While they whole heartedly suck, it doesn’t mean they’re responsible for everything that sucks.
Tankies don’t look at the shitty things China and Russia do.
Comment on Putin too, for some reason
DarkCloud@lemmy.world 1 hour agoOf course, the CIAand US Government does actually do propaganda campaigns. Whether via things like the Voice Of America radio station. Or like
The Anti-Communist stuff:
Operation Mockingbird bird: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird,
The Crusade for Cultural Freedom.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusade_for_Freedom
The Congress for Cultural Freedom. en.wikipedia.org/…/Congress_for_Cultural_Freedom
The Red Scare. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Scare
More general fuckery
Lavender Scare. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavender_scare
The suppression of the PRISM information program. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM
Suppression of wartime massacres: en.wikipedia.org/…/Mukaradeeb_wedding_party_massa…
The assassin of Fred Hampton (American communist)
en.wikipedia.org/…/Assassination_of_Fred_Hampton
The unproven assassination of MLK (American Socialist).
en.wikipedia.org/…/Assassination_of_Martin_Luther….
And that’s just a small portion of the US government propaganda campaigns they’ve run ON AMERICAN CITIZENS. Not including things like the outlawing of Anarchism, or whatever the hell people like Allen Dulles and George Bush Senior were up to…
…and all of this is before even asking about overseas propaganda campaigns.
So yes, the CIA has definitely been heavily involved in curbing American opinions, and suppressing support of Communism and Socialism in America.
American Free speech - but only to an extent, after that you’ll have to deal with government suppression.
copingwithelmons@lemmy.world 1 hour ago
DarkCloud@lemmy.world 59 minutes ago
Yes, and anti-communists tend to overlook the shitty things Capitalism and the US government do.
The critique cuts both ways. I don’t think either side has much of a solution… But right now, in the west, it’s clear that too much Socialism is not the problem.
The West is Cappoed out right now. Kind of tired of it.
Hey kid, wanna buy us a new Data Center?
No thanks Sir, please leave me alone.
copingwithelmons@lemmy.world 51 minutes ago
anti-communists tend to overlook the shitty things Capitalism and the US government do
I don’t think either side has much of a solution
You are conflating not being a tankie with being an anticommunist.
Being a communist shouldn’t stop you from ciritquing your own state. A healthy communist state allows for open critique and discussion of what works and what doesn’t. Otherwise you risk autocracy.
And I would hazard calling China and Russia communist states. Russia doesn’t even call itself communist anymore. And China is a one party autocracy with a free market. They’re only communists in name.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world 30 minutes ago
I’m not really interested in defining them or getting into that kind of argument here (not being a Communist, I don’t want to defend it).
…but I believe Market Socialism is a thing. Capitalism is (in Marxist doctrine) considered a stage of Communism, and that these discussions often overlook Vietnam…
…Vietnam also has a system of Market Socialism, they’ve just almost resolved homelessness and have no housing crisis because they have a land distribution system for anyone who wants to go into farming.
… so like, whilst I don’t like Tankies AT ALL (they all demand your read a specific 1000 booklist before even having a discussion)… I do think anti-communists are also annoying and often under cooked on historical facts.
To use an analogy being anti-tankie often comes across as basically saying we need to reconsider what the alt-right are saying during the Trump era… And exceedingly often comes down to “a tankie once called me a name I don’t like thinking about”.
In short - reactionary. I don’t like anti-tankies because they’re having a reactionary response rather than just going “those guys are dicks, but I understand within a Capitalist society”
Instead anti-tankies go,* “those guys are dicks for calling me that of all people, I’m going to form a club to complain about it… Even though billionaire crony Capitalism is really the problem right now”.*
So yeah, I don’t like either of them, but I understand uptight commies better than I do the reaction to them. I can hide and block the commies pretty easy.
CIA_chatbot@lemmy.world 25 minutes ago
Don’t forget their chatbot!