Comment on question for the culture

IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

• OldSageRick@lemmy.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  What you are describing is an open relationship, so both parties are in a relationship but may seek sexual pleasure elsewhere.

  Cheating on the other side has a core component which is the problem, lying.

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  • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    that’s what I practice and am open about it. I hate those who say they are poly as an excuse after being caught cheating. Not because of the cheating itself, but because they lied to get with someone they knew won’t want that. Therefore the cheated partner had no informed consent. And I’m not sure this is a mainstream view. but I consider informed consent as consent, and therefore no informed consent is rape.

    Someone who lies about who they are to have sex is a rapist, just using conman tricks instead of drugs or force. And should be seen by society as such.

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    • OldSageRick@lemmy.zip ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I may misunderstood what you mean, but from what I got I disagree.

      A person who cheates on their partner may have done psychological harm because of their lie, but no rape happened, since both people engaging in the sexual activity consented to it. Although the partner likely is against it, they are not a party to this activity and therefore their consent or non consent does not matter, at least as it depends on if this action can be considered rape.

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• Cracks_InTheWalls@sh.itjust.works ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Imagine you have a relationship where one of the rules each person is expected to follow is “Do not have sex with other people.” You both agreed to it. Then you find out the other person broke it. Trust is gone.

  This would be different than someone saying “Hey, I know we agreed to this rule, but can we revisit that?” and having a grownup discussion about ENM alternatives, where someone has the opportunity to say that is a dealbreaker for them or declare boundaries that make this OK with them.

  Nonmonogamy is cool is everyone is aware and onboard. Fuck cheaters.

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  • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    i find such rule to be inherently controlling and coercive. and used to punish abused and neglected partners who find affection elsewhere but can’t leave their relationship due to coersion or fear of homelessness.

    Cheating like that should be like “we agreed were both in a diet, but I had a donut that someone brought to the office”, not “you are inherently a horrible human being who deserves to be shamed and hated for seeking human connection”.

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    • KindnessIsPunk@lemmy.ca ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      It may be but if two parties agreed to it in good faith and expected it to be the norm going forward under no duress, then they are absolutely a shitty person for not abiding by it.

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      • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        I would never agree to those terms, so they don’t apply to me.

        the problem is that society, states, and religion pushes those standards as if they are the only correct form of relationships. they are arbitrary rules based on ancient forms of control, where women were seen as free household labor and baby factories.

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      • DudleyMason@lemmy.ml ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        If two parties agreed to it under no sense of duress

        As long as monogamy is considered the default and something most people wouldn’t ever consider getting away from, it’s impossible to enter a monogamous relationship absent coercion, because the coercion is societal.

        Just like there’s no such thing as voluntary employment under a capitalist system, there’s no such thing as voluntary monogamy in a world dominated by Western, Bronze-age sexual politics.

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    • Cracks_InTheWalls@sh.itjust.works ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Then don’t enter into relationships where that’s a rule, or negotiate alternatives 🤷‍♂️

      I’m not going to say there aren’t circumstances where cheating is understandable, but it’s still a bad thing to do, even in the scenario you describe. Taking the abused and neglected cheating partner’s perspective - what happens when your partner finds out? What happens when someone else finds out and uses this information to blackmail you? Are you really going to be better off than you would’ve been making and executing an escape plan instead?

      Cheating almost always outs. Everyone thinks they’re going to be the exception, but by definition few are. If you’re unhappy in your relationship, either get all people in the relationship onboard to start addressing that, or leave. If leaving is going to create problems, prepare in advance to address those problems. IMO you’ll be better off for it v. cheating.

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      • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        you’ve never been in an abusive relationship and it shows. Ideally no one should ever be in one.

        I hope it’s ok if I copy pase a reply I did to someone else, but I’m getting a lot of replies and there’s no point in writing the same thing twice:

        I would never agree to those terms, so they don’t apply to me.

        the problem is that society, states, and religion pushes those standards as if they are the only correct form of relationships. they are arbitrary rules based on ancient forms of control, where women were seen as free household labor and baby factories.

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• IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Damn, had no idea how unpopular that opinion was. I expect it to be unpopular, just not universally so. still, I will die in this hill. Suggest people to check out “relationship anarchy”. And I will be open about it, so absolutely no one who wants monogamous relationship ends up with me, I wouldn’t want to hurt anyone.

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  • Quetzalcutlass@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Relationships are built on trust and establishing boundaries. Cheating (as the name indicates) breaks both of these. It’s completely different from an open relationship due to one missing and very important component: consent. If your partner is okay with it, have all the (safe) sex you want. But going behind a loyal partner’s back and breaking their trust is of course going to hurt them.

    Even if they would have been okay with an open relationship, you not asking beforehand will have them wondering why you hid it from them, if they did something wrong, if they’re not good enough for you, if you ever loved them at all, and what else you might be doing behind their back. Your betrayal will have destroyed their trust in you, and rebuilding the relationship will be an uphill battle if it’s possible at all.

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    • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      me and my partner are open about who goes on dates with whom. not for a sense of control, or even trust, just because we like each other and are interested in each other’s lives. And if they completely forget to tell me, not a big deal. she is not my property, I’m just happy to share time with her whenever she wants to be with me.

      Just like friends, you don’t tell your friends when you hang out with another friend and what you do with them. you might if it is relevant to the conversation or they might care. but witholding that information isn’t lying by omission.

      all those rules you are bringing up, aren’t rules you and your partner decided, those are default social rules enforced by religions and the state and comes from medieval property laws. you should sit with your partner and decide what your relationship should look like. even if neither of you want other partners having that conversation and critically questioning monogamy would be a healthy conversation.

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      • Quetzalcutlass@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        I agree with you that societal rules are mostly arbitrary bullshit. Communication and consent are the important things. Your relationship should work the way its participants all agree on.

        You might want to edit your original post though. You’re probably getting downvoted so heavily because without that context it sounds like you were cheating on an unknowing partner and couldn’t see any problem with it.

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• basxto@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  If it is really good cooking and I get lunch packs. (And am still allowed to cook for myself)

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