What options of resistance are programmers creating to not submit to AI culture?

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• supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Unionize

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• Yaky@slrpnk.net ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  AI is a tech debt generator.

  Any programmer who worked with legacy code knows a situation where something was written by a former employee or a contractor without much comments or documentation, making it difficult to modify (because of complexity or readability) or replace (because of non-existing business documentation and/or peculiar bugs and features)

  AI accelerates these situations, but the person does not even exist. Which, IMO is the main thing that needs to be called out.

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  • AA5B@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Yeah I’ve been trying to call this out at my company. Junior programmers, especially , do t seem to know how to turn ai responses into maintainable code

    I find it ironic since ive mostly been on the QA side of dev. I’ve spent decades pointing out the stats that code is much more expensive to maintain than it is to write the first time, so now AI puts us in a position of writing something the first time a little faster, but that’s even more expensive to maintain. Does not compute

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  • shalafi@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Not if you use it correctly. You don’t write code with AI, you get inspiration to get over sticking points. You pick out the relevant bits, make certain you understand how they work, save hours of banging your head.

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    • expr@programming.dev ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Ah yes, “just use it correctly”. All these programmers convinced that they are one of the chosen few that “get it” and can somehow magically make it not a damaging, colossal waste of time.

      “Inspiration”, yeah, in the same way we can draw “inspiration” from a monkey throwing shit at a wall.

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    • corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Not if you use it correctly.

      Ah! “Git gud” elitism to paper over the risk.

      The issue still stands: what few seniors you still have at the shop who can tell people WHY something is a bad idea, are now distracted with juniors submitting absolute shit code for review and needing to be taught why that structure is a bad idea.

      “Well everyone else is doing it” was a bad rebuttal when you wanted to go to Chuck’s party and Mom said no. Laundering “this is what everyone else writes” through an Ai concentrator when 2 generations of coders are self-taught and unmentored after the great post-y2k purge of mentors and writers, isn’t a better situation.

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    • __siru__@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      AI for the win in figuring out how to use code libraries with minimal to non-existent documentation scattered accross the entire web.

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• slazer2au@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Moving away from GitHub to other git hosting sites.

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  • markz@suppo.fi ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Abandoning forges makes it harder for humans while bots could still download any publicly available repo.

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    • slazer2au@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      No. You archive your GH code with the readme.md saying all new stuff is at gitlab, codeburg, bit bucket, etc. And a link to it.

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• gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Just don’t use it

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• obbeel@lemmy.eco.br ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I mean, agentic AIs are getting good at outputting working code. Thousands of lines per minute; talking trash of it won’t work.

  However, I agree that losing the human element of writing code is losing a very important element of programming. So, I believe there should exist a strong resistance against this. Don’t feel pressured to answer if you think your plans shouldn’t be revealed, but it would be nice to know if someone is preparing a great resistance out there.

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  • planish@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    This is honestly a lot of the problem: code generation tools can output thousands of lines of code per minute. Great, committable, defendable code.

    There is basically no circumstance in which a project’s codebase growing at a rate of thousands of lines per minute is a good thing. Code is a necessary evil of programming: you can’t always avoid having it, but you should sure as hell try, because every line of code is capable of being wrong and will need to be read and understood later. Probably repeatedly.

    Taking the approach to solving a problem that involves writing a lot of code, rather than putting in the time to find the setup that lets you express your solution in a little code, or reworking the design so code isn’t needed there at all, is a mistake. It relinquishes the leverage that is very point of software engineering.

    A tool that reduces the effort needed to write large amounts of human-facing, gets-committed-to-the-source-tree code, so that it’s much easier and faster than finding the actual right way to parse your problem, is a tool that makes your project worse and that makes you a worse programmer when you hold it.

    Maybe eventually someone will create a thinking machine that itself understands this, but it probably won’t be someone who charges by the token.

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    • FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      This is why Pull Requests and approvals exist though. If I am reviewing a PR and it takes 400 lines of code to do something that should be 25 lines, I’ll pick that up in my review, leave feedback, and send it back.

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  • Apepollo11@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    It’s just a greater level of abstraction. First we talked to the computers on their own terms with punch cards.

    Then Assembly came along to simplify the process, allowing humans to write readable code while compiling into Machine Code so the computers can run it.

    Then we used higher-level languages like C to create the Assembly Code required.

    Then we created languages like Python, that were even more human-readable, doing a lot more of the heavy lifting than C.

    I understand the concern, but it’s just the latest step in a process that has been playing out since programming became a thing. At every step we give up some control, for the benefit of making our jobs easier.

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    • theparadox@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I disagree. Even high level languages will consistently produce the same results. There may be low level differences depending on the compiler and the system’s architecture but if those are consistent you will get the same results.

      AI coding isn’t an extremely human readable higher level programming language. Using an LLM to generate code adds a literal black box and the interpretation of the user and LLM’s human language (which humans can’t even do consistently) to the equation.

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• mistermodal@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Brazil must invent Lua 2.

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• muntedcrocodile@hilariouschaos.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Most programmers are embracing ai. As its the use case where it acts as the biggest force multiplyer.

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  • Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Shhhh don’t tell them. We’re trying to leave these guys in the dust.

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    • muntedcrocodile@hilariouschaos.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      They will adapt or die. If they haven’t adapted already telling them isn’t gonna change their minds.

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• AA5B@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I still look for answers on stack overflow, instead of waiting for an AI summary of the same answer

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• JargonWagon@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

  If you’re asking about they’re directly combating AI, there are efforts to poison AI, basically injecting it with malware.

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