ALoafOfBread
@ALoafOfBread@lemmy.ml
- Comment on Talk like an 👽 1 day ago:
That’s just what has happened on Earth, though. Also I didn’t specify they’d be coming to us - if they landed here in something we’d recognize as a rocket, then I’d suspect we’d have a lot more in common with them.
But what if they evolved in gas clouds? Or hell what if they perceive higher dimensions? What if it’s a 4D being, capable of instantaneous long distance travel through spacetime - they don’t need math for that. Or even language. Those are far-out scenarios, but I’m just saying that it takes a very earth-centric, anthropocentric view of intelligent life to assume the sorts of things that’d make communication possible.
- Comment on Talk like an 👽 1 day ago:
My trouble is that they may have a totally different theory & understanding of numbers, language, symbols, names, etc.
For instance, what if they don’t have the concept of symbolic representation of objects/concepts in visual/auditory ways? That seems incredibly fundamental from an anthropocentric perspective, but their neurology would be totally different - maybe they evolved a different way to store concepts.
Or say they do, but we get to math - and their understanding of math is similar to ours and they represent it symbolically, but beyond that their perception of time, self vs other distinction (theory of names type stuff), senses are so radically different that we can’t ever reach enough common ground to communicate.
Maybe they communicate with like, pulses of IR light that we can detect & reproduce, and they represent numbers basically like morse code and they have words for standard mathematical and logical operators. And maybe they have hearing and can see the visible light spectrum - just to make things easy.
But
- their neurology is such that they can’t comprehend the link between sounds and meaning
- same with visible light. It’d be like us seeing magnetic fields and making the leap to thinking planets were talking to us.
- they don’t have an understanding of names. Individuality for them is not a concept they understand - there are individuals, but they are not referred to. Maybe they speak in generalities & objectives. Not “you, go farm the field” but “satiate hunger” - perhaps who does and where/how this is done is not particularly important or it is marked with pheromones or context or something.
- they do not have phonetic components of speech.
So, how do we communicate?
We can broadcast numbers at them maybe. We place 2 apples in front of them and broadcast “two” on repeat in distinct, discrete sequence: Two. Two. Two.(…— …— …—) Maybe we start throwing the word for apple in there in morse code. ( …— . - .–. .–. .-… .)
To get the message, they’d need to understand that:
- sequences of IR pulses generated by things other than them can have meaning. Granted, seems simple enough.
- the length and cadence of the pulses matter. We could presumably figure that out by observation & tailor our communication to them, granted.
- intention is to name the two objects in front of them. Hmmmm that is suddenly a bit harder since they don’t typically view names the same as we do. But maybe.
- phonemes can be represented with IR flashes. Oops, they don’t have a concept of those… they’d have to make a massive leap to understand that. But maybe they’d view the word as an ideogram.
- the 2 we were broadcasting referred to the quantity of the apples and not some other feature. Not a given at all, they could take it to mean any number of things, in theory.
- the specific type of thing that an apple is can have a name. Not a given.
- that we are referring to the apples and not to something else. Maybe the act of presenting objects, the act of flashing IR light, the concept of presence vs non-presence, etc.
- that we were labelling the thing as apple and not instead talking about what you use it for, where it comes from, how old it is, it’s scent, who knows - could be anything.
It is not a given that they get past apple. The likelihood, I think, goes up when you contrast it with something else, but what if they don’t understand comparison and contrast similarly to us?
Okay. Say they understand apple. We go through thousands of things to build up their vocabulary of objects. Maybe we show them someone eating an apple next and they know the word for human and the word for apple.
They have to understand what verbs are, have some concept of grammar, the relation of things in the sentence, the conveyance of cause/effect - the specific human is causing the action of the apple being eaten.
“Human eat apple” could really mean anything in this context. Perhaps they don’t know that words like these presented in a different context have the same meaning. Or they don’t understand eating in this case - like it is an unimportant concept, the concept they understand is what is achieved by eating.
Anyway. It all gets very abstract. But, what I’m trying to say is: thinking we can communicate with creatures that evolved in a totally different context assumes their neurology is strikingly similar to ours in ways I think are honestly far-fetched. Some of the above could be solved, with difficulty, given enough time and motivation, but it takes a lot more assumptions than I think people typically realize regarding how anthropic the aliens would be. And the challenges go beyond mere logistics & extend to fundamental linguistic/psychological/philosophical/neurological barriers.
- Comment on Talk like an 👽 1 day ago:
People always say that, but like… what does that actually mean? Like we could work from first principles and just build a system of communication based on math?
Gotta say I have my doubts. I have no idea what alien cognition would be like.
- Comment on Hamdurger season 3 days ago:
Add a jalapeno iris stuffed with a cream cheese pupil right in the middle of those bad boys. Got yourself an evil eye hamdog
- Comment on Easter diagram 6 days ago:
- Comment on Asmeinkampf 1 week ago:
A guy who incels like to watch because he is one. Hikikomori/LDR type who stays in his room filled with trash and roaches and streams. Incels and other rightwingers listen to his political opinions because… yeah idk.
- Comment on [deleted] 1 week ago:
It just like… doesn’t reallt matter? Especially if you’re browsing all - then you just see stuff from everywhere federated. That’s basically how I use lemmy. I don’t only look at stuff from one instance
- Comment on [deleted] 1 week ago:
.ml doesn’t federate with nsfw instances, so All is clean. There’s probably other instances with a similar policy
- Comment on Owlcat is using generative AI for The Expanse Osiris Reborn, but the final game will be "100% human made" 2 weeks ago:
Well… you see… 25% of the game is 100% human made!
- Comment on Switch 2 demand appears to be flagging as Nintendo reportedly lowers production 2 weeks ago:
That’s why most people I know got the switch. They got it in spite of bad performance to play older 3rd party games on a portable, social format. Can play with friends, on the bus, on the couch. Don’t really need better specs to do that.
The nintendo games are largely just a bonus, imo. They’re very expensive and I personally wouldn’t seek them out if I didn’t also own a switch. If I had kids or was a kid that’d be a different story, probably.
- Comment on Switch 2 demand appears to be flagging as Nintendo reportedly lowers production 2 weeks ago:
The value proposition just isn’t there. Much more expensive for better performance and… pokemon pokopia? There aren’t any games really taking advantage of that increased performance that I am aware of. My switch 1 still works. I’d like better performance, but not $500 worth
- Comment on ??? 4 weeks ago:
大体上都是胡说八道。
- Comment on ??? 4 weeks ago:
你好，来自小米的小林同志！ 我看到了你在 Roblox 上发出的请求，但认为并不令人满意。因此，我已在《企鹅俱乐部》上提出了自己的反提案。请在您方便时尽快予以审阅。你的头像和习近平同志一样帅。我期待与您合作。
- Comment on Fascism bad. 4 weeks ago:
HA HA take that COMMIE you’re braver than me due to your genetic superiority! ^oh ^wait
- Comment on Pretty solid offer. 1 month ago:
I receive: being in trouble
You receive: “okay”
- Comment on A succulent meal 1 month ago:
I’ve literally been doing this for lunches. Bake a loaf of bread, have a rotisserie chicken on hand for the week, a block of cheese. Boom. Lunch.
And when I have soke more time or am tired of that, make some porridge with oats and chicken. Maybe a little broth, some onions, seasonings.
Dont underestimate peasant mode. Lunch for the whole week for like $12
- Comment on Where *does* the money come from? 2 months ago:
True! Co-ops are great
- Comment on Where *does* the money come from? 2 months ago:
It also depends on the state the company is incorporated in, but yeah that’s true.
And it is a duty to the corporation (legal entity), notably not to the workers themselves; so while the interests of workers and the corporation may align sometimes - you don’t have to do what’s best for the workers if it isn’t best for the company.
You still need to operate lawfully, and you can’t pay so little that you can’t hire/retain anyone, and you need to pay enough that you can hire people skilled enough to do the job, but you need to pay (ideally) only that amount and no more. Anything else takes away from profits and, you could say, makes the company less likely to succeed - if the company doesn’t succeed, then no one would have jobs. Or so they’d argue.
The same as for goods, the price of labor is treated by employers as “what the market will bear”. For goods, that means higher prices, for labor it means lower prices.
- Comment on Where *does* the money come from? 2 months ago:
The reason for this is pretty simple: necessity.
Companies have a fiduciary duty to maximize profits for shareholders.
If no union exists, that means depressing wages as much as possible while meeting staffing needs.
If a union is forming, it means spending as much as you need to stop it since, if you don’t, you’ll be unable to depress wages over the long term.
When a union exists, well then they have to negotiate to continue operations and so workers get paid more fairly.
- Comment on Man posts his incorrect opinion online 2 months ago:
Dobles para defensa del hogar también
- Comment on The developers of PEAK, explaining how they decided on pricing for their game. 2 months ago:
I’m not saying it’s rational, it just feels like more money.
- Comment on The developers of PEAK, explaining how they decided on pricing for their game. 2 months ago:
Little different for me:
$1 - 5 = $5
$6 - 12 = $10
$13 - 20 = $20
$21 - 50 = $50
$51 - 70 = $100
$70 = $1000
- Comment on Is this Boss Baby's troubled cousin? 2 months ago:
Why does he look like methhead Mr. Bean in profile
- Comment on He lid 2 months ago:
Sbren Sbeve
- Comment on This is crazy. Why don't you just take their car ? 2 months ago:
That’s a really good point. Sliding scale payment maybe (with no cap on income - if you make a million bucks a year and are always speeding, you’re going to be paying a hefty fine)
- Comment on This is crazy. Why don't you just take their car ? 2 months ago:
I feel like the better option is to have local government foot the bill - but the driver owes the value of the device if it’s lost or damaged. In theory, insurance would have to cover at least some of this and they can still use their car. AND if they drive safely, they should owe nothing long-term.
That’s idealistic though. I’m sure the “tough on crime” crowd would want the individual to foot the bill.
- Comment on This is crazy. Why don't you just take their car ? 2 months ago:
And speed is highly correlated to the lethality of car wrecks. Also, it sounds like the devices wosuld be installed in the cars of people who… speed frequently.
So, it is directly addressing the problem without asset seizure or jail time. Sounds like an ideal solution, actually.
- Comment on Can anyone explain why? 2 months ago:
Idk. I think people get legitimate prescriptions and sell pills, mostly. If it’s not buying from someone you know who sourced them that way, idk how you’d verify it’s what they say it is.
- Comment on Can anyone explain why? 2 months ago:
Yeah, I know some Gen Z college kids, and I will attest they definitely spend significant money on alcohol. And cigarettes.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the vice money is just split between alcohol, cigarettes, weed, vape carts, and adderall.
- Comment on LETS GO GAMBLING!!!! 🤩🌟😋 2 months ago:
Oh yeah for sure. Just make sure it isn’t sorbitol or you’d spend the same time on the toilet that cigarettes would shorten your life by
