Submitted 22 hours ago by nedwben@lemmy.ca to [deleted]
My coworker is an idiot and can’t explain his own thoughts. Nice guy though.
He said he was reading and discovered that Ukrain started the Russian war by building a Dam that would starve a community of water. He didn’t know when or where, but was sure it was before any invading or annexing.
I can’t find any information on this. I’ve been googling and googling. Nothing. I can’t ask him for sources because if I get him going again he won’t stop.
Please help if you know anything.
lol 😂
I know two things to be true:
Russia started the war.
Your coworker is an idiot.
Don’t downvote a genuine question… 😟
Thank you, the answers have been massively helpful. I appreciate the vote of confidence.
He is misinformed or deliberately revising history to fit his narrative. Ukraine’s damming of the canal was done after the annexing of Crimea, and in direct response to it. The other relevant dam, the Kakhovka Dam was built by the Soviets in the 1950s. It was destroyed (after a few failed attempts) by Russian demolition charges, though they continue to deny it.
There were arguments from Ukraine about the continued Russian occupation of their Sevastopol naval base in Crimea, which Ukraine wanted to end. That was the real provocation that Russia could not tolerate, but that is not so sympathetic of a story as saying the “Ukrainians cut off the water to the poor independence-minded Crimeans” /s
Of course, if someone is going to wholesale believe one side or the other I doubt there is any way of convincing them otherwise, but the facts simply do not fit the Russian narrative. If, indeed Ukraine “damming the canal” was such a great provocation that they had to start a war over it, why then did Russia subsequently destroy Kakhovka dam during said war which dried up the canal anyway? Of course they claim they did not, because it is a war crime, but it’s pretty absurd to pretend that Ukraine had the means to do it given the dam and surrounding area was very thoroughly under Russian control at all times.
That is absolutely what he was trying to talk about! Thank you!
It was shut down after Russia invaded in 2014 and was only %18 of the drinking water supply.
I really appreciate the effort you put in to get me that information.
No Putin was provoked when President Clinton removed the nukes from Ukraine.
Is your coworker Donald Trumpf?
Not Trump himself, but he’s a big fan, facebook tells him to be.
I don’t think the post is in bad faith and it fits the purpose of this community. It sounds like OP is asking where this talking point comes from in order to counter it effectively.
The title could have been better
Thank you.
I am in fact looking for the root of this disinformation my coworker has read. It was driving me crazy not being able to find any sources.
Most of these lies are based on something with some truth. I find flat out rejecting them makes no progressin the discussion, but explaining the true context works much better.
“Ukraine started the Russian war by building a Dam that would starve a community of water” is a statement that has no basis in fact.
That which can be stated without evidence can be countered without evidence.
Thank you for the confirmation, I appreciate it.
I mean you can go around his probably fake thing by just saying none of this deserves 2 years of wars and dead civilians.
Yeah, that was essentially where it was left at. He said Ukraine broke a contract with russia (he ad pivoted to the NATO encroachment defense of the war) and I said even if there was a valid contract that legally justified war, it wouldn’t morally justify killing Ukrainians and displacing them from their homes.
That is the impasse we left it at.
It’s pretty telling if “the death of civilians is bad” amounts to an impasse/agree to disagree situation
(he ad pivoted to the NATO encroachment defense of the war) and I said even if there was a valid contract
Two things about this ‘NATO encroachment’ angle people like to bring up:
There was never an agreement that NATO cannot accept new members. Even Gorbachev, the last leader of the Soviet Union, the person whom the agreement would have been made with, calls such a claim a myth.
One has to ask why countries want to join NATO. It is something they have to apply for, something they have to work for. Why do they want this security guarantee? Who are they afraid of?
It’s Russia. It’s Russia invading everyone around them that has pushed countries to join NATO. Georgia, Moldova, and Ukraine have all been occupied by Russia. Is it a wonder why former Soviet states like Poland, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania so badly want protection from Russian invasion?
BombOmOm@lemmy.world 22 hours ago
He is probably referring to the North Crimean Canal which fed water into Crimea. In 2014, Russia invaded Ukraine and occupied Crimea. Ukraine shut down the canal as they are under no obligation to provide water for crops in Russian occupied territory.
This canal was fed by water from Kakhovka Dam’s reservoir. However, Russia blew up this Ukrainian dam in 2023, which has since cut off all potential possibility to fill the canal.
In summary, Russia invaded Ukraine, fucked a bunch of shit up, killed a ton of people, and is trying to pin the blame on Ukraine.
nedwben@lemmy.ca 7 hours ago
The North Crimean canal is absolutely what he was trying to talk about. He didn’t even know what or where Crimea was so it was tough to understand.
Thanks for the tldr and the links, that’s perfect. Appreciate the effort.
BombOmOm@lemmy.world 5 hours ago
No problem, man! The annoying thing about disinformation is it spreads so easily. While attempting to tease out truth can take much, much more effort.
The biggest thing is teaching people how to be critical of what they hear and seek verification when something seems off. Problem is, once you get too far in, the truth is what seems off and it can take quite awhile to dig yourself back out, assuming you are even willing to try, which most aren’t.
Chip_Rat@lemmy.world 22 hours ago
Thank you for the short explainer.
Hopefully OP is genuine and will come back and see this and then tell his “friend” he is an idiot.
nedwben@lemmy.ca 7 hours ago
Hey, I’m back. Tried to tell him Russia the started the war, but it he was so adamant about this dam. I had no knowledge of it was impossible to break through.
Probably not going to go back to my coworker, because I just can’t afford to open that can of worms. But I did genuinely need to know. I live in a disinformation riddled hotspot. I try to stay on top of the truth and the small truths bad actors sprinkle in the lies.