Comment on Capitalism is all about using state power to protect capital by force

• searabbit@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I think a lot of people think capitalism literally means commerce. The sanctions usually imposed on socialist/ communist countries fuels this idea by directly restricting commerce in those countries and sabotaging them.

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• cattywampas@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Would you want this administration to own the means of production?

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  • Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Psst: workers own the means of production under communism.

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    • Steve@communick.news ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Psst: that’s socialism.

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    • adjectivenoun@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      How do they own it?

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      • Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Presumably the same way worker owned businesses work now.

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• DegradationDenial@feddit.nl ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Communism (not DemSoc) is an economic system where a government essentially owns the population ruled by an autocrat. The ML way of democratic centralism completely fails when the opposition is blocked from voting which assures total enforced hegemony.

  Independent unions are illegal in China with only the All-China Federation of Trade Unions(ACFTU) permitted by the Chinese state and the Chinese Communist Party to operate.

  This doesn’t sound like a good idea.

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  • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Communism (not DemSoc) is an economic system where a government essentially owns the population ruled by an autocrat, under the veil of a single union.

    No it’s not.

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    • DegradationDenial@feddit.nl ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Every single piece of information Marx Lenin Mao Stalin points to: the replacement of power of any method a worker has, in a capitalist democracy and migrate it after the revolution to a state held apparatus above which the flawed democratic-centralism takes grasp to hold absolute power. At which point strengthening a secret police is all that’s needed to let fascism in from the back door. At least Mussolini stated his intentions from the beginning.

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  • Nonconfrontational@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    essentially

    This word is doing a lot of heavy lifting here, lmao.

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    • DegradationDenial@feddit.nl ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Sorry I should have used effectively, being ideological about democratic centralism is nice until you find yourself organising a workers demonstration against one.

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      • Nonconfrontational@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        You shouldn’t have commented at all, lol.

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• daychilde@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I’ve certainly not seen any working alternatives that have worked at a nation-wide scale.

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• kinsnik@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  i think markets do provide signals about local preferences and efficencies that centralized economies lose. personally i think socialism > comunism because of that, in which the workers own the factories but markets still operate on competition;

  i am also open to something like georgism which is capitalism but all rent-seeking activities are 100% taxed and give back in form of services and UBI to the population

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  • One_Honest_Dude@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Markets are not a function of capitalism; feudalism, mercantilism, etc. all had markets. There would be and have been markets in communist governments. Marx himself held the same sentiment about markets being effective for similar reasons you listed.

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