Comment on King forgot his crown

• knight_alva@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  It’s a poor definition because gift exchanges are strictly voluntary and non-reciprocal engagements. I’m not saying what he did was ok or even legal in other contexts. My only point is that I wouldn’t consider this fraud because the victims were not compelled to give. This isn’t a Nigerian prince scam where the victims were promised greater returns at a later date. These victims gave with the expectation of monetary loss.

  source

  • neukenindekeuken@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Seems to fit the official definition pretty neatly. Colloquially, I tend to agree with you, there’s a spectrum for fraud. But this still counts as fraud. It’s a fraudulent misrepresentation of the truth to convince others to part with something of value (a gift).

    The fact that it’s a gift doesn’t change that this is fraud, only the severity of fraud in a legal sense. Image

    source

    • Hackworth@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      intentional perversion of truth in order to induce another to part with something of value

      Advertising and politics?

      source

      • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        laws don’t apply to politicians.

        source
    • lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      1. image of text: there’s this cool alternative called text that doesn’t break the web or accessibility. linking to source & quoting text makes an altogether better web for everyone.
      2. dictionary definition: not an official, legal definition.

      source

      • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        great, y’all want to get into Japanese criminal legal definitions?

        source
    • knight_alva@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Fraud in the sense that the guy is lying and profiting from it, sure. But the common / google definition of a word and the legal definition/ application of that word are two completely different things.

      source
  • onslaught545@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    So, it’s not fraud if I tell my grandma with dementia that it’s my birthday once a week so she keeps giving me birthday checks?

    source

    • knight_alva@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Your grandma having dementia changes the formula a bit.

      source

      • onslaught545@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Not really, no. It’s still using deception for material gain through gift giving. Maybe it’s more of an extreme case, but I was being hyperbolic.

        source

        • -> View More Comments
  • Ajen@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    By that logic, fake fundraisers and romance scams shouldn’t be illegal either.

    source
  • LwL@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    They’re technically voluntary but also socially expected. I’m not sure about birthday gifts in particular but Japan is a country where if you go on holiday somewhere you’re expected to bring a gift for each of your coworkers, and people will think worse of you for not doing that. I’d be kind of surprised if omitting birthday gifts for your romantic partner without prior agreement is a real option.

    source
• Zahtu@feddit.org ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I do Not See the fraud here. If He would have given the Girls His real Birthday, He would have still received the Same amount of Gifts. Nothing would have changed in exchanging the Gifts.

  The only Thing, which it probably helped at, was that He could plan ahead for the birthdays, avoiding a Potential meet-in of each girl, that He dated on the Same Day. The only Thing He is gullible of ist deceiving the Woman on their Relationship. Which is Not an offenes in a legal Sense. There is no punishment for 2-timing, so 35-timing should Not have either

  source

  • AugustWest@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    What’s going on with your capitalization? I spent way too much time looking for hidden messages and came away with nothing except the - entirely unrelated - hypothesis that you are German.

    source

    • naeap@sopuli.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Not OP:
      In other languages (like German) nouns are capitalized.
      I often write mails inside Europe that way to make it easy readable and put focus on the stuff I find necessary.

      For English native speakers it’s probably really looks like hidden code ;⁠-⁠)

      source
    • Zahtu@feddit.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Yeah, i am German and autocorrect is my enemy. Especially when writing english. It is still the Default Setup from Google GBoard, but it is so fucking bad.

      source
    • fushuan@piefed.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Probably bad autocorrect tbh.like Futo or auto key set in multi language or something.

      source
• FelixCress@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  It’s pretty much the textbook definition of fraud. What are you talking about?

  Fraud is defined as intentional deception to deprive a victim of a legal right or to gain unlawfully from a victim.

  That’s what politicians do every election. Just saying.

  source

  • onslaught545@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Most politicians are absolutely guilty of fraud.

    source

    • Buddahriffic@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I’d even go so far as saying that fraud is pretty rampant in all levels of society.

      source
  • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    laws don’t apply to politicians you silly

    source
• RestrictedAccount@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  There is no mention of any consideration (a legal term meaning he didn’t promise them anything in return) provided by the “boyfriend”.

  This would not be fraud under English common law.

  source

  • onslaught545@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    You don’t have to promise anything in return for it to be fraud. If I start a Go Fund Me because I have cancer when I really don’t have cancer, the people donating aren’t promised anything in return. It’s still fraud.

    source

    • Ceedoestrees@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The consideration is the exclusive romantic relationship. They wouldn’t have given him gifts if they didn’t believe they were in a relationship.

      source

      • onslaught545@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Thank you for the addition

        source
    • RestrictedAccount@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The cancer example is plausible, but I am not sure you would always win.

      In that case you are asking for help for a specific reason. They “get to feel good about helping solve your problem”.

      Your deception deprives them of their having done something good with their money - which is the tort.

      In OP’s instance, he was saying that he had a birthday and you are giving him a gift.

      Not the same - you can make the same argument, but it is even thinner gruel.

      source

      • onslaught545@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        People get to feel good about getting someone a gift as well.

        source
• ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Well there’s your shady gray bit right in the definition. Is it unlawful to lie about your birthday?

  source
• RaivoKulli@sopuli.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  deprive a victim of a legal right or to gain unlawfully from a victim

  Does either of those fill though?

  source