Comment on Americans: How the hell do you meet new people or get into relationships after college?
ameancow@lemmy.world 17 hours ago100% this, you shouldn’t even have expectations, the term “flirting” shouldn’t be in your mental language, you should approach socializing in a different way instead of labeling interactions.
“That person is nice, fun and attractive, I want to say something that will make them feel good, because they deserve it” is a far better approach than “What magic words can I say that will make them horny for me.”
captainlezbian@lemmy.world 17 hours ago
Idk I find intentionality valuable in flirting, it’s just that my intent is to flirt and if it goes from there well then that’s fun. A sly smile with the compliment, then paying attention to see the tone of her response… it’s a game and it’s in some ways unique compared to telling a stranger I like their outfit (which I also do non flirtatiously).
“What can I say to make them like me” is the far more juvenile framing. It’s one I’ve seen especially beginners fall into. Instead framing flirtation as a (metaphorical) playful whisper of interest. It should be like a scent you wear: light, discretionarily used, inviting, and yourself. You’re not casting a spell to make them like you, you’re simply inviting them to come and see what could happen if they’re interested.
But all that is more the intermediate level. The only real secret is that people like spending time with people with whom they enjoy the time they spend with.
ameancow@lemmy.world 16 hours ago
This is so true, and exactly like cologne or perfumes, a lot of people, guys especially, do NOT get it and really overdo it and then wonder why it’s so hard to meet people and date.
What you’re describing is a kind of subtle and nuanced interplay that people explore with each other when they feel good and have minds that are somewhat on the same wavelength.
I think we have a huge problem in the modern world with a lot of guys, particularly neurodivergent, who have a much harder time not approaching social lives and relationships from a mechanistic, procedural perspective and speaking as someone neurodivergent myself, I totally get it, but it takes work to overcome this kind of thinking and “let go” enough to enjoy the process and treat it more like a lazy, flowing river, than a switchboard with dials and levers to pull.
This is why the Andrew Tates and Redpillers and so, so many of their adjacent “movements” caught on like wildfire in a growing population of guys with less social interaction as they spent more time online instead of learning outside with trial and error. The promise of a manual, an instruction book that lays out steps.
And it’s been devastating to our communities, our cultures and our social bonds as a species.
captainlezbian@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
Oh absolutely, and I (also neurodivergent, but adhd and cptsd) totally get that, I just think it’s valuable to be clear what the intermediate and advanced skill levels look like. Because I should be clear here: beginner skill level flirting as you described earlier can do the job when someone is already interested, but much like with many skills, if you’re at the beginner level, sometimes you’re going to see someone doing it at a higher level than you and think that they’ve got this magic skill that makes the results happen. In reality getting better at flirting is 90%+ getting better at regular social skills.
And yeah most people can learn that interplay in some capacity. I’ve known people who can only do it with their fellow neurodivergent people, or their fellow neurotypicals, or both. But you learn it by hanging out in social situations and trying to have a good time chatting with people. You start to learn how to vibe off people and how to tell you’ll be able to. It makes stuff like parties actually fun too. But you also are gonna fuck up, and you ask yourself what you did wrong (“why did it stop being fun to talk to me” is a great question) and you start to get better at not fucking up with practice. Even extroverted neurotypicals go through this, though it’s typically younger, faster, and easier for them. And yeah from there higher skill level flirting is just flourishes and added bits.
It’s hard for those of us who actually want to help because the truth is, it’s long, difficult, and doesn’t make you feel cool. There’s no secret manual, no special magic tricks, no guarantees even. It isn’t a strategy game or an rpg, it’s a roguelite where metaadvancement needs to complement what you rolled (the parts of your appearance and personality you like) and your natural playstyle because you’re trying to get people to like the version of yourself you’re working to become. What’s the ideal build? Becoming the best version of yourself, learning how you best naturally socially interact, and building around it. You find hairstyles that show off your personality and your face, similar for clothes, interests, and topics of conversation. But you also gotta learn to play the game well.
I think negging is a prime example of the distortion that a lot of these pua/redpill/etc influencer types do. Playful teasing is a medium risk medium reward move. You might come off as fun, irreverent, and playful (in which case you need to be prepared for a riparte), but you might hit a sore spot and if you’re not able to do it well you will fuck it up. But these types took that and twisted it into a version meant to make the recipient feel insecure and vulnerable while trying to feel like the innocuous version. Each subsequent iteration of that crowd took ot further until you get the modern guys saying that being an overtly abusive asshole and raging misogynist is how you get girls. And to a man who is increasingly bitter towards women over not dating him it feels right.
There’s also a lot to be said for these guys feeling insecure at the power they perceive people they’re attracted to having over them and lashing out against it (and it’s not just men who do that). But yeah as you say it’s gone disastrously for society.