Comment on Transitioning in STEM
ace_of_based@sh.itjust.works 11 hours agoIf someone claims that women are held to a higher standard, I think asking “how is it possible that on average, at all levels, they get higher grades and they are the majority of students?” is a fair question.
No, it completely misunderstands ops point, and i am flabbergasted that you should double-down like this. Can you provide for me other meanings for ops point? what “held to a higher standard” might actually mean? Until you can tell me how “but girls grades were higher ipso facto they were not held to higher standards” your spurious refutation of ops point is dismissed.
I have no interest to debate or invalidate one’s experience, maybe this cannot be generalized if there are quite glaring issues with statistical data.
i don’t believe you, because that’s exactly what you are doing. if you’re not interested, stop doing it?
sudneo@lemm.ee 11 hours ago
What do you mean, what can actually mean? It means that women are held to a higher standard, which means that to achieve a given result, they need to perform at a higher level compared to people not held to the same standard (males). There is no standard that women are expected to meet to sign up to - say - computer engineering, exactly like there is no standard for males to sign up to -say- psychology. In both cases though there are social pressures that make sure that the people within the spectrum of “I have vague interest in this” will be pushed one side or another depending on their gender.
In the specific case, the frame of the discussion was the women studying subjects which are male dominated (I am generalising from the specific context of computer engineering). I don’t believe “higher standards” play a role here (in general), because otherwise we could not explain many data points.
What in your opinion means being held to a higher standard in this context? And if that’s the case, how do you explain the fact that women seem to make plenty of independent educational choices in many (most, in fact) other fields, and that they generally have a higher success than men? Is this standard only applied for male dominated fields? Does it mean that males are held to a higher standard in psychology, medicine, literature etc.? Because if that’s the case, then I find this concept of standard really redundant to what I consider social pressure to adhere to gender roles.
Contesting the general validity of one’s experience is not at all talking about that experience, let alone contesting it. So no, I am not doing it and I don’t have any interest in doing that.