Comment on Yes

• MoonJellyfish@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I guess I agree that this wall has nothing to do with any form of democracy or communism. Just wanted to be edgy and post something against ML.

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  • Wofls@feddit.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I honestly wonder where the hate for communism comes from. Yes, the stereotypical historical examples were disasters. But as others here have mentioned, the problems in these systems were not rooted in a communist economical system (which there also wasn’t really). And assuming educated people should be able to differentiate between these I can only suspect the capitalism-blue-pill.

    And to illustrate further I’d like to quote my very wise and definetely NOT communist literature teacher: In heaven there’s communism. I think that dums it up nicely. If you sant to hate something, don’t hate the idea, it in itself is pure and you’re making a fool of yourself if you didn’t wish for it in a perfect world. Hate the realisations? Maybe, but also noone seriously tried yet…

    But if one just hates on it for the sake of having an “enemy” in turn validating the system oneself is a part of, that’s just a lack of reflection and critical thinking. Capitalism does not work and we’d see it everywhere we look if we wanted to. We just can’t imagine any other system anymore and that is the trap our society has fallen into. Blind religious belief in a economical system (ridiculous by itself, I might add). Let’s atleast try alternatives or compromises before we finish burning down our planet.

    Also: I love democracy, fix democracy first. Priority number one.

    Thank you for coming to my tedtalk

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    • Delphia@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Ill respond honestly even though I did make fun of tankies not realising this is a shitposting community.

      The problem with capitalism is the same as with communism. Corruption, Cronyism, Nepotism, Greed and Dishonesty. People preaching for communism point at those things in capitalism and act like communism wont have the exact same bad actors trying to game the system.

      No there hasnt been a modern attempt at communism because past versions were such SPECTACULAR failures (admittedly mostly for reasons that arent actually related to the system of governance) that the well is poisoned. If you cant convince people that masks prevent the spread of disease when its a scientifically verifiable fact you arent going to convince them that communism is viable.

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      • Excrubulent@slrpnk.net ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Modern socialist/communist projects that do not create states to be corrupted or coopted:

        youtube.com/playlist?list=PLvwoHdNGq9wUbrwTZ2k8yX…

        The first video is a list and the next few go into detail about individual projects. This is an ongoing series.

        The reason you don’t hear about these like you heard about the USSR or the CCP is because they are doing good things and not turning on their own people, so they don’t make good capitalist propaganda, so instead they stay off the radar. That to me means they’re doing the right thing.

        There are thousands of projects you don’t hear about because people that aren’t trying to replace the old boss with the new boss aren’t trying to get your attention. They’re doing the work to make an alternative system that doesn’t get crushed by reactionaries.

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    • ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      In heaven there’s communism

      I like this quote, for a few reasons. Namely, Heaven is not real, and since “communism has never been tried” as “all states that did try stopped in the autocratic phase neglecting to dismantle themselves,” and that is almost certainly the outcome that would happen if anyone ever tried anywhere again, communism is effectively not real either. They’re both unachievable utopian concepts that offer simply “hope” more than anything concrete.

      Furthermore if heaven was real, I’m not 100% sure it’s not an autocratic “benevolent dictatorship” ran by God and his Angel literal soldiers. It really does seem analogous to communism as practiced. Can you go against God in heaven or would you be cast down to hell with the other political dissidents in a heavenly holodomor?

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    • nevemsenki@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I lived in socialism/communism (depending om who talks about it). After having experienced it, I’m definitely not wishing it back.

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      • TokenBoomer@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Thanks for giving me the opportunity to link @Dessalines

        Michael Parenti refutes this sentiment in Blackshirts and Reds, with citations.

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    • GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Heaven is anarchy: everyone does what they want, which is to be good and helpful to each other.

      Heaven is a (benevolent?) dictatorship: everyone does what God wants, which happens to coincide with their desires.

      Heaven is communism: everyone helps each other and has access to the same resources, although since a lack of scarcity is implied, this may not require helping each other out in material means.

      Heaven probably isn’t capitalism: given a lack of scarcity, communal access to resources, and everyone having their own housing, organized trade of any kind seems kind of pointless.

      Heaven probably isn’t a democracy: if everyone agrees on the major issues, why would you vote on them? That said, everyone in heaven chose to be there, so that’s the one vote you get.

      Note the 3 underlying issues in each of those. Similarity of goals, which isn’t going to happen anytime soon; people putting the common good before themselves, which likely won’t happen until…; and a lack of scarcity, which won’t happen until certain currently-unlikely events occur.

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