Comment on 2hot2handle
Warl0k3@lemmy.world 1 day agoYeah, Men do it to each other all the time too. Though the sociological context makes it much less difficult to manage, as there isn’t the cultural tendency to dismiss other men when they imply they have an understanding of a field that is perceived as typically male-exclusive (hard sciences, mechanics, etc.). It’s a term to describe a complicated and fairly important topic that has unfortunately become a buzzword for people to reject because it’s been characterized as criticism based on a fundamental aspect of a group (being male) and not as it’s intended, as a comment on a specific person’s behavior.
ronigami@lemmy.world 23 hours ago
It also has an anti-intellectual aspect to it. People like to explain things, that’s sort of the whole idea behind science, is to be able to do that. Sometimes people try to explain things and they’re wrong. And that’s okay, it’s part of the process of science. Further, the notes of patronization are subjective and not everyone would agree they’re present here.
So to automatically label things like this as “mansplaining” makes a few unfair assumptions.
Warl0k3@lemmy.world 23 hours ago
And there’s the issue with it being treated as a criticism of an entire group, and not as a comment on a single person’s behavior. There are obviously exceptions and any interaction between humans is going to be uniquely contextual. But presenting it as anti-intellectual, or some kind of attack on the ability for an enthusiastic person to explain something they are passionate about, fundamentally mischaracterizes the concept.
To explain something needlessly, pedantically or condescendingly and to someone (usually female) that is already versed or even an authority on the topic are the traits of ‘mansplaining’. What is happening in the OP, where someone is condescendingly and needlessly correcting a woman (who can be assumed to be aware of 3rd-grade level science like phase transitions) on her use of a term (that was already a correct explanation) is the issue that makes it mansplaining.
You can be enthusiastic about a topic and share that knowledge all you want, nobody is saying “no don’t explain things to girls”. They’re saying “don’t be rude to other people while explaining things”.
(This always comes up in this discussion: being autistic is not an excuse for being rude. It’s an explanation for non-typical behavior, and does merit and nearly always garner forgiveness for infractions of social norms, but you can still be a rude jerk even if you are autistic. You can also be a great person if you are autistic. Autistic people are, fundamentally, people. People are a diverse group.)
squaresinger@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
My biggest pet peeve with terms like “mansplaining” is that it does contain a real issue with some actual definition, but then it uses such a blunt and crude word that’s just plain besides the point of what it actually means.
If this was a term against women, feminists would be up in arms because the stupid terminology almost guarantees that it will be understood and used wrong.
Because fundamentally, the word itself is man+explaining, and it’s used just like that: Whenever a man explains something a woman doesn’t want to hear, it’s mansplaining. No matter who is the expert in the field.
In a prior job I was head of software development. I built the team, I built all the software, I worked on all the hardware we sold.
We hired a new marketing person. She had no prior experience, it was her first job in the field after returning from a long maternity break and before that she worked in an unrelated field. She put stuff into marketing material that was plain wrong. She listed features that we not only didn’t have, but that didn’t actually apply to the whole product category. When I pointed that out, she tried to shut it down with “Don’t mansplain”.
The concept behind “mansplaining” is real and it is a problem in some circumstances. But the term is toxic and needs to go.
(Similar story with the term “toxic masculinity”, which is often understood as “all masculinity is toxic”, not as “machismo”. This one really annoys me, since we already had a really good term, “machismo”.)
Warl0k3@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
I agree - the term has reached a point where at this point it’s become an alt-right dogwhistle. The phenomenon is real, and really extremely common, and a new term should absolutely be introduced so that discussion of the concept isn’t derailed by people constantly going “ugh it’s such an oppressive thing”.
Side note:
(I wouldn’t normally point this out, but it’s beside the point. That you’re making a (literal, not dismissing you) semantic argument and the first sentence has a semantic error was too amusing not to point out.)
ronigami@lemmy.world 21 hours ago
It wasn’t rude at all, it was one of the most neutral ways of “correcting” someone (in quotes because yes the correction was wrong) but it was basically “I think it’s actually X” which is about as non-aggressive as it can get.
The issue I take with it is not at all about group dynamics. Even if it’s one guy saying this to another, if someone is going to call that “mansplaining” I have an issue with it because it’s just explaining. Incorrectly, and maybe very slightly patronizingly (but only because the person being spoken to is a scientist and not because of the way it’s said), but still at its core simply explaining something they think is true. That is the core of scientific discourse and I don’t care what the genders are, giving it a stupid name and using that as an insult is antithetical to the open and curious exchange of information.
Warl0k3@lemmy.world 21 hours ago
You seem to have a preconceived idea of what ‘mansplaining’ is and, in an effort to examine that, could you tell me why you think the term has achieved such widespread cultural use?