a shame if some internet pals showed up with cyber punk guillotines and a fanny pack full of Mollys and said "pick one."
  
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  - theodewere@kbin.social ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    well, let's just agree that a bunch of rich assholes have a whole lot of learning to do, one way or another
    
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j4k3@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
The only solution is to eat the rich.

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Matriks404@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
I don’t mind working to old age, as long as I can have 6 hour workdays. But let’s be reasonable, no 80 year old grandpa is going to be productive at work.

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CCL@links.hackliberty.org ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
As a worker I don’t like the idea of a pension. It’s too easy for some future regime to just get rid of my retirement fund. As long as wage slavery exist I would rather own my own retirement plan.

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- FlyingSquid@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  It’s just as easy for a market crash to get rid of your private retirement fund.
  
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  - orrk@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    you don’t even need a market crash, just a corrupt investor managing the fund
    
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  - JasSmith@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    Diversify homie.
    
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  - CosmicCleric@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    
    It’s just as easy for a market crash to get rid of your private retirement fund.
    
    You don’t lose it all though, at least eventually it’ll recover, to the range of somewhat to total amount of the loss.
    
    If it crashes five minutes before you want to retire, then yeah you’re screwed. That’s why you try to have a balanced retirement plan.
    
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CatradoraSomething@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
They’re almost asking us to become Lenin at this point

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RagingRobot@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
It’s interesting that we have a generation of politicians who refuse to retire, meanwhile the generations behind them see the option to retire going away. Maybe there is a connection?

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Jakeroxs@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
As a millennial, I probably would also want to work a bit in retirement for fun, but not like the job I work now, something more chill or maybe freelance projects.

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- therealrjp@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  Lots of people start their working careers with the mindset of continuing to do some form of work in retirement. As you get closer, that opinion often changes.
  
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  - Jakeroxs@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    Fair, guess we’ll have to see :p
    
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qyron@sopuli.xyz ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
That makes no sense.

Speaking for myself, I plan to remain active for as long as I can manage because I’ve seen what retirement causes to people. Vegetating on a sofa in front of a TV is not a good way to spend your last stretch on this planet. But neither is working.

And even when I no longer have interest in working for a salary, I want to remain active. Hopefully I’ll have grandchildren to help with, my dogs to train and a garden to tend. But I do want to retire and expect everyone to do the same.

The way the system is being “overhauled” is bonkers. I was listening to a podcast the other day where it was calculated that for the EU, by 2050, pensions would be around 45% of the final salary earned, with some exceptions reaching 95%.

I don’t expect for my (hopefully) pension to cover for luxuries but I do expect it to aid me maintaining a decent, even if frugal, standard of living. I do not want a millionaire pension, like many paid today, over tens of thousands of Euros.

Be brave and set maximum values for pensions. I’ve known people with pensions over €5000; minimum wage in my country is €765x14: that’s €10.710, yearly, before taxes. Do rest of the math in your head. A few years back, it was outed the highest pension paid in the country was around €120.000, per month. That is insane. Meanwhile, many receive pensions below €200.

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- CosmicCleric@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  
  Vegetating on a sofa in front of a TV is not a good way to spend your last stretch on this planet. But neither is working.
  
  Just as an FYI, older people do such things not because want to, but because their bodies’ current condition won’t let them do otherwise.
  
  You really do start going downhill quickly in your late 50s, healthwise.
  
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  - qyron@sopuli.xyz ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    Regardless every person being different from the next, spending days on end watching brainrot television is not a good way to spend your life.
    
    Even with reduced mobility, a person can enjoy other things. Reading, writing, listen to music, solve puzzles, etc. There are numerous activities to persue.
    
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Esqplorer@lemmy.zip ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
Retirement sounds like hell to me and has long seemed merely like a way to convince massive amounts of the population to delay taking earnings (pensions) or indirectly give their money to hedge fund managers to operate against their interests.

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- SuddenDownpour@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  There are barely no conceptual issues with retirement in countries with public pension systems. Whatever the hell you guys have got going on in the US is a problem with the US implementation.
  
  If you personally want to keep working at an old age, that’s ok, but you should still respect other people’s right to be sustained by society when they’re too weak or feeble to properly gain their own bread.
  
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  - Esqplorer@lemmy.zip ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    How did I not respect others?
    
    I’m American, so I legitimately forgot other nations refer to social security retirement plans as pensions when I wrote that.
    
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  - pound_heap@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    In rich countries with public pension systems. Of course you would have no problem to retire if public pension is good enough for decent living
    
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M0oP0o@mander.xyz ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
HA, I hope people realize how a large amount of Gen X are not able to retire. This is just accepted that now for people under a certain threshold of wealth retirement is but a fantasy.

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pascal@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
“traditional pensions” is a misleading lie. The idea of ceasing to work after reaching a certain age, has been around since around the 18th century, quite new stuff considering how long homo sapiens is around.

And don’t get angry at me, I personally think it’s a great thing, I’m not an entrepeneur, I’m salaried and I’m hoping to retire eventually, but how the world economics is going, I’m not holding my breath.

Retirement plans worked great during the wars, lots of fine men never reclaiming their retirement money after years of paying for it because they’re all KIA. More money to share with fewer people.

Then, after the war, we got the baby boom, lots of fresh meat eager to work to support the retirement of the previous workforce, or what remains of that, after all the PTSD and diseases.

Now? Since you are reading this here on Lemmy, I’m supposing you’re tech savy, educated and curious. So you already know population is shrinking around the (first) world. Retirement plans as we know are not sustainable.

What I suggest, is talk to your bank, your consultant, your insurance. Figure out what kind of products they offer as “private retirement plans” and what’s their suggestion. Don’t expect the government to do something for you (especially in the US).

Do it yesterday, if not possible, then as soon as you can. The earlier you start planning your future, the better.

And if you change your mind, you could always withdraw that money and buy a house, which is something almost impossible until you escape the “living paycheck to paycheck” mentality.

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- CosmicCleric@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  
  “private retirement plans”
  
  Were you speaking towards a SEP/IRA?
  
  Don’t expect the government to do something for you (especially in the US).
  
  When everything is said and done, I can’t see them ever ever letting Social Security fail, at all. That would truly be the spark of a revolution if so.
  
  Older voters are the best voters, so at the end of the day they’ll make sure that stuff stays intact, one way or the other. Even if it means they have to build less battleships, etc.
  
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  - pascal@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    
    Older voters are the best voters, so at the end of the day they’ll make sure that stuff stays intact, one way or the other.
    
    you know? that’s actually a valid point.
    
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- zbyte64@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  Living paycheck to paycheck isn’t a mentality… But pushing personal responsibility for what is a societal issue certainly is.
  
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  - pascal@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    I can agree with you. Thankfully I live in Europe where it’s good ethics for politicians thinking about societal issues, but in the “land of the free” that’s a luxury most people don’t expect. So help yourself.
    
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ArbitraryValue@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
I don’t think this is necessarily negative. I’m a millennial in that 44% and I’m in no hurry to retire because my profession is my identity. I hope I live a long time, but I also hope that I can work until I die. What would I even do if I didn’t work? I tried taking a year off once but I lasted a month before I was bored and looking for job.

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- aeki@slrpnk.net ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  In a way i can see why you think you’re lucky as you will suffer less in these terrible times, but damn, there are so many things I want to do in life that I’ll run out of time before I run out of things.
  
  I have a decent non-shitty job, but I’d drop that in a second if I didn’t need it. It takes such a chunk of my life.
  
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- FlyingSquid@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  
  my profession is my identity
  
  How very sad for you.
  
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  - ArbitraryValue@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    Eh, no one says “how sad” when a person’s Identity is creating art. I’m an engineer so I create practical things, but that doesn’t mean I have less passion for what I do.
    
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faction2145@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
There must be an advocation for a universal monthly social security payment (and expanded universal medicaid) from birth. Fund them in the short term by eliminating the taxable income cap for OASDI.

If we were in a functioning society that responded to actual issues… Gotta finish the civil war first tho.

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- rustyriffs@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  Taxable income cap for what?
  
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  - faction2145@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
    OASDI is the program name for social security. It stands for Old Age, Survivors Disability Insurance en.wikipedia.org/…/Social_Security_(United_States…
    
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Copernican@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
Hell of a fake new editorialize. Where is the “celebration” in this article? You could equally spin this article as “Gen Z and Millennials refuse to contribute to generational wealth and prioritize making capital enrich their lives instead.”

“However, this fear may not be that much of a concern for the younger generation, as most are actually looking to retire early — or to retire at all, the report by Intuit showed.

Traditionally, retiring entails leaving the workforce permanently. However, experts found that the very definition of retirement is also changing between generations.”

I am seeing that with my parents. My dad has had offers to make some pretty good cash as a consultant for a few hours a week here or there. In some industries, like law, a retired judge can make bank working in arbitration where they can pick up just a little work for a good pay check to keep them busy and have more fun money. And then there’s the God’s work that is unpaid, child care for grandchildren. For a generation that has lower birth rates as a personal choice, I can see those folks looking to do part time work if it’s enjoyable and supports their other endeavors.

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random65837@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
Aside from that being an opinion of a software company, as stupid as millennials and especially gen Z can be, their logic isn’t totally flawed either.

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Amadou_WhatIWant@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

capitalism is celebrating

capitalism is not a person

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- randomdeadguy@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
  You’re right, it is an ideology.
  
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OrteilGenou@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago
It’s better for a few to break up pension investment and have a generation die at a desk, perhaps

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What the hell is this shit? Instead of pushing for the return to traditional pensions, capitalism is celebrating the idea that Millennials &amp; Gen Z may simply never be able to stop working.

Comments

What the hell is this shit? Instead of pushing for the return to traditional pensions, capitalism is celebrating the idea that Millennials & Gen Z may simply never be able to stop working.