Don't overthink electric car charging (we should be doing it differently)

Comments

• artyom@piefed.social ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I’ve been charging my cars this way for 9 years. You do need a sufficiently efficient vehicle. You ain’t charging a Hummer this way. Also I recommend getting a “heavy duty” receptacle because I have melted a couple of them after a while.

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  • Botzo@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    I charge both my ridiculous Lightning and PHEV Volvo this way.

    But I’m on track for only about 3500 miles for the year (10 months in) on the lightning.

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• CompactFlax@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  He makes good videos in general and this one is long enough I’ll have to make time to watch as usual, but as he has ranted about extension cords in the past, I’m not sure that it’s a wise idea to make the case to just use any plug and pull maximum (12? Amps) current for 10 or more hours continuously, let alone with the potential addition of an extension cord because the garage outlet isn’t quite in the right spot.

  I think for safety reasons it’s probably best for people to have a shiny purpose built high amperage circuit installed so that old work doesn’t burn the house down.

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  • ch00f@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Standard outlets are rated for 15A. The vehicle is already de-rating by 20% per NEC requirements for any appliance running for more than 3 hours continuously (which is how you get 1800W hair dryers but only 1440W space heaters).

    Assuming code was followed for your house wiring, nothing is at risk there.

    Then it’s just a matter of buying the right extension cord. Note that the vehicle will refuse to charge if the input voltage drops below a certain level (in my car, I think it’s around 110V).

    So you only have to worry about a 10V drop at 12A or 120W of heat dissipation. Assuming all of this happens inside your extension cord, you just need to make sure you don’t coil it up too tightly (or, better, don’t use such a cheap cord).

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    • Onomatopoeia@lemmy.cafe ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Then it’s just a matter of biting the right extension cord

      Right.

      As TC has covered this before, consumers are clueless (and cheap) about extension cords.

      Also, just because code is/has changed, doesn’t address current homes and also imperfect installs. How often have I seen loose screws on outlets…

      No, charging for high current, long charge time items like this should be like any other high current, long-run devices like stoves, dryers, etc, using a dedicated, properly sized circuit.

      I don’t want my house burning down because my neighbor was clueless and caught they’re lithium battery on fire.

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    • MrTolkinghoen@lemmy.zip ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Yeah the wire is already rated at higher than 15amps. It is safe if it is modern wiring. I wouldn’t do it with knob-and-tube, but any solid core 14awg thhn should work at 12 amps continuously. Just use the right extension cord. Hell worst case you could probable just swap the head on a 20amp extension cord to a 15amp head, and never have to worry about the cord at all.

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    • CompactFlax@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Assuming code was followed for your house wiring, nothing is at risk there.

      Big assumption, because houses aren’t all on NEC 2014, or 1999. Also assumes the circuit isn’t in use for other things - garage door openers are very convenient and are supposed to be on a reserved circuit, assumes that the connections are tight, and oxidation free.

      There are reports of new dryer outlets melting because while they meet code, they aren’t constructed to run full output for 12h+ straight, charging a Silverado. Never mind the 1965 Bakelite outlet in the garage.

      I agree with your point in concept but in practice it’s best to get a good electrician to run a new circuit from the box in even somewhat recent construction.

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  • noredcandy@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    I’d also argue, at least in the US, it’s only going to cost several hundred to have a 50 amp outlet installed.(mine cost $350 and I didn’t exactly comparison shop). Compared to the price of even a used EV that’s an easy investment to make.

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    • artyom@piefed.social ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      That’s entirely dependent on your home. They often cost $1k+.

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    • femtek@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I needed a new panel, upgraded service from 100 to 200amp and a circuit to the garage, then installing the car charger. $3600 all in.

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• nerdyshades@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I tried trickle charging, and it worked. Keeping it plugged in all the time while I wasn’t driving meant, by week’s end, I was back to full.

  However, I don’t have a garage, I have a carport. Keeping the cable run on the ground in a common area all the time was drawing ire from the HOA, so I installed a Level 2, so I only have to charge it once a week overnight.

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• acosmichippo@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  i wish i was lucky enough to have a garage. we had to run a new circuit out to our townhouse parking lot anyway, so at that point we figured might as well make it an L2 charger. now we have 2 EVs and it would be way more of a pain in the ass (or impossible) to trickle charge them. not to mention i just prefer having the cable out as little as possible in a public space.

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• partial_accumen@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  “The last people you should be getting advice from about electric cars is electric car enthusiasts.”

  And then, Alex the electric car enthusiast himself, goes on to say later:

  “I don’t know why the world isn’t getting excited about this! You can literally have a gas station at home using the exact same technology that operates a clothes dryer!”

  I love you Alex! Never Change!

  First, he’s right in his first statement. Those of us that really are enthusiasts will go far beyond what is needed, and may lose sight of what someone that isn’t an enthusiast actually cares about.

  Second, a suggestion for Alex, if you are on the Fediverse: You very briefly touched on the NEMA 6-20, but I think it needs more attention.

  To me that outlet (which goes on a 240v at 20A circuit) is the sweet spot for home EV charging with regards to speed and low cost. Why? It uses the same common cheap 12/2 household wire that many of your existing household circuits use. With copper prices always on the rise, larger gauge wire starts getting exponentially expensive. The magic is really the 240v. You don’t get double the charging speed of 120v, you get nearly quadruple! And for the same wire! One other change I’d recommend is getting hardwired EVSE (car charger) because it can let you charge faster on the same wire as a plug in charger (because of electrical safety codes). If you have an electrician at your house running a circuit anyway, having them wire up a hardwired charger at the same time is not a high price increase.

  I know this is a Tesla specific charge, but the value here is showing all the various current ratings and how that scales with charging speed. Check out our 240v 20A hardwired charger performance (in the green square):

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  15 MPH of charging from cheap 12/2 wire (regular yellow romex)!

  One extra note here, if you already have a dedicated 120v (15A or 20A) circuit to your garage with a regular outlet on it, you can simply change the breaker in the box to a 240v breaker and change the outlet receptacle in the garage with zero modification to the wire in the wall) and get the benefits of 240v speed charging!

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