Comment on Blueberry milkshakes

• voluble@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Ripple effects, sure, I’m with you there, sustainability considerations, which I haven’t seen anyone mentioning ITT.

  I completely disagree with you about the status of humanity. Is it really your view that the well-being of a crab has equivalent moral status to your own well-being?

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  • SmoothIsFast@citizensgaming.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I completely disagree with you about the status of humanity.

    Why because we happened to evolve to think? Given enough time something else would of if not us. Given we may end up causing our species to go extinct due to careless disregard for our environment and even human life in general. We really are not that special and it would serve us to treat the ecosystems, which enable life on this planet to thrive and evolve, with respect if we want to live long enough too see other stars or at least leave the planet in a decent state for the next species if we all die from pointless wars like humanity seems to love doing regardless of if we treat our environment better.

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  • RubberElectrons@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I don’t like hurting animals. If one believes we really are a special species because of things like our innate curiosity, I think you’ll understand the interesting quest to try to eat without hurting anyone/thing.

    Why? Better, why not?

    • Consider how difficult “getting off this rock” is with live food onboard. Plants can directly feed humans with limited processing. With some processing, you can make tasty high protein burgers. Admittedly, still not nutritionally the same as beef, but compensable in other ways.
    • We’re a concious species (mostly), why not try to avoid hurting our fellow companions in this barren wasteland called space? Who else do we have in the known universe?

    I still eat eggs & cheese. Perhaps a day will come where I don’t need those either. I hope you’ll be curious enough to try some alternatives too.

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    • voluble@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I’ve read good moral arguments for a veganism. I think it’s the right thing to do when it comes to diet. For what it’s worth, this isn’t really a discussion about diet.

      It isn’t a decision between a lentil burger and a beef burger, this is an animal resource that can assist in saving human lives. There are other clotting factors used in medicine, and that’s great, let’s use and develop those. But suppose something more lethal and dangerous than COVID comes along, and vaccines need to be produced quickly and globally. I think it would be foolish to wince if we needed to take crab blood to roll out a program that would save human lives.

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      • RubberElectrons@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Nothing wrong with wincing, and trying to keep the crabs alive as well. Sure, we gotta live too.

        But we gotta degrow a bit. As a species, humanity is running the planet a little too close to the redline, to put it mildly.

        Nothing is blank and white, and the older I get, the more shades I see. We can, should, and will strive for better.

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  • ThunderclapSasquatch@startrek.website ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    If the crabs die out we lose the blood, from both sides its better to be as sustainable as possible.

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  • angrystego@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I don’t know about spacecowboy, but I do. I still eat crabs, but I don’t think I’m superior to them morally just because I’m more intelligent or something. We’re just animals eating each other.

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    • voluble@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I don’t think I disagree with you.

      What I mean when I say moral is, I don’t see why it’s wrong if a bunch of invertebrates are subjugated, in pain, or die in order to provide something that improves the lives of humans. It’s not sad, it’s a good thing. “Oh but the crabs get stressed out, and 30% might die”, yeah, who cares, they’re crabs.

      Sure, I’m a human, and I have a particular perspective on these things. But, we are special. Anyone who considers a trolley problem with a crab on one track, and a human on the other and honestly says, “hey it doesn’t matter humans aren’t special”, is psychotic and needs help. In a purely academic, cosmic, arrangement of particles sense, OK, nothing is special. But in that condition, the suffering of animals isn’t event a question worth considering.

      The fact that so many accounts in this thread are going out of their way to give weight to the well-being of invertebrates, in a conversation about human well-being, is baffling.

      Should we be using existing clotting factors in medical settings that don’t rely on the blood of an endangered species? Probably, but crab discomfort is at the very bottom of the list of reasons why.

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      • angrystego@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        People can think of other species as being morally as valuable as people and not be psychotic.

        They can also chose the human in the trolley problem and still feel bad for the crab. If the trolley problem included people from my familly and strangers, I’d chose my family, but not because I think it’s morally superior. I would feel bad for the other people.

        The line where compassion stops can be drawn anywhere. Many people draw it where their nation or race ends. Many people draw it at the elusive pet/food distinction. Many people draw it where being mammal stops.

        I don’t think drawing the line is based on moral principles. It’s practical. Sometimes you need to eat meat, sometimes you need to fight in a war. But when it comes to morality animal lives are animal lives, no matter whether it’s a crab or a white male human. They’re either all worthy of compassion or non of them is.

        So that’s my point of view. And thanks for your previous answer.

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      • ParsnipWitch@feddit.de ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Because some people see morality not as something that’s subjective but believe it is a moral objective truth that suffering should be reduced as much as possible.

        That’s not more or less rational than to believe humans are somehow ‘special’.

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      • Gabu@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        “Oh but the crabs get stressed out, and 30% might die”, yeah, who cares, they’re crabs.

        “If I shot a couple of your fingers off, who cares, you’re not me. I only care about me.”

        The fact that so many accounts in this thread are going out of their way to give weight to the well-being of invertebrates, in a conversation about human well-being, is baffling.

        That’s called not being a cunt.

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  • Gabu@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I’d rather see a dead human than a dead non-human, to be honest… (with the exception of insects, those buggers freak me out).

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    • abraxas@sh.itjust.works ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Would you tell that to your spouse when the dead human was your kid?

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      • Gabu@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        In that fictional universe, do I get superpowers?

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