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Comments

• plu@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

  Let me preface this that I am not pro-CCP, but I am anti-imperialist and obviously anti-this thinly veiled regime change strategy of the US.

  The most convincing argument towards the Uyghur/Xinjiang situation is that there simply has never been any evidence that is not directly connected to the CIA, some organized neo-nazi or fanatical anticommunist cult, or either of their front organizations. Really. Zero.

  https://thegrayzone.com/2019/12/21/china-detaining-millions-uyghurs-problems-claims-us-ngo-researcher/

  And you can play that game yourself: go ahead and find any claim to evidence about it and look into the sources, you will always find some link to Radio Free Asia (former Radio Freedom from Bolshevism), the Falun Gong (Chinese Scientology-ish cult who teach race science), islamists, or the CIA's Freedom Fund or various front organizations.

  This isn't even disregarding all non-communist evidence as reactionary (something commonly said about us), but this is only counting actual fascists and fanatical anticommunists like Zenz, and the CIA which has a looong history with faking this shit. Remember Iraq/Iran?

  The more important point in this entire debate is that clearly there is a level of alienation between the Chinese people and its official government. The PRC is not a socialist country, but instead a capitalist country led by a clique of those who idealistically believe they can control their local capitalists and harness their advancements of the productive forces, as if the state was superior to the ownership models of production. The current leadership is the ideological descent of those who ousted actual communists from the PRC during the anti-Mao coup and have been oppressing them and democraticazion efforts (in a socialist sense) for decades. Many Tiananmen Square protesters were socialists.

  Either way, this does not mean one should report anything the imperialist West spouts about China uncritically. This is a classic inter-imperialist conflict like in Leninist literature, and the global working class should fight for neither side but its own. In times of dawning war, that side is taking a stance against disinformation and warmongering like the campaign against China.

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  • TheAnonymouseJoker@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

    This is a load of disinformation and grift.

    The more important point in this entire debate is that clearly there is a level of alienation between the Chinese people and its official government. The PRC is not a socialist country, but instead a capitalist country led by a clique of those who idealistically believe they can control their local capitalists and harness their advancements of the productive forces, as if the state was superior to the ownership models of production.

    And USA is communist? What else, Ukraine does not have neo Nazis in its army? CPC is pretty much a socialist government and China is a market based socialist economy. State capitalism lies are a point used by pro-imperialist neoliberals and even traditional Western right wingers. CPC aka state holds their corporations considerably accountable unlike Big Tech that highly controls citizens and governments in West.

    The current leadership is the ideological descent of those who ousted actual communists from the PRC during the anti-Mao coup and have been oppressing them and democraticazion efforts (in a socialist sense) for decades. Many Tiananmen Square protesters were socialists.

    This comment is clearly written by a person who has not read one sentence about Mao or Deng's works, or Xi's modifications to Dengism.

    How is KMT socialist? IIRC they were a dictatorship that suppressed Chinese natives. Chiang Kai-Shek was a Japanese sent over. CPC is socialist, and you are blatantly lying.

    Here are lots of bits and pieces from Nathan Rich, who does the Epic China series. He is by far the most credible historian on China (that communicates in English) outside of those dingy libraries. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XID9cVqNEtQ

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    • plu@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

      Go ahead and throw Marxist theory out of the window arguing on the internet but in the mean time actual real-life organized socialists will keep the class struggle on the forefront of their priorities.

      How any self-proclaimed Marxists can take seriously the socdem idea that the state has the capability to control and punish their domestic capitalists if it's just smart enough, and call that communist, is beyond me. The superstructure is a result of the productive relations, not the other way 'round. People who actually read and understand Marxist theory and have read more than the glorified quote book will know that like the back of their hand.

      While you keep keyboard warrioring for the CCP online, real life Maoists and anti-revisionists are being imprisoned and oppressed by the bureaucratic traitors of Dengist descent.

      I don't want to flaunt around any credentials as this is the internet and anyone can lie, but let me tell you that actual, real-life internationally organized communists find CCP apologism more than ridiculous. This Dengism defense is an internet phenomenon of Western middle class people radicalized via memes, not any ideology taken seriously by the working class.

      And who ever mentioned the KMT?

      And you recommending a random YouTube channel called Epic China as a credible source on Chinese politics speaks for itself, I think.

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• muad_dibber@lemmygrad.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

  Lots of stuff here:

  https://dessalines.github.io/essays/socialism_faq.html#whats-going-on-with-the-uyghurs

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• dwzero@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

  You could simply get it from the horse's mouth, china released a white paper on the situation there a while ago. http://english.www.gov.cn/archive/white_paper/2019/03/18/content_281476567813306.htm

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  • danoss@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

    [deleted]

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    • dwzero@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

      Certainly. Just don't forget that any trial which omits the testimony of the suspect is a trial with a foregone conclusion.

      Happy reading.

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    • TheAnonymouseJoker@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

      As of now, I believe that there is discrimination happening against separatist human rights activists by the American authorities and are detaining them to preserve the stability of the Capitol Hill region. But the rest of the world and the anti-Western hemisphere took this opportunity for a desperate attempt to undermine the United States government, and their media outlets have over-exaggerated the numbers of rioters by trusting non credible sources.

      How does it sound like to you? Truthful? This will answer your question.

      "Inb4 US media is credible" please check about Atlantic Council used for global censorship, USAGM, Bilderberg, CFR media and Murdoch media. Or how Snowden literally has to live in USA's arch enemy country for life, or how Assange lost in "democracy" courts and after rotting and being drugged in UK jail for few years, he is now ready to be extradited to USA for the butchering process.

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    • DPUGT2@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

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• chiefstorm@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨years⁩ ago

  If china is being honest about their portrayal of things like Xinjiang then why aren’t they more transparent when responding to accusations and/or questions?

  I do believe in innocent before proven guilty, but I am also not naïve to keep giving the same benefit of the doubt.

  If you read between the lines, it is obvious what is going on, there is slave labor camps, and a gross violation of human rights.

  There is a feudalistic system that governs China right now, and at the top are groups of mafia like political families that have no respect for honor, dignity, truth, or human rights.

  I will edit this post more more sources.

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