Exactly, feed them sugar and they’ll happily stay, that’s not saying it’s good for them. Plus all the monoculture on which they often feed is detrimental to their survival as a species. It’s funny to me how in this capitalist world, there is a living being that is somehow not immorally exploited.
Comment on I'm right and the other vegans are wrong
mittyta@lemmy.world 2 weeks agoI agree with you on the fact, but willingness to stay does not equal informed consent.
CyanideShotInjection@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
RobotToaster@mander.xyz 2 weeks ago
Exactly, feed them sugar and they’ll happily stay
Guess I’m a bee.
roguetrick@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Good news: we’ve found ways to satisfy them with the conditions while also killing the hives.
lime@feddit.nu 2 weeks ago
that makes sense.
lime@feddit.nu 2 weeks ago
completely fair, and a response that would hawe been greatly appreciated at the time.
LotrOrc@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Listen i love animals and I 100% believe they are far more intelligent and empathetic than humans like to give them credit for, but even a human isn’t reading and signing apples terms and conditions i doubt an elephant is either
veryblandusername@fedinsfw.app 2 weeks ago
Informed consent does not exist in the animal world and I’m very saddened that that’s a sentence I had to type.
You cannot apply human standards to animals, they do not understand contract law…..again, a sentence I’m just very sad I had to type because they didn’t understand that.
Fawkes@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
I’ve tried to have this discussion SO many times, and every time I’m treated like there’s nothing I love more than raping goats and torturing pigs.
That cow that lives on the hobby farm, spends its days roaming fields and eating flowers, then gets milked in the evening and petted with genuine love and affection, is not worse off because the farmer didn’t create a formal contract in order to obtain it’s consent to be milked.
It gave its consent by walking to the milking station, and waiting to be milked.
“Nuh uh! That’s not consent! It didn’t learn English and say the words ‘I consent to being milked,’ therefore milking it is evil!”
surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I have to imagine that those people are virgins, because no one is signing a 17-page contract prior to getting it on.
Consent is allowed to be simple as long as it’s obvious and real. I shouldn’t need a law degree to suck a dick.
TrickDacy@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
People who would be angered by this aren’t reachable, ya just gotta block em.
TrickDacy@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I have known vegans IRL who are genuinely reasonable and can discuss this stuff. On the Internet, 95% of the time you just cannot even discuss it with someone who identifies as vegan, I would imagine even if you’re a vegan yourself, unless you 100% agree with them on how to apply the philosophy. In this very thread I asked a question and it was all but ignored and I was assumed to be shitting on veganism rather than questioning a specific argument/interpretation of it. I think it sucks because I literally agree with like 90% of everything any vegan says, it’s when they veer away from the facts and more toward personal feelings they have that I cannot talk to them about it anymore. It makes sense on the one hand because if that viewpoint resonates with you it’s gonna make you upset to think about and to be shit on for, but on the other, if it cannot even be discussed without false assumptions, insults, and avoidance of inconvenient facts on their part, they’re just going to lend credence to the anti-vegan prick arguments. Because of this extreme inability to even discuss the topic I have to block a lot of vegans because I’d rather do that than always remain silent for fear of upsetting them. They always seem 100% convinced I’m an evil carnist who hates them and is pretending not to be just to erode veganism, but it’s just not so.
Fawkes@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
I’m in the same boat. I actually agree with 90% of veganism. Animals shouldn’t suffer needlessly. People should eat less meat and animal products. Factory farming is horrifying and unethical. Where it falls apart is the universal claim of “Therefore, even the smaller regenerative and ethical farms are evil, because ALL animal use is unethical.” Which, if you follow the logic and consequences, requires us to either support millions of animals in domestic environments without ANY method of financial independence beyond donations or government support. Or, we drive dozens of distinct species to extinction, simply because some people feel personally attacked when I make an omelette. If we could ask the animals themselves, I struggle to believe that a happy cow living on a dairy farm would prefer non-existance to getting milked occasionally when they want to.
I have very little respect for anyone who cannot justify opinions, or get offended when beliefs are questions. If you don’t want your beliefs questioned, don’t announce them.
veryblandusername@fedinsfw.app 2 weeks ago
You just gotta stop giving a damn what dipshits think.
Post your initial message so that some passerby might glean some insight and then move on.
The opinions of people whom I will never ever see nor interact with ever again means less than nothing. They can think I’m the biggest fucking idiot in the world, doesn’t matter to me, I’ll sleep just fine.