Comment on Alternative medicine

• andros_rex@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  “Proof of effectiveness” means a placebo controlled trial. Preferably multiple, with sample sizes substantial enough for sufficient statistical power.

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  • HerbGrower@slrpnk.net ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Or we could just start selling placebo tablets and make a fortune. I have some clay in my garden that should be easy enough to shape into pill shapes. We could even paint a few of them red and sell those as extra strong.

    Not hurting anyone…

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    • Jarix@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Um Clay would have an effect. Use powdered sugar and simply compress them into a pill. This is literally one way they do already make placebos in pill form. You can buy a pill press on amazon

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      • HerbGrower@slrpnk.net ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        Sugar isn’t great for diabetics. Wouldn’t clay just pass through as it has no nutritional value.

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    • almost1337@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Why waste valuable clay when you can just sell homeopathic remedies?

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  • Senal@programming.dev ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    ah, that makes sense.

    Does that still apply if the underlying mechanism isn’t understood?

    I know examples of this exist already , I’m wondering if “proof of effectiveness” really means just the effectiveness in this context.

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    • andros_rex@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Effectiveness is independent of mechanism. As an example, to my knowledge SSRIs don’t really make sense but mostly outperform placebo.

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      • Senal@programming.dev ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        Agreed,

        Pretty sure anesthesia is similar, (in the not fully understanding the underlying mechanism)

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    • turmacar@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      We are only ‘pretty sure’ of the mechanism of how Tylenol works biochemically as of 2025.

      You can test for effectiveness and dangers and everything else you need to prescribe something to get a good idea of whether its actually doing something or not.

      ‘Alternative medicine’ is largely, “I felt better after a bit”.

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      • HerbGrower@slrpnk.net ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        We didn’t know how alcohol worked but it was still an effective medicine for battlefield surgeons through history.

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• Jarix@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I would say how doesn’t it?

  A placebo is known to NOT work. That medicine has defined, understands and even utilizes the placebo effect is exactly in that definition.

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  • Senal@programming.dev ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    It’s known to potentially have an effect , even if the actual treatment administered was known(by third parties) to be inert and the effect wasnt the one originally planned.

    Thats not the same as not working at all.

    This is a core part of blind tests, the whole reason you test using a placebo is to isolate the effects that can’t be attributed to the actual medicine.

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    • Jarix@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I’m not sure why you are repeating what I said as if I didn’t already say that.

      Yes, it’s known to have an effect. But the placebo itself literally does nothing. It’s not a placebo unless it is guaranteed to do nothing or it wouldn’t have any value to science with how they use it. Any effect is psychosomatic and NOT an effect of the placebo. Hence the term “placebo effect” this is incredibly important when testing to gather for useful data.

      I’m guessing you just misunderstood what I was saying since you seem to be releasing me other than the distinction between placebo and placebo effect

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      • Senal@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        • I asked about the placebo effect, by name.
        • You recited the placebo effect to me like i didn’t just mention it directly.
        • I recited it back with extra detail , to make clear that i know what it means.
        • You recited it again, with additional detail, and asked me if i misunderstood your reply containing the definition of the thing i was asking about, by name ?

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