Comment on is black myth wokong a good game?
Jumbie@lemmy.zip 2 days ago
Yes, and I think so for unpopular reasons.
I’m the rare person that finds anything “Souls-like” insufferable and annoying. I avoid those games because they’re built on frustration and anger-inducing difficulty spikes. This game is not those things but the internet not stop saying it’s a Souls-like. That’s because Souls fans thinks Souls games are a positive comparison when it simply turns off most gamers outside that fandom.
The Souls comparison was the reason I almost never touched Black Myth.
Then I tried it on a friend’s console and my mind changed.
Black Myth has a story. Not something you have to create in your head (cough, Elden Ring) based on environmental clues but an actual story based on Chinese myths and folk tales.
It drives you. It motivates you. You want to keep playing to see the next thing. The environment and the enemies and the fighting styles and the character you play drip atmosphere and mystery and substance and style.
The place where this game shines is where most games in a similar genre falter. It keeps the power fantasy intact.
There is difficulty to be had but not once was it unfair or anger-inducing. A boss defeating you is a lesson to move on and come back. The movements aren’t you just rolling around and hoping you don’t get hit like another annoying series I won’t mention again.
In this game you are the threat. You are the one with the power. If you can’t beat someone come back because not too further up you’ll discover the power or skill to come back and destroy that enemy.
Fun. This game is fun. Gamers like fun, yes?
I played it for about 10 minutes. I did not like it for the same reason I do not like “soulslike” games: There is way too much delay between initiating the action and the action being taken, in which time the enemy launches a much faster attack, which you’re now vulnerable to because you’re mid-attack.
I’m honestly at a complete loss as to how anyone plays these type of games.
This was an issue with two things: People are too used to the timing in Souls games and hate change.
The second and most probable reason was the fact that the game had some bad input delay at certain resolutions. It can be rectified by changing your graphics settings in-game. This was my particular issue and I fixed it using a YouTube video. I’ll try to find it and link it back here in an edit.
From what I understand you have to find when the enemy is vulnerable after launching an attack so that you can safely launch your own attacks. Dark Souls 1 and 3 are relatively generous with their safe windows and relatively rigid with their attack combos so it’s a lot more accessible to that kind of gameplay than later games like Elden Ring and Bloodborne.
There is difficulty to be had but not once was it unfair or anger-inducing. A boss defeating you is a lesson to move on and come back.
That is a perfect description of Elden Ring.
I vehemently disagree. I slogged my way through that game so I could speak with experience on the subject. That game only feels fair to Souls players because it tried to be less annoying than the games that preceded it.
It’s unfair, the bosses are too large for the screen and your character wins by luck and repetition. No skill required (because it’s luck when you beat a boss).
I cannot stress enough how much disdain I have for “Souls-like” as a category. Developers should note: Putting that descriptor in your game is shutting out a vast majority of the gaming community. The fans are a niche; a sliver of the gaming community.
I have no problem with people liking the genre but the genre is not mainstream for a reason. We can have challenge in a game without it being frustrating.
I played through Elden Ring, and while it’s not my personal favorite game, it is objectively an excellent game. I never finished any of the DS games, they were too linear for me.
To say that all the wins are based on luck and no skill is objectively false. The most extreme ER enjoyers regularly clear the entire game, entirely naked, without ever once being hit. That means the mechanics are highly deterministic and thus completely learnable. And for the record, spam rolling or spam attacking is the quickest way to die in nearly every fight. If that’s the strat you went with, I could see it being quite the slog.
I agree it doesn’t offer a “power fantasy”, it requires the player to observe, learn from failure, and develop a plan. If you don’t do that, I agree, it can be a very infuriating game loop. But I would argue that’s not the game’s fault.
I agree that sometimes the camera is a total pain to deal with vs the scale of the enemy.
Most games don’t market themselves as a “souls-like”, it’s typically a comparison the gaming community makes, but also it’s definitely over-used to just mean “hard game”. That’s not what I would say makes a souls like. THE “souls like” mechanic, I would say, is the notion of dropping “souls” on death, and having to retrieve them without dying again. Which means there are definitely turn based souls likes, and I would not consider the Megaman series “souls likes”.
But IMO it’s experience vs simulation. If you want your game to inevitably shuffle you through an experience that you will inevitably get through, that’s totally fair and one aspect of gaming that I think closely mirrors film or literature. I would put excellent story experiences like TLOU in that camp. But if you want a game to put you through a simulated challenge which tests your resolve, subverts your expectations, and evokes emotional responses in a unique way that I believe only games can, then the souls games offer one slice of that experience.
You are extremely, verifiably wrong
There is difficulty to be had but not once was it unfair or anger-inducing
I mean, scorpion lord is pretty damn rage inducing. But i love soulslikes so that didn’t bug me too much.
That boss required timing, skill and pattern recognition later in the game. With multiple skills unlocked it’s fine.
It’s a hard fight but not unfair.
I didn’t say it was unfair. I said it was rage inducing.
As I said in my original comment, the lesson was to move on and come back when you were ready, whatever form that took.
Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world 2 days ago
I absolutely agree about difficulty and frustration. I’m in my 50s, my hands are a bit fucked, and I don’t have the reaction times I did a few decades back. I also just don’t have as much screen time. I don’t want to spend that limited time getting my arse kicked again and again and making no progress. With a few notable exceptions, if I can’t get past something after a dozen or so tries, I’ll usually quit.
It’s very hard to define the difference, but there’s a type of difficulty that gives me a real feeling of triumph to overcome, and there’s a type that just annoys me. I can’t be arsed with the latter - life is short and backlog is long.
musubibreakfast@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Not to hijack but I can relate, I’m in acting school and we had an older gentleman join. He kept getting his ass handed to him in class because he couldn’t keep up, so he decided to quit. At first I thought it was lame, so I told him not to quit, but then he explained to me that he was 66 years old and didn’t know how much time he had left so he wanted to spend his time doing things that brought him joy.
Jumbie@lemmy.zip 2 days ago
You’ve identified one part of the issue and it’s a valid one.
Aside from aging, games have also evolved into lazy design. What used to be difficulty was really innovation a decade+ ago. Take a game like the original Soul Reaver. The bosses required specific skills and strategies you had to figure out in order to win. If you didn’t figure it out they would laugh and mock you for failing. It was genius and you felt accomplished when you figured it out.
Contrast that to Elden Ring. The moveset isn’t intuitive and your character moves like it’s not attached to the world.
The bosses are just extremely higher health bars and your health bar is on the opposite end of theirs. That’s it. That’s the game difficulty.
So “strategy” just means dodging until you can get a hit on the overly large boss and repeat for long periods until someone dies. I find it lazy and uninspiring.
So yeah, you’re not crazy.
Amnesigenic@lemmy.ml 2 days ago
Delusional
Jumbie@lemmy.zip 1 day ago
Well, thanks for telling us. Perhaps seek treatment?