Comment on Sir Gareth Southgate: Boys need role models, not gaming and porn

• whotookkarl@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

  If I steal 20 bucks from you then I need to ask for your forgiveness, if my friend Tom forgives me it does nothing to apologize to or provide reparations for victims.

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  • Flax_vert@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

    Because if we were all to be punished for our sin, everyone will be thrown into hell eternally. That’s the punishment for sin.

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    • whotookkarl@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

      That doesn’t justify the substitution, and if that god exists that’s not justice, that’s just an evil god who decided that eternal torture is an appropriate punishment for being born into inescapable sin with no chance of rehabilitation after a short life.

      If the original sin was committed by Adam and Eve to eat the fruit of knowledge of good and bad, which they themselves would not know was bad because they hadn’t yet eaten it, then threatening to punish them and all of their descendents with eternal torture forever is evil. There’s also no reason that the atonement of sin to an all powerful god requires a blood sacrifice or any sacrifice except by his rules, there are multiple sin atonements in the Bible accepting flour, money, incense, prayer, etc.

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      • Flax_vert@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

        You’ve just contradicted yourself. First you say it’s silly that God is willing to pay and accepts payment for our sins from Himself, then you claim God is evil because He punishes sin to begin with. How could a sinful person expect their sin to be tolerated around a perfect God? Yes, such sin damns us to hell, but God forgives it, and Jesus is the mechanism of God’s forgiveness. If God just let people who were sinful in His sight get into heaven, He wouldn’t be perfectly just. You mentioned that we should be able to atone for sin using flour, money, incense and prayer. That’s like a player trying to bribe a Minecraft server admin to not ban him for rule breaking with diamonds. God can create flour, “money” (something that only has value because we perceive it to. What’s God going to do with it, buy His groceries in Tesco?) and incense. As for prayer, He has a multitude of angels praising Him constantly.

        Adam and Eve knew what they were doing. God told them not to. But they did it anyway. If their descendants didn’t sin, their descendants wouldn’t be punished. But their descendants sinned. This “cruelty” is null and void considering God gives us a free way out (compared to your “better” idea where you proposed that you should need to work to get out of Hell)

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