Did you like Star Trek: Nemesis?

Submitted ⁨⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨daggermoon@lemmy.world⁩ to ⁨startrek@startrek.website⁩

I watched Nemesis again, for the first time in years. I thought Tom Hardy’s performance as Shinzon was amazing but I thought the character itself could have been given more development. I thought the film itself was lacking. The film kind of seemed pointless to me. I do still like this movie and I like the character of Shinzon but I thought it could have been much better. I thought the film’s themes of identity were fascinating but I struggled to find any meaning in it beyond that. Maybe there is no other meaning but the theme of identity could have been explored much more. Anyway, do y’all like this movie? Why or why not?

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themoken@startrek.website ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
It’s thoroughly mediocre. I will watch it if I’m watching the TNG movies, but probably not standalone. There is definitely some cool stuff in it, and I also like Tom Hardy and Ron Perlman, but as you note I don’t think it really pulls it all together. And then there are things I hate, like dune buggies, B4, and the fact they fucking killed Data.

It is especially bad as the last TNG movie. The TNG era crew should have got their Undiscovered Country epic last ride.

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- kieron115@startrek.website ⁨21⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago
  The writer and Brent Spiner said recently that Data didn’t really die, fwiw.
  
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- HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  I honestly have a problem with how the Undiscovered Country treats the original characters. Great story, but it did the characters dirty.
  
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  - Kirk@startrek.website ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    Saving democracy through experience, cunning, and guile in their golden years all while continuing to grow as individuals isn’t enough for ya?
    
    Genuinely curious about your take, it’s not something I’ve seen before.
    
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HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
I didn’t like it.

The premise was interesting and kind of seemed to be TNG’s Undiscovered Country, so that by itself wasn’t bad.

Tom Hardy as a Picard clone was dumb. I don’t know what the obsession is with having Picard become a father when his character was written to have his lineage end with him. It would have worked better if Hardy was a Romulan who was manipulating the Remans for his benefit.

Outside of Worf, the crew felt oddly in status. Giving Riker the Titan in this movie could have justified shaking up the crew. Bring in Crusher and La Forge as technical experts instead of crew because going to Romulus it’s going to be a big deal and the two have credible experience with Romulan biology and technology.

Ditch the whole daddy/son thing and focus on the Enterprise and a small fleet trying to establish better diplomatic relations as invited guests and get attacked given how the sneaky Romulan politics is.

The final ship battle was cool.

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usernamefactory@lemmy.ca ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
Oh, I hate it. The labourious mind-numbing action, the “we aspire and they don’t” hand-wave resolution to the half-assed philosophical premise, the dozenth mind rape of Troi and Picard’s callous response, it’s all trash.

Don’t get me wrong, it had some OK scenes. You had to learn about them after the fact, though, because they were all cut from the film! Cutting Picard’s discussion with Data from the start, and the crew’s visit to his quarters at the end, is as good as cutting the Kobayashi Maru and funeral sequences from TWoK. They wouldn’t have saved the thing, but they would have given Data’s death at least a little emotional weight.

Left a bad taste in my mouth for twenty years. Thank goodness Picard came along to revisit these characters. It was a mess, but I’ll take any season of Picard as a superior send-off to the TNG era than this movie.

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- daggermoon@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  
  Thank goodness Picard came along to revisit these characters. It was a mess, but I’ll take any season of Picard as a superior send-off to the TNG era than this movie.
  
  I actually just started watching Picard. I’m on episode 4 right now. So far, so good. I kind of stopped watching Star Trek after Discovery came out because I heard it sucked (Also because it was on streaming). I decided to finally give new Trek a chance and so far it’s not half bad. It’s better that I watch something and form my own opinion instead of listening to what some dumbasses online are saying.
  
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  - bradboimler@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    I enjoyed Picard more than I thought I would
    
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  - ValueSubtracted@startrek.website ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    We’re always here if you want to hang out with the best group of dumbasses you’ll ever find online.
    
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  - usernamefactory@lemmy.ca ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    I wont say too much to spoil it, but my feelings on Picard’s first season is that it started out with a huge amount of promise, then moved at a strangely slow pace for long enough that there wasn’t any chance to properly resolve everything at the end. So a mess, but it had ambition and even those messier episodes had some lovely moments.
    
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FriendOfDeSoto@startrek.website ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
I didn’t hate it when I saw it in theaters. Thought it was better than IX and VII but not VIII. It was a hit heavy on wanting to be star wars. The buggy ride, fighter ships, fights on gangways above huge chasms on the ship, the humorous banter while pew pew. Didn’t like the death of Data. Didn’t we learn anything from Spock? I liked the world building for the Roms and the Rems. I liked Hardy in it.

I don’t mind rewatching this movie. I feel it benefits from aging a bit like III doesn’t (but V does for me). And I’d argue it’s definitely better than PIC S2, if not the whole show.

The general vibe around this movie is bad because the box office take wasn’t great and then we learned all these little tidbits from BTS: Wesley (the boy?!) being cut out of the wedding scene or the director thinking Geordie was an alien. I think Frakes in the chair would have done a better job with it.

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- themoken@startrek.website ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  
  Wesley (the boy?!)
  
  True to your username, I heard the clip haha
  
  the director thinking Geordie was an alien
  
  Ugh. How did Stuart Baird end up directing this when you have a huge bullpen of Trek actor/directors that could’ve done so much better? Frakes is right there and did fine on First Contact / Insurrection. LeVar Burton himself, or even Roxann Dawson or Robert Duncan McNeill would have been available by then (although most of their directing credits come later).
  
  I could understand if they went outside for someone that had a track record of decent movies, but Baird had little experience directing before Nemesis and apparently none afterwards.
  
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  - FriendOfDeSoto@startrek.website ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    
    I heard the clip haha
    
    Best boss I ever had.
    
    I don’t necessarily understand why they chose that director but I kind of get why they wanted to try someone else. IX hadn’t been a great success. They wanted to find new momentum like a sports ball team swapping coaches when the season is going south. Team still got relegated. Life is like that sometimes. It’s easy for me to say Frakes would’ve been better because I have the benefit of hindsight.
    
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Kirk@startrek.website ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
For me Nemesis falls solidly into the “Not a ‘good’ movie, but something I can put on literally any time and have fun with it.”

As you said, the themes, inasmuch as they exist, are clunky. The story is nonsensical. But the performances are good as always, the sets are good as always, and the presentation (sfx/makeup/etc) are solid as always.

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cerebralhawks@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
The worst TNG movie by far. It had a couple good lines, and it could have been almost as good as Insurrection if it didn’t magically hand wave Data’s sacrifice away.

I remember leaving the theater annoyed. I saw them all in theaters from Undiscovered Country onward and it was the only one I wasn’t happy with.

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ValueSubtracted@startrek.website ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
I struggle to think of things to say about “Nemesis”, one way or the other.

I do like the Remans. We need more Remans in our lives.

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- daggermoon@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  The Remans are pretty badass.
  
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DJKJuicy@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
Nope. Did not like. Insurrection and Nemesis are nigh unwatchable to me.

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- daggermoon@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  What’s wrong with Insurrection?
  
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  - DJKJuicy@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    Image
    
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_Nico198X_@europe.pub ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
Meh. I mean it’s aight.

I wanted more of a Undiscovered Country with Romulans. But it had that while weird cloning arc instead.

At least we got more Romulans in P1, which I enjoyed.

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- daggermoon@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  To be honest, The Undiscovered Country was my least favorite. Though seeing Captain Sulu was awesome as fuck. The Voyage Home is probably my favorite. Generations was really good too. I actually liked The Final Frontier because of it’s weirdness but I get why people don’t like it.
  
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  - _Nico198X_@europe.pub ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    i can dig it, rock on. :D
    
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MadMadBunny@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
I didn’t personally. I believe it was victim of the period at which it was made; with a sudden propension to weaker and oversimplified scenarios, overly aggressive cut scenes, ridiculously bad and shortened dialogs etc. It’s not just that specific movie, it was how all “action” movies were filmed during those years, and the quality of Nemesis suffered because of it.

Just like Discovery’s second and third seasons suffered greatly by both the pandemic and the actors’ strike.

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