Comment on Dutch gamers file €220 million claim against Valve, operator of game platform Steam
ski11erboi@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Is there any actual proof of valve taking actions to limit competition or are they just popular because they have a good business model?
Yes here: wolfire.com/…/Regarding-the-Valve-class-action/
They have the proof in the claim, but I don’t know if it’s public yet.
I agree that steam should enforce STEAM CODE sales to be the same price, but this is just a download of the game. I hope steam just fucked yo here and misunderstood; otherwise, it’s completely anticompetitive and is illegal based on the contract the developer signed from valve.
Yes, but all the valve fanboys will argue anyone who mentions the multiple price fixing lawsuits (which are not related to using steam key sellers, but they’ll endlessly post that TOS clause anyway) against Valve into oblivion.
A pending lawsuit is a merely a claim, not a proven fact or hard evidence. Swamping an entity with lawsuits doesn’t mean the defendent is guilty, because you can sue for anything.
We’ve already seen this happen with Monsanto, Disney, Nintendo, etc. where they go after smaller entities by smothering them in lawsuits to drain their coffers. It doesn’t matter if some lawsuits get thrown out or whether they’re valid, they just need to squash the competition.
And Microsoft, Apple, Nintendo, Sony, Epic, Ubisoft, EA, etc. all have financial reason to see Valve fall. Linux adoption is a threat to Microsoft and Apple, the PC market is a threat to console manufacturers, and having a pro-consumer store as the dominant player in the market limits what anti-consumer practices other storefronts can do.
Don’t just blindly trust claims and speculation, especially when there’s a lot of finilancial incentive to lie. Wait for lawsuits to actually get resolved.
I know from experience valve coerces developers into participating in their sale events, basically saying there game won’t get promoted on the store or in searches unless they agree to sales.
Which considering they already take a massive 30% cut of developers earnings, is very scummy. Lots of indie Devs that already struggle to make money and already sell their games for super cheap are basically forced to cut their profits even further just to get some visibility on the platform.
basically saying there game won’t get promoted on the store or in searches unless they agree to sales.
I’m very skeptical of that. The Factorio devs famously refuse to ever put the game on sale, and has even increased the price over time to account for inflation. Yet they’re one of the most popular games on Steam
Yeah they are the notable exception. 99% of I die devs aren’t that lucky.
Got any proof to back up your claims?
I believe you, but they were asking for proof. Sources.
If 30% is massive, what do you propose the cut be? Epic said their 12% cut was unsustainable already.
AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
They don’t limit competition, but it’s a more open question whether they are engaging in a form of price fixing.
Holytimes@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
The problem is if valve is price fixing then it would mean any company that limits the use of their service to others via fixed pricing agreements would also be price fixing.
If a company is no longer allowed to have control over their own service when used by others then functionally you cant have second or third parties anymore. It would basically break the very concept.
Cause yes valve does prevent you from selling your game on other platforms at a cheaper rate, so long as you are doing so via steam key or when valve servers will be the source of distribution. This keeps coming up over and over and its wild that people seem to think that valve should not be allowed to limit the abuse of their own servers.
The only example ever floated of them doing this with out steam keys or them being the distribution source was a single email from steam support to a developer. That has been proven over and over to have been a miscommunication and not actually an enforced policy.
Theres a lot of questions on how healthy it is for valve to be so dominate in the market and to have such a wide reach. But the fact is that other companies keep leaning on valve for distribution or build their entire company around it either legitly or though majority theft cough g2g cough.
Everyone else MADE valve into the market dominator either willing or via ignorance and bad business. It valve ever does turn fully evil we are fucked yes. But no one ever seems to want to actually try to fix the problem of everyone else being stupid as fuck. Instead just trying to legal valve into oblivion.
Einhornyordle@feddit.org 1 day ago
This is false. Even if I put the game up on my own server, letting you download a zip directly from there, cutting valve fully out of the picture service-wise too, I am still not allowed to sell it cheaper on my site then on steam.
barryamelton@lemmy.world 1 day ago
That’s quite demonstrably false. There’s so many games that do this, and are and have been part of steam for decades. i can think of is IL-2 sturmovik Battle of X series. They have sales almost every month on il2sturmovik.com and the account there is linked to the steam one. Same for other sims like Microsoft etc, selling through the Microsoft store…
nore@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
So why is Mindustry $5 on steam, but free on itch?
AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
I agree with you that anything using Steam’s services should be subject to their terms. I don’t think a lot of people are arguing to the contrary about that. I have heard others accuse, though I don’t know with how much basis, that they apply the same control to games not using their infra.
If this is true, I definitely agree that they have done nothing wrong. Problem is with the many conflicting stories online and lack of solid info.
qarbone@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Which will hopefully come to light through discovery or a case.
THE_GR8_MIKE@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Seems to me the only fixing they’re doing is fixing the prices lower than other clients.
Rather than what you usually hear with price fixing, where prices go up. Like Amazon with Levi jeans.
iamthetot@piefed.ca 1 day ago
Well, no, it’s the opposite. The accusation goes that Steam strong-arms people into keeping prices on Steam the lowest (or tied for lowest) available if they’re selling the same game on another storefront. For example, Ubisoft cannot sell a game on their own platform for cheaper than they will also sell it on Steam.
Again, allegedly.
qarbone@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Of all the accusations against Steam, I’m most amenable to that one. I think devs should be able to sell on their personal storefronts for cheaper, if they’re going to the effort of setting up a storefront at all.
Selling on GOG or Epic for less does feel some type of way too, but I can’t say I’d block devs from doing that either.
CommanderCloon@lemmy.ml 1 day ago
The thing is that this is in Steam’s TOS when it comes to steam keys. You can sell steam keys but not at a lower price than on Steam. Which is extremely fair – selling a steam key still means you’re using Steam’s infrastructure, you don’t have to manage the downloads & updates. It does not apply in a situation where you manage your own store with its own infrastructure