Yeah they should have a word for this. Borderline pedophile maybe? I mean I see 19 year olds from time time and get exposed to their life view/style. For a 44 year old to date an average 19 year old, that person really need to have some “issues”. Ofcourse there is still the chance that she was like a decade ahead of her peers in terms of mental maturity and what not which maybe makes it slightly more ok but not by a large margin.
Comment on True love
SethTaylor@lemmy.world 10 hours agoHe was 44 and she was 19 when they met
Avicenna@programming.dev 8 hours ago
Indigobunting@lemmy.world 6 hours ago
If your daughter meets someone who makes her happy, shouldn’t you just be happy for her? You sound exactly like a conservative saying “Imagine if your daughter came home with a woman!” Maybe it’s not about you.
SethTaylor@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
This account is 15 days old
I think I’ve just figured out why all these gross comments are getting upvoted so hard ?
Is anyone else concerned someone is posting these posts and commenting these comments and upvoting said comments to give the appearance that Lemmy or this instance alone is dominated by perverts to then start spreading that lie all over the internet or… am I being paranoid?
Cause I mean… seriously. It’s like Andrew Tate HQ in this comments section. And the arguments are so weak that I don’t even feel vaguely enraged by them. It’s like they’re… not even real people. Like… I’ve never met anyone like this IRL.
Is there somekinda minor drama going on between instances? Is someone doing this in a coordinated way? Cause all the comments are also very similar to each other.
Oh, well… anyway… 🤨
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today 3 hours ago
In my experience lemmy has always been pretty misogynistic. I think it’s just a byproduct of having a heavy tech community bias. Anytime anything about women’s rights gets spoken about they come out of the woodworks.
Indigobunting@lemmy.world 3 hours ago
So, anyone who doesn’t hold the same opinion as you is a pervert and fan of sex trafficking. I see.
You’ll be shocked to learn that some 19-year old women can actually think for themselves. Gasp! And then 13 years later when they’re married to that person with children, would you tell a 32-year old woman with children that she was groomed? You don’t think she could have realized that at some point in the last decade-plus? Maybe she understood exactly what she was doing at the time and still does today.
Andrew Tate is a sex trafficker. Billy Corgan is a libertarian asshole. I personally have no desire to date someone that much younger than myself, though I have dated someone that much older than me and never felt “taken advantage” of.
But two consenting adults should be allowed to have a romantic relationship. I mean, where do you draw the line, exactly? Is 35 and 25 perverted? 35 and 24? How far do we go? Does it matter that the older person is a man? If it’s always the case that a 19-year old dating a 44-year old is a manipulative relationship, then it should be codified and made illegal, right? And if that’s not the case, then who the fuck are you to judge these people?
There’s no conspiracy here. You just can’t stand that someone would dare to question your claptrap and deprive you of precious Internet points.
SethTaylor@lemmy.world 2 hours ago
would you tell a 32-year old woman with children that she was groomed?
Yes.
Dude… wow… I am shocked
I literally don’t have to say anything. You’re making yourself look absolutely horrible. What I am reading here is the kind of comment that tanks a politician’s campaign. Didn’t think I’d see it on Lemmy. Purely vile.
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today 5 hours ago
I guess if you do not have the ability to recognize that people can use experience and material resources to manipulate…
You sound exactly like a conservative saying “Imagine if your daughter came home with a woman!”
Ahh yes, homosexual relationships are exactly like a 50 year old millionaire dating a 19 year old. It’s so obvious!
Indigobunting@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
Damn, poor Billy aged 6 years just so you could double-down on your ridiculous point.
But why stop at romantic relationships? Every relationship has the potential for manipulation. It’s only fair that 19-year olds only interact with other 19-year olds with similar socioeconomic backgrounds. Otherwise, they could be manipulated to do all manner of things!
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today 3 hours ago
Billy aged 6 years just so you could double-down on your ridiculous point.
I guess I should be accurate with numbers… Lord wouldn’t it sound bad if 44 year old was dating a 13 year old.
But why stop at romantic relationships? Every relationship has the potential for manipulation.
And you are saying all relationships have the same impact on your life as a marriage or long term relationship? Or are you just asking incredibly dumb questions?
Damionsipher@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
Is your premise that 19 year old are not adults? Or that there ought to be caps on age differences written into law? Or that women should be infantilized until they lose any notion of being “young”? I find it incredibly weird how much effort and criticism is placed on individual relationships based on age-difference alone. It screams Puritan ideals of feminine innocence and the evils of sex. If there is evidence of coersion or grooming, let’s hear it. Otherwise all I see are efforts to undermine the notion that a woman (especially a young woman) is capable of making “good” romantic decisions.
SethTaylor@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
Is that what you’ll tell your young girlfriend’s dad when he’s about to punch your eye?
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today 3 hours ago
Well … This person has clearly never had a girlfriend, that’s why they are like this.
Damionsipher@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
Is parental violence a good measure of what ought to be OK in society? Should a parent who assaults their child for being gay be used as a measure to tell if being gay is ok or not? Should a 19 year old boyfriend’s dad be vindicated in assaulting their 50 year old girlfriend? What about if it’s a 19 and 50 year old gay couple?
If age-gaps alone are reasonable grounds for violence, they are reasonable grounds for laws. Under the eyes of the law in every western nation, a man assaulting another man for pursuing a relationship with their 19 year old daughter would be considered a felony assault, and in no way aggravated (at least not in and of itself). If a 25 year old man is dating a 75 year old woman, is the direction of abuse and power dynamics static (i.e. should we presume that the 25 year old man is being groomed/abused)?
It never ceases to astound me how readily people are to assume 19 year old women are incapable of holding power/emotional maturity.
I’ll bet you’re the type who celebrates caricature of dads striking the fear of god into the hearts of anyone who would attempt to undermine the innocence of their daughters. I’ll bet you laugh your ass off at movie scenes where 16 year old boys have guns pulled on them as a “dad greeting the boyfriend “joke””. Yeah, real healthy society promotion going on in your head…
SethTaylor@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
I’m not reading this bullshit
Go tell all this shit to real people face to face and see their reactions. Deranged lunatic
porous_grey_matter@lemmy.ml 5 hours ago
Do you understand that something doesn’t have to be illegal to be gross?
Damionsipher@lemmy.world 5 hours ago
At a societal level, no, I don’t understand that. At least not in the context of broad criticisms and sweeping generalizations about people. I see little difference in saying that “age-gaps are gross” and say that “queerness is gross” when talking about social norms and customs. Both are value statements about how a person should be. I reject the foundations of that sentiment as being anti-feminist and forcing conformity based on personal values of how a person should be allowed to exist. Where laws come into play, they ought to be specifically focused on minimizing harm and prioritizing wellness. We set laws around social norms towards considerations of how we can regulate a complex world in an efficient manner. Yes, that means drawing arbitrary lines in the sand around things like age of consent, which is a short hand for age of generally accepted maturity. If we want to decide that people aren’t actually mature enough to engage in consent until 25, 30, or 50, we can collectively decide to enshrine that in law. That doesn’t mean the issues suddenly vanish, and it will likely cause all manner of unintended consequences (should someone who isn’t deemed mature enough to be in a relationship be allowed into the workforce, or to vote?).
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today 6 hours ago
Are these all strawman arguments? Are they made to hide your lust beneath a thin veil of feminism? Does your faux feminist view actually help protect women, or does it help protect the men who prey upon them? Does your analysis account for material and social power dynamics?
I find it incredibly weird that anyone is immature enough to date someone half their age. As someone quickly approaching their 40s, I have nothing in common with someone in their late 20s, let alone someone who’s 19.
Do you think evidence of grooming or coercion is often exposed before the damage is done?
It’s hilarious that you are trying to act like you are defending the woman in the relationship, while simultaneously assuming that anyone is criticizing the woman and not the 50 year old millionaire…
SethTaylor@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
You hit the nail on the head here. Well said.
Damionsipher@lemmy.world 5 hours ago
So I’m your worldview women are inherently in need of protection from men, who are inherently predators? Yeah, maybe go read some feminist texts before making broad generalizations like that…
Yes, I would apply considerations of wealth imbalance far before applying considerations of gender imbalances, as wealth imbalances tend to create much more oppressive conditions.
Now whose strawmanning? Should every relationship need to conform to your notions of “normal”? Why couldn’t anyone use that same rationale to broadly criticize mixed culture relationships, queer relationships, or any other form of relationship? You can literally replace what folllows “I find it weird” with any descriptor - it’s not a reasoned position, it’s a felt one.
The fixation on the 50 year old millionaire and not the specifics of their relationship erases the woman. What’s the millionaire’s partner’s name? Who is she as a person? Has she spoke about abuse, coersion, or grooming? Do old men always groom young women? Are young men impervious to grooming, coersion, and abuse from old women?
Do you think that narratives that place women as innocents who need to be protected are useful in pushing forward feminist golas of sex/gender equality? How? I think that empowering women to understand they are individuals who can make choices for themselves and who can hold otherwise in positions of power to account is a much better approach.
TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today 5 hours ago
Another strawman… Are we talking about all men? When did I say all men were predators ? We are talking about a 50 year old man who’s been married several times and has defended the abuse allegations of his good friend Marilyn Manson?
And you aren’t doing it in this case because…? Also, how often do you see a relationship between an old man and a teenager where there wasn’t a wealth imbalance…it’s almost like that’s inherent to the problem.
Still you. How is being able to relate to someone not topical to relationships?
Lol, it’s telling that you are equating all of these to a 50 year old millionaire marrying a 19 year old. True ally.
What exactly is the through line between mixed culture, queer relationships, and “any form of relationship”? And what prevents them from relating to each other? Oh, I’m queer and so is my partner…we obviously don’t have anything to talk about. What are you talking about?
The dude is from an entirely different generation.
That’s not a specific of the relationship?
The whole point is that the power dynamic is obvious and can be abused to control the relationship. Including talking to people about the relationship.
Is there not an established enough history of that happening coming from rich, powerful, and famous men?
Did I say anything about rich powerful and famous women not being able to do the same?
That is the narrative you are attempting to represent this as. Women are systemically disadvanged on both a legal and economic scale that makes it easier for wealthy and powerful men to treat them as sexual objects. Attempting to ignore the systemic history of misogyny and then declare that if you don’t think women are capable of being invulnerable to these forces is misogynistic. Feminism not just about equality, it’s about equity and recognition that the patriarchy is maintained to isolate women from the equity that would free them of another avenue of control.
How exactly is the 19 year going to hold their powerful partner to account if they are abused? Choosing to be controlled by a much more powerful man is your version of feminism?
Avicenna@programming.dev 6 hours ago
I don’t think most people here focus on the gender, it might be you who is doing it either for winning a argument by agitation or it reflects your internal state of reference on the topic. This is not related to gender at all in my perspective.
The main argument is difference in age, mental maturity and compatibility. Younger people, having less experience in life generally will have poorer decision making skills in this regard and are also more easily manipulated by more experienced people. You may oppose such a relation for the same reason you may oppose two people of the same age making kids at the age of 18. Ofcourse if you are their guardian, next natural step is to probe how well they defend their decision and how well informed they are in the potential gains vs losses.
I presume you would be less ok with this if it was 40 vs 16. But any age limit you put between 16 to 19 will be a blanket limit considering the worst possible cases in terms of mental maturity. So being ok for 19 and not for 16 is kind of arbitrary. The only tangible fact here is that 19 is just about the age where your life view really starts to mature where as someone at the age of 40 has had like 10 to 20x more life experience in their mature years compared to you. It creates the same kind of power imbalance that a teacher student has.
Damionsipher@lemmy.world 6 hours ago
If years spent as a mature person is a decider of relationship imbalance, should a 60 year old be allowed to be in a management position where 19 year olds are employed? We can play the arbitrary game of “when it’s someone adult enough to not be manipulated”, but to your point, it’s arbitrary. If age is indicative of power, is it the power differential we are actually concerned with? If a white man holds more power in the world by virtue of the world being a racist and sexist place, is it immoral for a white man to date a black woman due to that imbalance of power? What about wealth differentials? Should a millionaire be allowed to date someone without wealth? Should a 19 year old be allowed to take financial advice from someone twice their age? How can we be sure they aren’t being manipulated in their naivety? We have laws that guard against manipulation, exploration, conversion, and fraud. Do you think that age is the best metric for judgement in these types of issues? Should people be vetted for mental capability to engage in any number of acts, rather than using the standard of 18 being adulthood? Is presumed completion of highschool at 18 a reasonable enough metric to establish “educated” or mature, and if not, should we raise the age for involvement in everything from relationships to work, out or even voting to be more directly tested metrics, or older, to say 25, or 30?