I found the one with Dunning-Kruger! Do I win a prize???
Comment on Dunning-Kruger
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
XY it’s man, XX it’s woman, nothing will ever change that…
There are intersex people, of course: Klinfelter syndrome (XXY) Turner syndrome (X) There is also XXXY which brings serious disabilities
So you as a man puttin on a wig WILL NEVER make you a woman.
“~95% of all animals in the world are ghonocoric in which individuals are either female or male sex” - “Genome evolution and mating systems in plants” Aline Muyle and Gabriel Marais
You are either a man, a woman, or you have a syndrome, a genetical mutation, a birth defect. It’s a delusion to believe that you can change your biological sex during your lifetime.
I will never hold anything against these poor souls, it’s not their fault for how they were born. But people cutting up their genitals and saying they are a woman now while stuffing themselves full of hormones are simply delusional.
I’m so glad that were I live there are virtually 0 “trans”. Only time in my life when I had to say “Please stop talking to me and imagine I don’t exist” was with a dude cosplaying as a woman.
And no, you won’t change speech, you are a man and a he, a woman and a she. That’s it, you can get as angry as you want, nothing will ever change that.
TheBeege@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
MousePotatoDoesStuff@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
TheBeege@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Woo!!! I want the one with the ears!!!
MousePotatoDoesStuff@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Good choice. Here, make sure to hold him tight and treat him right.
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
Arguments mate, or you are just wasting our time.
Let me ask you this:
What is the 3rd gender that one can “transition” to? Does one need to take drugs to impede their biological physiology to work properly if they want to “transition”? If one stops taking hormonal drugs what will happen?
Any individual can have different traits:
- a woman can be agressive, impatient with kids and mean
- a man can be a good cook, can like to clean take care of kids and easy to scare
- a woman can be good at fighting and assertive
- a man can have mood swings
Nothing of what I said makes anyone less of a man or woman, they are EXACTLY what they were born with whatever masculine or feminine traits they have.
iltg@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
“what is the third gender” your deliberate misunderstanding and simplification of the issue is just bad faith debate. you’re proving us that fractions are “syndromes” by using only integers. this is just a display of ignorance and bigotry, it doesn’t really paint you as smart as you’re trying to appear
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
So we agree that there are
XX - woman XY - man
And some genetic mutationa in between XXY - Klinfelter syndrome XXXY - no idea how this is called X -Turner syndrome XX intersex XY intersex And true gonadal intersex
And still these are medical conditions, a man on drugs wearing a wig is still a man, and a woman on drugs to grow facial hair is still a woman.
It’s a he and a she regardless
SirQuack@feddit.nl 2 weeks ago
Arguments mate, or you are just wasting our time.
So far you’ve only voiced your transphobic opinion, that’s not how a good dialog is started.
Arguing with you is a waste of time.
TheBeege@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
You haven’t read anything about this. It’s very clear. The first thing you learn is that sex and gender are different. Sex is biology. Gender is identity.
The second thing you learn is that sex is not binary. (And gender, being a social construct, certainly is not set in stone.) Genes may be XX, but maybe some other factor may be preventing that gene from expressing fully or even at all. This can lead to highly androgynous folks or folks with odd genital configurations. It takes genes, gene expression, and hormones for a human to express characteristics of some sex. Not all three of these are perfectly aligned. You can argue that genes control all of it, but that doesn’t stand. Genes can conflict, and environmental factors can affect things.
I learned all that and more in just twenty minutes of reading. Please, go do some homework. Start with “what is the difference between sex and gender,” then let the rabbit hole take you down. At least, that’s the path that helped me learn a bunch of this stuff.
And regarding Dunning-Kruger, the key point is confidence. That said, I’ll caveat all the above I’ve said with this is just stuff that I’ve read from sources that I trust, which I can corroborate with my existing knowledge of genetics and broader biology. I’m not an expert. I can be proven wrong. Most of this is definitions and quite simple stuff, so my confidence is high but still shakeable.
Normally, I’m a stickler about answering asked questions, but your questions seem to be based on a misunderstanding of definitions. Once you get that sorted out, we can try again and maybe learn something together
Fedizen@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
If you’re going to do a binary, X and Y chromosome doesn’t hold up due to the presence of functional XX males from an SRY gene. Its speculated most Y chromosomes started as X chromosomes in animals that have that dichotomy.
In fact a functional or non functional SRY gene is a better determinant for biological sex.
The fact is though that testerone and SRY receptors have relatively high variability and trying to socially stress people into a group of traits will create a feedback loop that is opposed to more natural courses of evolution. In fact its likely trans people - of whom there are records of going back to time immemorial - are likely an evolutionary adaptation and serve some evolutionary function to society.
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
Since gender is socially constructed (male norms, female norms, male jobs, female jobs) the presence of trans people in society that not only understand both sets of roles but can navigate them is probably an advantage over societies where those roles are less fluid and more strict.
This might sound strange but I don’t believe in an set of norms in that sense. People can do whatever the fuck they like. Male jobs are male jobs because they require more muscle, female jobs might require more emotional IQ but I don’t see why you should be constrained to that
I’m a dude, I like doing laundry, and I like playing with kids, don’t like cars and don’t like football. Does that make me a woman?
giuseppe@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
By definition “time immemorial” means we have no records.
sylveon@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
XY it’s man, XX it’s woman, nothing will ever change that…
I think it’s really funny you left out the exact intersex conditions that disprove your point, Swyer syndrome and de la Chapelle syndrome.
You are either a man, a woman, or you have a syndrome
So someone with de la Chapelle syndrome is neither a man nor a woman but has a syndrome? ‘Man’ and ‘woman’ are social categories and syndrome is not, so this makes no sense. Also I doubt you’d be able to spot the ‘syndrome’ in a group of men.
It’s a delusion to believe that you can change your biological sex during your lifetime.
This is a strawman I see repeated a lot. I’ve never seen trans advocates claim this, only opponents. Even then I would still argue that it is true to some extent. Sex is not just chromosomes (as proven by the two conditions I linked above). It’s made up of many different characteristics and you can change some of them, e.g. with hormone replacement therapy, which changes some secondary sex characteristics. Or even just gynecomastia does it too.
For people who are interested in what the actual science says about this topic I recommend Forrest Valkai’s new Sex and Sensibility video (warning, it’s long).
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
I think it’s really funny you left out the exact intersex conditions that disprove your point, Swyer syndrome and de la Chapelle syndrome.
And again, those are conditions, not something you choose to be, you are simply born like that.
So someone with de la Chapelle syndrome is neither a man nor a woman but has a syndrome?
Well than, waht is someone with Chappel syndrome?
Sex is not just chromosomes (as proven by the two conditions I linked above)
Oh yes, it’s also the malformations that you were born with
with hormone replacement therapy, which changes some secondary sex characteristics. Or even just gynecomastia does it too.
oh so you need drugs to mimic traits from the opposite sex (there are only two after all) and gender is given by your sex.
Forrest Valkai’s new Sex and Sensibility video (warning, it’s long).
I am actually gonna watch this
Language is completely made up and changes all the time. But you’re claiming it will never change again?
Yes, language is not “made up” it evolved and will evolve naturally, demanding language to change to cater to you is not natural.
BrinkBreaker@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
You’re approaching this discussion from a place of certainty, but the reality of biology, language, and human variation is more complex than the rigid model you’re presenting.
A few key points:
- If sex is strictly XX = woman and XY = man, how do you explain the people who don’t fit that?
1 in 50 people has a variation of sex development (VSD). That’s not an anomaly, but a substantial population.
Genetic chimerism, which is rarely tested for, suggests as many as 12% of people have mixed chromosomal expressions—that’s 3 in every 25 people who do not neatly fit XX or XY.
Any woman who has ever had a child is a genetic chimera, because she retains some of her child’s DNA, meaning many women carry male DNA within their bodies.
If sex were as simple as XX/XY, these biological realities wouldn’t exist. But they do, and they complicate the notion that sex is an unchangeable binary.
- If hormones don’t affect biological sex, why do they permanently alter the body?
Puberty is a hormonal process. It reshapes bodies, voices, muscle structure, brain development, and reproductive function.
If sex were truly “fixed,” introducing testosterone or estrogen wouldn’t fundamentally change these same traits in adults. But it does.
So which is it? If hormones don’t influence sex, then puberty doesn’t matter either. If they do, then transitioning alters biological characteristics in ways that contradict your claims.
- If language is purely “natural evolution,” why has it been deliberately changed by societies and governments throughout history?
Modern Italian was not a natural evolution—it was imposed on Italy’s diverse dialects by the state.
After WWI, German was banned in schools and public institutions in parts of the U.S.
The French government has actively tried to suppress regional languages like Breton and Occitan to enforce a singular linguistic identity.
These weren’t “organic” shifts—they were deliberate policy changes. If language only changes on its own, these documented historical events should not have been possible.
If entire nations have altered their linguistic structures through conscious intervention, why would the evolution of gendered language be any different?
- You argue that intersex people are “rare,” but rarity does not erase reality.
Left-handed people make up about 10% of the population—a minority, but we don’t dismiss their existence because they aren’t the majority.
The number of people with red hair is lower than the percentage of intersex people, yet no one claims red hair is “unnatural.”
Statistical frequency doesn’t determine what is real. Something doesn’t need to be common to be biologically significant.
- The pattern in your responses suggests you are more emotionally invested in this topic than you claim.
You’ve repeatedly expressed personal relief that trans people are not common in your area. That’s not a neutral scientific observation—that’s a personal bias.
You dismiss contradictory biological realities by calling them “defects” rather than engaging with what they actually mean.
You insist this discussion is about “logic,” yet when presented with genetic, medical, and linguistic evidence, you shift the argument rather than addressing the inconsistencies.
If you want to engage with this topic honestly, you’ll have to account for these contradictions instead of sidestepping them. If your argument is strong, it should be able to withstand scrutiny. If it can’t, then maybe the issue isn’t with the facts—it’s with the assumptions you started with.
sylveon@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
And again, those are conditions, not something you choose to be, you are simply born like that.
I was pointing out how XX doesn’t always mean female and XY doesn’t always mean male. I didn’t say you could change your chromosomes. I think you might be misunderstanding the OP. When it says ‘some XX people become cis men’ it means that embryos with XX chromosomes develop into cis men, not that they decide to be later in life.
Well than, waht is someone with Chappel syndrome?
Usually a man.
Oh yes, it’s also the malformations that you were born with
How do you differentiate between “normal” and a malformation? These are just arbitrary categories we made up. The reality is that we can observe that some humans just are like that and that’s fine and normal.
oh so you need drugs to mimic traits from the opposite sex (there are only two after all) and gender is given by your sex.
You’re moving the goalposts. You were arguing that you can’t change sex and now you’re retreating to ‘you need drugs to change sex’, which is true for HRT, but not necessarily for gynecomastia.
It’s also not “mimicking” traits. Someone with gynecomastia or someone who takes feminising HRT grows the same kind of breasts as a cis woman.
Yes, language is not “made up” it evolved and will evolve naturally, demanding language to change to cater to you is not natural.
Even if this was true it would just be an appeal to nature. Natural doesn’t mean good and unnatural doesn’t mean bad.
But I don’t think you can differentiate between ‘natural’ and ‘unnatural’ changes to language. Do you think language just evolves on its own without any human interference? Language is by definition something we do.
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
I think you might be misunderstanding the OP.
Yes, I actually was
How do you differentiate between “normal” and a malformation?
If you need special care or attention that is a malformation. If there is a change in your physionomy that impedes you to have a life as normal as other human (you were born without a hand) that’s a malformation.
You were arguing that you can’t change sex and now you’re retreating to ‘you need drugs to change sex’
I was actually arguing that you can’t change your genome, so yeah, sex. But by HRT you still don’t change that, you just try to mimic traits oposite of yours.
Do you think language just evolves on its own without any human interference? Language is by definition something we do.
Of course language can be influenced, but usually when it is, it’s for ease of understanding, and generally making people lives better.
By changing the language just for some people to be triggered because they were “misgendered” you don’t bring any value
Blazingtransfem98@discuss.online 2 weeks ago
You’re a sad transphobic loser. Have fun being banned. I’ll personally find and report the rest of your alts to make sure you’re banned from all of Lemmy forever.
iltg@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
thee are only 2 atoms in the universe: hydrogen (74%) and helium (24%). so you’re either a Hydrogen, a Helium or have a syndrome
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
Oh yes, I very sure we can compare atoms with humans. Maybe inside the sun a man can become a woman and vice-versa
xor@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
They’re pointing out the stupidity of your argument, since it depends on ignoring the fact that the remaining 5% exist, in the same way that classifying everything as those two elements requires ignoring the fact that the other 1% of matter exists
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
iltg@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
are you a preschooler?
yes, are you going to use “basic physics” too??
IZZI@lemm.ee 2 weeks ago
Welp, honest mistake. For some reason I thought hydrogen and helium can only create other atoms, not become eachother.
Still, my point stands, humans are no atoms