Comment on he forgor

LillyPip@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

• Lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  So, how long ago did you leave?

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  • LillyPip@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    15 years ago. Unfortunately not of my own volition (I became I bece unable to work due to disability).

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    • BarHocker@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Writing left is better anyway

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• vrek@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  There was a viral post from Twitter or linkedin years ago of someone posting saying they wanted to hire someone with “10 years of experience using ruby”, a person replied, was told they didn’t meet the requirements, they said something like “look at my profile” …if you looked at the person’s profile they were the creator of ruby, they literally wrote the language. The language was only 7 years old.

  I don’t even remember if it was ruby but the story is basically the same. Impossible requirements written by people who don’t even know what they need.

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  • LillyPip@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Well, this shows that the people in charge have no idea what they’re running, and are not adding any value. We’ve been brainwashed (by them being our eyeballs and brains) to think they do.

    They do not.

    I cannot stress this enough:

    THEY DO NOT.

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    • vrek@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Agreed, sorta. The one caveat is that people hiring are typically hr, not technical people. In large companies they are there to fill out paperwork and limit company legal liability. They don’t need to know the difference between a unsigned char and a long variable in c.

      The people is charge should have hired better people to have those roles. Also whoever wrote those requirements messed up. I learned a long time ago there are basically 2paths forward professionally, technical and management. issues arise when then the needs of those two mix and the person doing so is not up to the challenge.

      People can design a 120 to 12 volt power supply on graph paper. Others can talk to 5 stake holders on a new product about what color the plastic container should be and have 1 answer and everyone happy that they won at the end. Both skill sets are valuable. The main issue is we, society, put so much value on the second group and severely limited the potential of the first.

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  • Hasherm0n@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Pretty sure that was dhh, the creator of rails being told he didn’t have enough experience in rails. I tried to find it, I found references to it, but the original was in Twitter.

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    • vrek@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Thanks. I guess it was rails and not ruby but still same idea. Rediculous that a creator doesn’t have enough experience. As I said I understand it’s probably hr and “people persons” writing stuff for “tech people”. Not an excuse just fact. It’s a sad, horrible fact. Anyways thanks for confirming my memory from years ago.

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  • squaresinger@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Friend of mine applied for a job where they asked for at least 5 years of experience with Angular version x.y.z (can’t remember the exact version). The friend responded that he had 10 years of experience with versions x-3 to x+1.

    The HR person doing the hiring asked back “But do you have 5 years of experience with the exact version x.y.z?” to which he answered “Version x.y.z has only been out for 3 years so it’s impossible to have 5 years of experience with it.” HR wrote back saying that he was rejected because he didn’t have 5 years of experience of experience with that exact version.

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    • pulsey@feddit.org ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Letting HR make such decisions is already ridiculous, because they would have no clue what even working with version x.y.z means. For them it might sound like that you have experience working with win11, but they need somebody that knows win98.

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      • squaresinger@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        The process for this is usually like that:

        • Software dev team lead: "We need another senior frontender."
        • HR person: "Ok, what are you looking for?"
        • Software dev team lead: "Someone who knows how to use Angular."
        • HR person: "Great, so which version of Angular are you using?"
        • Software dev team lead: "Version x.y.z"
        • HR person (thinking, not saying): "Ok, so senior means 5+ years, so 5+ years of version x.y.z it is!"
        • Also HR person: “Why can’t I find anyone who’s qualified?”

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  • Gork@sopuli.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Well if he did literally develop the web, that would indeed make him the web developer.

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    • vrek@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      He did en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Berners-Lee and was knighted for it. Just funny that my understanding is his most recent resume claims he’s a “web developer” just like someone fresh out of a boot camp. No, you are THE web developer.

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• how_we_burned@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Fun fact: I had a career in which I was in charge of hiring other people to fill the expanding roles in my department, and was tasked with hiring ‘more of myself’, but I was not allowed to even consider people with my own qualifications.

  I had a similar problem. Writing JDs for new roles I had to fill I was constantly getting them knocked back by HR.

  Finally HR called me and explained that for what the job entitled we couldn’t possibly pay the market price for it.

  I was like but that’s the job. Shit I thought I had made the JDs pretty succinct and austere already.

  Nup apparently we’d be paying upward for $100k for a job the guys in team were only getting $60k.

  As you can imagine we got a lot of applications but 90% weren’t even close to what we needed.

  I was mostly self-taught, and was only allowed to consider people with at least a bachelor’s degree in a field that didn’t even really exist yet.

  Same.

  I personally don’t like hiring uni graduates. Their utterly lost and difficult to motivate. And almost always what they learned in university does not help whatsoever in the role. Especially dev roles.

  I’d much rather find people who can look at the work

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  • thesystemisdown@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    The execs think they’re hiring someone to churn out code, and some people are better at that, like everything else. They don’t understand that they need someone that can figure out what code needs to be written, and why, and that they need someone that gets what the difference is and that there’s always someone that writes better code.

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  • LillyPip@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Sorry, but this is kinda separate:

    we couldn’t possibly pay the market price for it.

    &

    I was like but that’s the job.

    This is literally what labour unions are for?

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    • anomnom@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      And it sounds like everyone doing the role for $60k should have been looking elsewhere.

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    • how_we_burned@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Sorry, but this is kinda separate: This is literally what labour unions are for?

      I would love it if unions entered my workplace but we’re far to complex and technical. Not to mention in my industry we go through a good 2-3 restructures a year (yeah I know it’s bat shit insane)

      In lieu of a union I made it my personal aim to get all my under paid employee bumped to much higher pays. Which was a problem because my team generally only took on existing employees who showed aptitude for technical and complex stuff.

      In returned they got a detailed and complex training on everything from sql, to parsecing very large amounts of data, to building complex mappings and results.

      Under older management they were often left on their previous pay. I found that really fucking disgusting so I made sure to build a rating system that fairly rated them but made sure that rated/scored/reviewed work automatically ended up on their end of year statement. It was all built using MS stuff. It was cool. I could go in, score their work, it graded them, weighed for complex vs simplex (and different roles) generating a single score. I could do it all year around so if something flag I could easily raise it in our catch ups. I had 3 teams across the entire country (I did a lot of travelling so I could meet my guys and hang, coffee, beers, lunch etc)

      It basically meant that everything was documented and very fucking detailed, and because they were meeting the straight forward no sneaky lawyer trick KPIs it meant they were able to smash it.

      So at EOY where we did peer review the other managers tried to shoot down my ratings for my guys (which gave them 10% bumps and hit their STI (approx $2-4k bonus) however kept coming up against the documentation.

      It should be the number one goal for any manager to make it realistic and possible for their guys to get their bonus and pay raises.

      Coz a happy team is a good fucking team. As a direct result of this effort we solved over 99% of all the work on our ledger by EOY.

      If anything we were a little too successful. But that’s story for another day.

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  • LillyPip@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Thanks. It sounds like our backgrounds are similar.

    Writing JDs for new roles I had to fill I was constantly getting them knocked back by HR.

    That’s awful. It feels really bad when you feel you’re standing in the way of people getting jobs. When you would normally feel like you might be a leftist, this sort of point can be easily exploited to make you feel bad, right?

    I don’t even want to address the rest of your points until we go over this one because it feels so important.

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    • how_we_burned@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Oh yeah, absolutely agree. But I was utterly maliciously compliant in getting my guys their pay increases and bonuses.

      I replied in this thread to another person raising a similar concern. Check it out.

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  • fluffykittycat@slrpnk.net ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I went to college to learn to code and barely did

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• LemmyKnowsBest@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  You can probably guess how that went.

  So how did it turn out? You ended up hiring nobody?

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  • LillyPip@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    No, I ended up hiring under qualified people who had skills on paper but had no talent for the job, because I had to look at candidates who had ‘book’ qualifications in adjacent fields but not passion of qualifications that actually meant anything.

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