that is so well-written it deserves a place on my disk.
yeah, that’s precisely how it is. effectively you can’t date women today. i’ve given up. i’m bi so i have other options but damn is the situation not good for anyone straight today.
Comment on Anon questions the epidemic
ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 days ago
Eh idk, my experience with the “male loneliness epidemic” is:
It’s not just about “sex” (which it seems like that’s all EVERYONE can focus on, so I get it,) but also about deeper meaningful connections. Personally, I have a few FWB, I want to fall in love with someone again, though, tbf, the part of me that had the ability to do that could also be dead, kinda hard to tell tbh.
It’s also about (again, for me) the fact that increasingly it seems that the ONLY places acceptable to meet a woman you have not yet talked to are:
A) Online dating services that sell your data, are designed not to give good matches because they want you to stay on the app, and charge a fee for the apps to even be useful, and they’re all owned by one company.
B) The bar. That’s it.
Well, as for A, I value my privacy, and don’t enjoy paying money to have horrible experiences. I run GrapheneOS idek if tindr would run. I don’t even have social media, I can’t stand writing my own bio and don’t take selfies, it’s not a good option for anyone but doubly so for me. Also I’m not Tom Cruise (or whoever you’re horny for just sub them in) level attractive and as such I have to rely on my personality, which isn’t really text and picture based. As for B, I do still drink but not like I used to, and even if I did I can’t afford to go out as much as I used to in this fucked economy, and tbh meeting drunk women doesn’t seem like a good idea anymore, feels like it opens me up to problems I don’t fucking need tbh.
So where does that leave me? Well, common advice is to:
“Have your friends set you up with someone.” Ok great. None of them have any single friends, at least none that have expressed interest in being set up with me, or that I am interested in myself. So, either “pray,” or I could actively make new friends just for the express purpose of finding out if they have hot friends that want me, if not, move to the next friend I can find and try again? Sounds like a bad plan to me. I don’t have the social battery for all that honestly.
“Go to the gym,” you mean the place women complain about being hit on the most? Sure, that’ll help, “idfk how to use this giant machine and I know you just watched me look like a giant idiot, and I know you hate being asked here, but I saw you from across the yoga mat and thought you had a cool vibe, wanna go out some time?” That’s setting yourself up for success right there lol.
“Find a hobby,” yes because when I’m not at work or sleeping I simply stand and stare at a wall. OF COURSE I have hobbies, but not only do “women want to enjoy their hobbies without being approached” also my hobby is hiking local trails and taking pics of (mundane to you but to me,) neat animals like salamanders and snakes. Idk if you guys are aware of this, but women would rather meet a literal bear in the woods than a nerd with a camera, I used to talk to people on the trails but now I just give them a wide berth (unless they’re dudes, dudes are chill). Also like the library, but I’m the only one under 70 (well, and above 18, lots of parents with kids but that doesn’t help me lol), other than the cute librarian I have a crush on (but you’re not supposed to ask them out while they’re working either, and also if she says no it’ll now be awkward every time I go cause I’ll feel like a creep, so she’ll never know).
The real solutions seem to be we need a third place that is acceptable to meet someone and ask them out politely and take no for an answer, or women would need to start asking men they like if it’s unacceptable the other way around, or I need to become gay because as I said earlier guys are chill, you can talk to them anywhere. Unfortunately we’re actively killing third places and the ones still alive women complain about being approached, women so rarely ask a guy out and I don’t think it’s becoming more common, and afaik I was born unlucky on the gayness.
And I mean, am I “lonely?” Idk. I have friends, FWBs, kitties, I’ve had abusive relationships worse than loneliness, so “no” I guess, but also yes insofar as “I haven’t felt real love in about 15 years and it’d be pretty cool to feel that for someone again,” and I’ll guaranteed never find it if I don’t start doing the secret solution: Just say fuck it, fuck you, and fuck what is socially acceptable, just start asking out ANY woman I see/like ANYWHERE, politely and take no for an answer of course, but anywhere. At my job, at her job, at the gym, in Aisle 10, on the trails, fuck it. If I don’t it seems my only option is to pray to a god I’ve never believed in that a lady falls in front of me like goddamn Rufus in Dogma.
gandalf_der_13te@feddit.org 15 hours ago
frostedtrailblazer@lemmy.zip 2 days ago
You need to find a trail hiking group. You don’t need to change hobbies it sounds like. Try organizing a hike in your area and invite people to come along if you can’t find any. You’ll meet people quickly doing that.
gandalf_der_13te@feddit.org 15 hours ago
If they hold eye contact with you in a friendly way then try saying hi and just chatting to get to know them a little and what they’re out and about for.
written by somebody who has absolutely zero real-life experience. if you do that, women will say that you can’t just let people “be nice” and have to take everything up as a flirting opportunity.
frostedtrailblazer@lemmy.zip 14 hours ago
written by somebody who has absolutely zero real-life experience.
Make up whatever reality suits you about me man.
if you do that, women will say that you can’t just let people “be nice” and have to take everything up as a flirting opportunity.
You don’t have to flirt with everyone making eye contact with you. Intention is what matters, intending just to flirt doesn’t usually come across as you being genuinely interested in them as an individual.
If someone holds eye contact with you in a friendly way in a store, saying hi to them will probably make them feel better more often than not. Asking them about why they’re out and about gives them room to talk and choose if they want to carry a conversation with you. If they want to keep the conversation going, they certainly might and possibly even bounce it back by asking what’s got you out and about.
You have to remember body language matters a lot for in person conversations as well. So if they’re looking at their phone or looking around like they want out of the conversation then definitely take that as a sign to let it go. Tempered body language of your own can convey a lot on its own as well. Such as not coming across as too desperate for their attention.
ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 days ago
I’m down, but where? That whole “not doing social media” thing means no Facebook, where all those local hiking groups would be organizing, or where I’d have to post if I were the organizer (and organizing a meeting then trying to meet a woman there feels sketchy, anyway).
Genuinely though the bar is at the floor for guys right now. If you are well groomed, friendly, and genuinely interested in learning about the specific woman you’re talking to then that alone would bump you up a lot of your potential matches.
Yeah honestly that isn’t my issue, once I get my foot in the door I’m good, but all the doors are locked and I can’t find my pick, the issue is starting that conversation to begin with.
Try going shopping on the weekend; lots of woman are more willing to talk in stores and such when they’re not stressed out from work. If they hold eye contact with you in a friendly way then try saying hi and just chatting to get to know them a little and what they’re out and about for.
Fair enough, this is basically a more succinct and less explicit version of my final conclusion lol. That’s kinda the plan, but most women I talk to (irl or online) seem to indicate that is socially unacceptable now too.
Which actually probably helps the bar being on the floor btw, all the guys afraid of making women uncomfortable and being creepy are not approaching them because they complained and we listened, now the only guys approaching women in public are the ones who don’t care about creeping them out, because they didn’t listen. I’m not saying that’s the whole problem but it has to be some %.
wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz 17 hours ago
all the guys afraid of making women uncomfortable and being creepy are not approaching them because they complained and we listened, now the only guys approaching women in public are the ones who don’t care about creeping them out, because they didn’t listen.
Absolutely correct. I’ve been pointing this out for years and people gaslight me about it and act like I’m the problem for calling attention to it, but it absolutely is a real phenomenon.
frostedtrailblazer@lemmy.zip 1 day ago
There might be public postings already out there listed at a local community college, community center, or city website for public events near you. If you post a meet up, do so with the intent of just bringing people to together and having fun, doing so with just intent of meeting women should come second. If you meet people that you vibe with then for sure invite them to more hikes or other shared activities.
Hosting Partifuls could help a lot to get things off the ground as well. My friend does those all of the time even for the most mundane things and lots of friends and acquaintances will show up and bring friends along.
For getting your foot in the door, it’s a lot of putting yourself in the right spaces to meet people. If you don’t have an issue actually connecting, then that’s a great start. I’d advise trying friend finding apps too since the pressure is offloaded on those compared to strictly dating apps. Lots of women want to find guys they could at least be friends with first before committing to dating. You remove a lot of the barriers of pressure when meeting up doesn’t have to be a date, but can be if you both are connecting. ———
Fair enough, this is basically a more succinct and less explicit version of my final conclusion lol. That’s kinda the plan, but most women I talk to (irl or online) seem to indicate that is socially unacceptable now too.
I feel where you go matters, what time you go matters, and not forcing the interaction matters for this. If you go to a woman dominated space and are confident and cool headed about it, just that and being dressed the part for being there could have you being checked out by women. Probably less a bookstore, more a ‘healthy’ lunch spot or outdoor/indoor mall. After their first coffee and before lunch? You’re golden. Specifically during/after lunch? Golden. After dinner? Generally fine.
Which actually probably helps the bar being on the floor btw, all the guys afraid of making women uncomfortable and being creepy are not approaching them because they complained and we listened, now the only guys approaching women in public are the ones who don’t care about creeping them out, because they didn’t listen. I’m not saying that’s the whole problem but it has to be some %.
You gotta believe and know that you’re coming with pure intentions; if you get caught up in the anxiety of not trying to look weird/creepy it’ll just come off that way instead imo. Out in the world, woman are way more chill than online makes women out to be. There are certainly a number of women that are reasonably wary, due to weirdos with no respect boundaries, but if you look, act, and are friendly then you definitely will meet woman that have been looking for someone like that.
UnequalExchange@lemmy.world 16 hours ago
You also gotta pre-emptively accept the possibility that youll NEVER meet friends or a partner who wants to be associated with you despite your best efforts. It is a possibility and there is nothing wrong with you if that happens to you and youre a kind, quiet , peaceful person. It is what it is
Human-Human relationships are sort of an ‘It Is Whatt It Is’ Type Of Affair these days. You can do everything kindly and to your best efforts to meet other like-minded people …and everyone can still not want to be your friend or lover. You can be worst than Adolph Shiter or Suharto and be surrounded with a million admirers and fake friends. It is what it is.
'Sadly it is what it is BUT At least you tried ’ is how I see it nowadays. 🤷🏿♂️
Best of wishes to you and everyone else who is lonely out here. Best of wishes on the journey comrade.🫂🫡
rawn@feddit.org 2 days ago
Maybe don’t say fuck it all the time but if it feels like it might be a good idea.
wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz 17 hours ago
That’s an effective summary of the situation. Society has effectively made it taboo to pursue dating/romance in just about any irl space where you might meet someone. Makes me wonder how much was social engineering on the part of dating apps (like Match group astroturfing on reddit/social media).
As for your last paragraph, sorry to tell you this, but that won’t work either. People will start noticing and telling their friends about you, calling you names, saying you ask out literally every woman you meet, calling you fuckboy, creep, or whatever. It doesn’t matter how polite you are or how respectful. In fact if you bring attention to how polite and respectful you’re being, they’ll view that as even worse. Eventually someone will sneak a picture of you and it’ll make the rounds on social media. There are entire sites and apps dedicated to women gossiping about men. It doesn’t take much to kill your whole reputation. And women talk to each other about the men they see, so if you become known as “that guy,” then even if you meet a woman who hasn’t heard of you and things start going well, eventually one of her friends will tell her you’re a walking red flag and she’ll ghost you without an explanation.
So no, casting a wide net is not a solution. And if you’re waiting for the perfect woman to fall into your lap and make all the moves and seem to genuinely like you, you’re more likely to get catphished than you are to find love.
This is just the world we’re living in now. Hate to break it to you…
gandalf_der_13te@feddit.org 15 hours ago
i tend to think it’s a christian thing. “sexuality and lust are evil, you’re not supposed to flirt” kinda thing.
UnequalExchange@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
Ya I remember encountering a gossip website that had mostly what I believed to be women talking about men and women they had dated.
I swear the website must have been breaking some rules cause I was shocked that such website could talk so explicitly about people.
Like one of the people talked about was a woman who lives in Niagara Falls she works part time as a prostitute to make ends meet, and they eben shared her full name, picture , AND her address. The women there, who saod they were women, who had befriended her said that she ‘acts too nice’ and ‘she doesnt want to partake in gossip which makes her an awful persom cause gossiping helps you learn more about yourself’ … 😐 They said other nasty things about her too.
There was another profipe of a man, mid 50s, Black , with his picture, full name, and address once again. The women who dated him said that he is a weordo because he only eats plain food. Like he only drinks water. WHen he eats a hotdog he only eats it plain. No condiments on his burger . A group of the women reportd that ‘he isnt a man cause his penis doesnt work. He has no swimmers in his sperm. Dont date him’ . They said some other nasty things about him too
The thing I found earth shattering is that these are only 2 profiles of 2 differemt peoplr on this website. Bro…that website had HUNDREDS of profiles of different people. Even politicians had profiles made of them by the people who dated them there.
If I ever find that website agaim Ill HAVE to share it cause it… its earth shatterimg that such a website can have people just talk aboit each other and others like that. But hopefully the website is down by now.
Personally I dont feel that women or men are a ‘monolith’ . Most people in my experience based on wjho Ive talked to and what weve talked about are out doing their own things. Though obviously my experience is just once experience. There are clearly some places where the people act in monolithic, spiteful and ‘gossipy and busybodying’ ways