Comment on Too soon?
surph_ninja@lemmy.world 17 hours ago
I’m getting pretty fucking sick of seeing this ‘no one should be killed for their political beliefs’ take going around.
He wasn’t killed for his beliefs. He was killed because he dedicated his life to terrorizing everyone who isn’t a conservative white man, and was materially supporting state violence in the pursuit of white supremacy.
That is 100% something we have firmly established that people should be shot for, in multiple wars throughout the last few centuries.
There was a way around this that would have resulted in no deaths. Trump should been prosecuted for the January 6th insurrection. Then we should have put a bunch of fascists in jail for a long time. Then we should have de-platformed grifters.
But none of that happens so. We get what we get.
We’re never better off with the Dem fascists in charge either. They’re two sides of the same coin.
If we want the law to mean anything, and we want it used to hold people accountable, over 90% of sitting congresspeople and senators can now be prosecuted for aiding genocide, which they did in violation of domestic & international laws. That would certainly set a tone and precedent for the future.
Slight nitpick. Though I agree with the whole “we’re never better off with the Dem fascists in charge either.” In the long term. In the short term there are a lot of innocent people in US concentration camps and whom have been deported. Who would strongly disagree with you.
Biden deported 250% more people than Trump’s first term, and Stephen Miller was reportedly screaming at a meeting with ICE leadership because he was pissed they were barely keeping pace with Biden’s deportation numbers.
The Democrat fascists have troves of victims, too, but the media only gives them a microphone when they’re victims of Republicans.
We were better off with the Dems in charge. The difference is it’s like having your feet on fire vs full emolation. But the point is it’s easier to extinguish feet than it is the whole body, and causes less damage too.
I bet the people being actively killed and oppressed by the Dems would disagree. It sounds more like you personally felt less threatened under Dems, and you want to return to that place of privilege.
Well I think Michael Borrego Fernandez was better off before the Nazis took power
It comes across to me as they simply lack empathy for other “kinds” of people. If you actually felt the same pain and empathy when watching the video of Kirk get merked, you should feel that a thousand times over when seeing a thousand videos of the IOF massacring children, many sniped in the same way Kirk got merked, and then you should look upon Kirk in disgust for supporting that and dehumanizing the Palestinian people. But the fact is these people don’t. They don’t see other “kinds” of people different from them as in fact “people.” Let’s be real, they don’t feel the same kind of empathy for Palestinian fathers dying as they do a white fascist dying. They constantly mock the deaths of minority groups like trans people. They suddenly have empathy and demand pacifism and valuing the sanctity of all life when a white fascist dies, but are silent in every other cas.e
Well said. Claiming he simply died for his political beliefs is highly reductive and disingenuous.
His family shouldn’t expect empathy, and he wouldn’t want his death to distract from full Epstein file disclosure.
Charlie Kirk wouldn’t have wanted you to feel any empathy for him or his family.
“I can’t stand the word empathy actually. I think empathy is a made-up, New Age term that — it does a lot of damage, but it is very effective when it comes to politics”
I expect the NRA will stage a gunshow at a nearby site someplace in the next few days, right? Its what they do for school shootings and this was at a school. So Kirk’s fam can stock up on cheap ammo.
Assuming his kids are young enough, I’d feel bad for them. They probably don’t understand well enough.
His wife though I don’t care for at all, and will likely use his death for profit and to make her kids extremists. One can only hope they question why their father was hated enough to be killed while most people everyday aren’t.
If you’re part of a movement that’s taking vaccines away from babies, well, you’re evil and people are going to respond to that.
It’s bad to kill for political beliefs only if a fascist dies. Otherwise nobody will even know about anything.
See the issue with this mentality is that THIS is the mentality of authoritarians. You try to find ways to justify the murder of the people you politically disagree with while not applying the same standard to the people you politically agree with.
What you’re doing is helping set a precedent that political violence is justified if you frame it in a certain way. If that’s the case then other extremist whackos, including conservative ones, are going to start doing the same thing. What’s there from stopping some conservative nutjob from shooting someone like Hasan Piker or AOC or Mamdani or anyone on the left really as a retaliation? After all, if what you’re saying here is now passing as a valid justification, then they’ll just use your very own justification to justify their own actions.
The things that authoritarians don’t understand is that when principles aren’t applied universally, the standard becomes subjective, and sooner or later, their abuse of power will come back to bite them in the ass by the very standard they helped establish. I am fully aware that Lemmy is usually off the deep end on politics, but this is too unhinged even for this platform.
I agree with you in principle. It sucks a well-worded dissenting opinion is getting downvoted to oblivion. I’m not an advocate for political killings. But I want to pose a counter question… When does it become acceptable to cross this line? When can an otherwise reasonable person give up on a broken system, and go from political resistance to violent resistance? Because for a lot of people, their rights, their lives, and their futures are under attack. Both politically AND with the full force of the government.
when they talk about removing rights from the “others” in society.
I don’t know your backgrounds or motivations, but that simple a response feels flippant.
I too believe that you should obviously resist and try to counter someone who wants to stamp down the “other” just because they are the other. But simple talk probably shouldn’t warrant execution, unless you want those same rules to apply against you as well. Fight them with words and actions, yes. Discredit the speaker and their ideas, embarrass them, ostracize them. Drive them and their bass-ackwards views out of polite society. I know this is difficult in the current environment. They appear to have no shame. But I think the bar for for violence has to be higher.
I wont shed any tears for this guy. I wont use his name. I want him to be forgotten. But I don’t think his killing should be celebrated either.
Again, he was far beyond “political disagreement.” He was promoting actual, race-targeted violence domestically and internationally. If you’re going to be a Nazi terrorizing your community, you’re going to be a target for retaliation.
It’s a conundrum. But remember, this guy said It’s fine for some to die from guns. So I sure as hell ain’t wasting a caring thought on him.
Treetrimmer@sh.itjust.works 17 hours ago
Seriously, he’s words and actions have probably resulted in the deaths of others, why shouldn’t he have gotten this outcome?
surph_ninja@lemmy.world 13 hours ago
The Republicans’ rubber stamp, and lack of a competent opposition, is proving to be an absolute nightmare for the party. They’re getting away with everything they ever wanted, and people are seeing the immediate consequences play out. When your policies start killing people, people literally fight back. You’ve given people nothing to lose, and this population is armed to the teeth. What did they think was going to happen?
You can’t declare war on a population, and then expect to walk freely in the open air among that population.
The Republicans getting everything they ever wanted will be what caused the party’s destruction. The Democrats helping them do it will destroy them, too.