Why doesn't Steam support Android?

Submitted ⁨⁨17⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨Ulrich@feddit.org⁩ to ⁨gaming@beehaw.org⁩

Steam revenue estimated 2024: $10.8B Google Play Store gaming revenue 2024: ~$31B

Why doesn’t Valve want a part of that? I mean they already have an Android app. Several, actually. I realize there’s some amount of investment but surely the payoff is worth it, and they have the necessary funds and skills? I mean if F-Droid can do it with nothing but grants…?

Certainly plenty of games won’t lend themselves well to the mobile experience but also plenty of them do.

From a personal perspective: I don’t really care a whole lot for mobile games but I do like Balatro and want to play it on my phone, but if I want to do that I have to buy another license, which I can’t even do because I don’t run Google Play Services.

Epic got in on this already. Where’s Valve?

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HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Valve didn’t expand Steam into Linux to gain market share in a new market, Valve did it because it is a hedge in case Windows becomes toxic to Steam. There is now a fallback position if Steam is locked out of Windows, and I expect Valve to continue to build in this position.

As for Android, there isn’t a successful second app store that isn’t tied to hardware; even Amazon quit Android. I don’t think Valve sees Android expansion as commercialy viable.

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- luciole@beehaw.org ⁨24⁩ ⁨minutes⁩ ago
  (A few days ago I skimmed a super cool post about Steam’s relationship with Linux that says what you’re saying and now I want to give it a thorough read but I can’t find it bee sob emoji. If anyone remembers and has a link to it I’d be super happy bee laugh sweat emoji)
  
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- Earflap@reddthat.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  F-Droid?
  
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  - HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club ⁨3⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    F-Droid’s market share is a rounding error compared to Google’s. Just because another app store exists doesn’t mean there is significant competition between app stores.
    
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- Ulrich@feddit.org ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  
  Valve didn’t expand Steam into Linux to gain market share in a new market
  
  …I didn’t say anything about Linux?
  
  there isn’t a successful second app store that isn’t tied to hardware
  
  That doesn’t mean there couldn’t be.
  
  even Amazon quit Android
  
  Well everything I’ve read about Amazon indicates that it was atrocious for everyone so that’s unsurprising.
  
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  - scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Bro why are you being so argumentative? Person gave you a well thought out response, wasn’t even a tone to him but you fire back like he just insulted a core belief
    
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Chesckers@lemmy.zip ⁨16⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Maybe, just maybe, they are waiting for proton for ARM to be a thing.

Imagine having actually a big percentage of your steam games just work on android. Now that would be disruptive for the market.

If it worked like I imagine it would.

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- mp3@lemmy.ca ⁨16⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  Knowing Valve, they wouldn’t wait but build the thing.
  
  Personally, I’d be happy to have another place to buy Android games that isn’t Google Play, Amazon or Epic Games.
  
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- tias@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨16⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  It’s not that simple. Proton implements the Windows API functions required to run a Windows game on Linux, but it’s not a CPU emulator. Emulating x86 on ARM at the speeds required by a game is virtually impossible.
  
  If Steam comes to ARM / Android, it would have to be a whole separate ecosystem of games. But Valve is late to the game there since we already have several players on that market, not least the standard Google Play Store.
  
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  - Toes@ani.social ⁨15⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    
    Emulating x64 on ARM at the speeds required by a game is virtually impossible.
    
    This has been done and it works reasonably well on a case by case basis.
    
    Much like protondb they have a list of confirmed broken and working games.
    
    box86.org/app/
    
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UnbrokenTaco@lemm.ee ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
I agree with you however I have one barrier to entry that others haven’t mentioned.

Firstly, I’ll say how they could overcome some of the other challenges mentioned.

Steam would just have to add the ability for developers to upload android builds of games alongside the windows, Linux, Mac builds. All of a sudden, users would have huge, existing libraries of games. Most games built with Unity can target Android. I suspect a lot of indie developers would happily add the build.

Leaks have implied they were working on an arm emulator/translation layer but I assume this had to do with VR prototyping. Possibly the same effect as above but so many more configurations to target, they couldn’t handle it the way they do with steam deck.

Require/recommend to users to use a controller on Android

If either or both of those first 2 points succeed, Valve doesn’t need to do much more to ensure the utility of Steam games on Android. PC gamers are considered among the most willing and able to jump through hoops for a result. Going to a website to download the steam store plus a little warning on Android wouldn’t stop a reasonable percentage of them. It wouldn’t stop me.

It’s almost 0 risk to them, right? Right? I don’t think so.

Here’s the big barrier I mentioned. I assume they have a not-insignificant number of sales through the the android app. If they start allowing users to install android games, Google is going to stop them from having anything useful in their play store app. And while I said that users would install their app from a website, what percentage of users would do it? How many fewer PC game sales would they make (from the Play Store app) in order to let their current users play games on Android?

Additionally, what would Steam do if they started getting android-only games being submitted. Or mobile-quality games dominating their store?

Additionally, it might be something they’ve discussed but they would have rather focused on steam deck-type gaming for mobile. Or perhaps an ARM-based steam OS+steamdeck approach would make more sense for them and then the difficulty/cost (and opportunity cost) increases do instead they simply don’t pursue it.

The cross-buy thing is something that Gog or Epic could do but they don’t have nearly the same “customer profile” (size, behaviour etc) do it isn’t as likely to have the same impact.

Regardless, in my view you’ve asked a great question and it’s a solid idea.
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- Ulrich@feddit.org ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  
  If they start allowing users to install android games, Google is going to stop them from having anything useful in their play store app.
  
  They would have to distribute it independently. Google would have no say in the matter.
  
  what would Steam do if they started getting android-only games being submitted. Or mobile-quality games dominating their store?
  
  …cash their checks? I don’t understand the question. That’s the point.
  
  it might be something they’ve discussed but they would have rather focused on steam deck-type gaming for mobile.
  
  perhaps an ARM-based steam OS+steamdeck approach would make more sense
  
  …why not both?
  
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  - UnbrokenTaco@lemm.ee ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    
    They would have to distribute it independently. Google would have no say in the matter.
    
    That’s exactly my point. The current app lets you buy PC games despite being distributed through the store. If you can buy Android games on it, well, I doubt Google will ignore it. And even if Google was okay with it, there’s no way to easily communicate to users who start using the app there that they need to download another app from a website.
    
    I’m not saying it’s a bad idea. I’m just saying I think there are reasons they haven’t done it (yet?). I think they certainly must have considered it. I’ve certainly been wondering about it for a long while too.
    
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_cryptagion@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨10⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Because Valve has gone to fair lengths to not become shit, and they probably don’t want to start now.

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- Ulrich@feddit.org ⁨9⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  I don’t understand what that has to do with the discussion.
  
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  - Boomkop3@reddthat.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Google has made quite some effort making android a mess for anything but themselves. If I were steam I would not want to maintain a store on there
    
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  - _cryptagion@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨9⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    Yes, I imagine you don’t. Which is probably why you asked the question in the first place.
    
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bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de ⁨17⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
Valve have supposedly been experimenting with x86 emulation on ARM for their next VR headset. So I think they might actually be well on their way to enter that market. Probably with the plan of making PC games playable on Android.

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mundane@feddit.nu ⁨16⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
It’s a pain to get other app stores to get uptake on Android since Google refuses to let other app stores be distributed via Google Play. So if Steam starts to distribute games for Android, the Steam app would be thrown out from Google Play.

It’s the same reason why the F-droids user base is so small and will never reach the main public. As soon as your app store needs to be installed via a third party web site, you have lost.

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- Ulrich@feddit.org ⁨16⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  
  It’s a pain to get other app stores to get uptake on Android
  
  Sure, but Steam can leverage their already-massive 132M userbase, just like Epic has (only much bigger). Put an announcement on the Steam store and client pages. Show a pop-up when someone opens the website from an Android device, etc.
  
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  - jarfil@beehaw.org ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    
    They don’t ban the entire company from distributing any software.
    
    They can do whatever, it’s their store.
    
    Keep in mind that Epic Games v. Google has made Google add features to allow alternative app stores on Android… which automatically removes the monopoly argument and lets Google ban anyone they want from the Google Play store.
    
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jarfil@beehaw.org ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

I do like Balatro and want to play it on my phone, but if I want to do that I have to buy another license, which I can’t even do because I don’t run Google Play Services

Spoiler: you can use the LÖVE loader to run the “PC version” of Balatro on Android, since it’s all written in Lua.

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Kolanaki@pawb.social ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
What more do they need to do besides having Steam Link to let you stream your PC games to your phone?

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- Ulrich@feddit.org ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  Ignoring the fact that Steam Link is pretty terrible and requires a high-speed local connection, native Android games.
  
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  - Kolanaki@pawb.social ⁨13⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    It hasnt needed a local connection for a while. I usually play Civilization over it when out of the house.
    
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biscuitswalrus@aussie.zone ⁨15⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
What would you suggest they sell on their Android store that users would be so encouraged to install a new store and then what they want?

Steam already has a store on Android, you just can’t play games there because most games on steam either already exist on the native google play store, or aren’t compatible with mobile architectures like Arm64. Most mobiles unlike a arm laptop, have no x86/amd64 emulator which is what those games are compiled as by their developers.

So what’s left?

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- Ulrich@feddit.org ⁨15⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  
  What would you suggest they sell on their Android store that users would be so encouraged to install a new store and then what they want?
  
  …games?
  
  Steam already has a store on Android
  
  Uhhhh they have an Android app which you can use to buy and manage PC games. That’s not what I’m talking about.
  
  because most games on steam either already exist on the native google play store
  
  …no?
  
  Most mobiles unlike a arm laptop, have no x86/amd64 emulator
  
  I’m not suggesting emulation or translation (although that would be great as well), I’m suggesting an app store for selling and installing native Android games.
  
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  - biscuitswalrus@aussie.zone ⁨12⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    I’m trying to figure out the gap in the market you’re trying to fill other than “for steam fan boys it would allow us fans of steam games that already exist in a native place, in a non native place!”
    
    Correct me what is going into it that isn’t already somewhere, and who that appeals to?
    
    Or is this just thought experiment?
    
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Sivilian@lemmy.zip ⁨16⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
There are some projects to bring steam games to android. Like Pluvia.

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HappyTimeHarry@lemm.ee ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
And give google 30‰ of what every android user purchases? Nutz!

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- Ulrich@feddit.org ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  No, they would have to create and distribute their own app store, just like Epic.
  
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  - HappyTimeHarry@lemm.ee ⁨14⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
    And hows that working out for epic?
    
    Valves strategy of not doing anything new in the last decade while every other publisber shoots themselves in the foot seems to be working pretty well for them.
    
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