Surely we could have cut out Much Ado About Nothing and The Tempest
The only subject that was required for all four years when I was in high school was English, and senior year English was all British literature, so we got Chaucer, Shakespeare, the Bronte’s, shit like that.
Honestly I think later high school English classes do more to beat any love of reading teenagers have out of them by force feeding them dire dour old ugly hateful and just plain obsolete shit written by damaged people who lived in a world before the invention of epidemiology so sometimes your neighborhood would die of cholera because someone’s pit toilet leaked into the ground water.
Make English 4 if not English 3 electives rather than required. Replace them with a semester of driver’s ed, taxes, fire safety, how to safely refrigerate chicken, I can think of a lot of shit that would benefit the world more than having teenagers read a Skakespeare play they don’t get aloud.
When Americans already can’t read, you’re seriously suggesting doing away with requiring English for all 4 years? I understand wanting to change the material, but that just seems really heavy-handed and counterproductive.
If it’s that bad the problem is earlier than 12th grade and needs to be fixed there. I started flight school in 9th grade, I had no problem reading textbooks that said things like “Aerodynamics of maneuvering flight” in them.
Make English 4 if not English 3 electives rather than required. Replace them with a semester of […] how to safely refrigerate chicken
Imo, this is something that can be taught in a basic foods/cooking class, or a home economics class (which has at least been taught in the past ^[1]^ — I haven’t found any current data).
References
1. “Why is home economics not taught in schools anymore?”. Author: Cortney Moore. FOX Business Network. Published: 2020-06-16T17:44Z16:44Z. Accessed: 2024-12-11T05:17Z. foxbusiness.com/…/home-economics-not-taught-schoo….
- ¶2.
> […] in 2013, the number of students enrolled in a home economics class was a little over 3.4 million, which were taught by more than 27,800 teachers […]
Make English 4 if not English 3 electives rather than required. Replace them with a semester of […] fire safety
I disagree that this should be in some form of course. I think that this can be taught in a short afternoon visit by a fire department — it may even be already.
I am convinced beyond internet argument that you wouldn’t be better off eliminating a semester of English Literature class from the end of high school and replace it with a semester of “living in the world” lessons that might just be a week of driver’s ed, that field trip to the fire department, some first aid, just cram a semester full of basic adulting skills.
We used to call this “Home Economics” but that got stigmatized as the cake baking class girls took while the boys were in shop class, and then women doing housework became a politically charged issue so we deprecated even that.
But give it four years and we won’t have a public education system in this country at all anyway, so all this does is vindicate my decision to not have children.
replace it with a semester of “living in the world” lessons that might just be a week of driver’s ed, that field trip to the fire department, some first aid, just cram a semester full of basic adulting skills.
We used to call this “Home Economics” but that got stigmatized as the cake baking class girls took while the boys were in shop class, and then women doing housework became a politically charged issue so we deprecated even that.
Okay, but that isn’t what you said prior — that’s shifting the goalpoasts. You specifically said
Replace them with a semester of […] fire safety […]
[…] I propose that teaching Shakespeare instead of more in depth driver’s ed isn’t entirely ethical. […]
I think you misunderstood me. To be completely fair, I was rather vague. I wasn’t arguing that one was more ethical than the other. My argument about ethics was from the perspective of further subsidizing something that already receives enormous subsidies — ie driving and cars (this is conjecture at the moment, but I can go into more detail if you’d like).
How many hours of the average American’s life will be spent behind the wheel of a car? […]
Would it be a goal of yours to reduce the amount of time that one spends driving in their life? If so, do you think that teaching drivers ed in school will achieve that end?
Make English 4 if not English 3 electives rather than required.
For clarity, are you saying that you don’t think that it should be mandatory that English, or any of its derivatives, be taught as a course to children?
Much of the language Shakespeare uses is obsolete to a modern English speaker. Let’s start with his use of the archaic second person singular thee thy thou and move on from there to words we don’t use anymore like “contumely” or “orisons” and then arrive at metaphors that haven’t made sense since the industrial revolution. Shakespeare wrote in English v. 2.3.1, here in the 21st century we speak English v. 6.13.2.
More what I’m getting at, regardless of language used in Shakespeare is whether you think Shakespeare, as a whole, is obsolete. So, iiuc, you aren’t saying that you think that Shakespeare, as a whole, is obsolete, but that that the language used within it is, which makes it difficult to read?
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 3 weeks ago
The only subject that was required for all four years when I was in high school was English, and senior year English was all British literature, so we got Chaucer, Shakespeare, the Bronte’s, shit like that.
Honestly I think later high school English classes do more to beat any love of reading teenagers have out of them by force feeding them dire dour old ugly hateful and just plain obsolete shit written by damaged people who lived in a world before the invention of epidemiology so sometimes your neighborhood would die of cholera because someone’s pit toilet leaked into the ground water.
Make English 4 if not English 3 electives rather than required. Replace them with a semester of driver’s ed, taxes, fire safety, how to safely refrigerate chicken, I can think of a lot of shit that would benefit the world more than having teenagers read a Skakespeare play they don’t get aloud.
GiveMemes@jlai.lu 3 weeks ago
When Americans already can’t read, you’re seriously suggesting doing away with requiring English for all 4 years? I understand wanting to change the material, but that just seems really heavy-handed and counterproductive.
Microplasticbrain@lemm.ee 3 weeks ago
If they can’t read by junior year of highschool I very much adoubt fucking Shakespeare is going to be the aha moment
GiveMemes@jlai.lu 3 weeks ago
Again, material choice is not the issue at hand.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
If it’s that bad the problem is earlier than 12th grade and needs to be fixed there. I started flight school in 9th grade, I had no problem reading textbooks that said things like “Aerodynamics of maneuvering flight” in them.
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Imo, this is something that can be taught in a basic foods/cooking class, or a home economics class (which has at least been taught in the past ^[1]^ — I haven’t found any current data).
References
1. “Why is home economics not taught in schools anymore?”. Author: Cortney Moore. FOX Business Network. Published: 2020-06-16T17:44Z16:44Z. Accessed: 2024-12-11T05:17Z. foxbusiness.com/…/home-economics-not-taught-schoo…. - ¶2. > […] in 2013, the number of students enrolled in a home economics class was a little over 3.4 million, which were taught by more than 27,800 teachers […]
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I disagree that this should be in some form of course. I think that this can be taught in a short afternoon visit by a fire department — it may even be already.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I am convinced beyond internet argument that you wouldn’t be better off eliminating a semester of English Literature class from the end of high school and replace it with a semester of “living in the world” lessons that might just be a week of driver’s ed, that field trip to the fire department, some first aid, just cram a semester full of basic adulting skills.
We used to call this “Home Economics” but that got stigmatized as the cake baking class girls took while the boys were in shop class, and then women doing housework became a politically charged issue so we deprecated even that.
But give it four years and we won’t have a public education system in this country at all anyway, so all this does is vindicate my decision to not have children.
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Okay, but that isn’t what you said prior — that’s shifting the goalpoasts. You specifically said
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I disagree.
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
How many hours of the average American’s life will be spent behind the wheel of a car?
How many hours of the average American’s life will be spent examining 400 year old stage plays?
If they get something wrong behind the wheel of a car, what’s the worst that can happen?
If they get something wrong examining a 400 year old stage play, what’s the worst that can happen?
I propose that teaching Shakespeare instead of more in depth driver’s ed isn’t entirely ethical.
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I think you misunderstood me. To be completely fair, I was rather vague. I wasn’t arguing that one was more ethical than the other. My argument about ethics was from the perspective of further subsidizing something that already receives enormous subsidies — ie driving and cars (this is conjecture at the moment, but I can go into more detail if you’d like).
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Out of curiosity, do you live in an area that doesn’t require a driver’s license in order to be legally allowed to drive on a public road?
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Would it be a goal of yours to reduce the amount of time that one spends driving in their life? If so, do you think that teaching drivers ed in school will achieve that end?
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
For clarity, are you saying that you don’t think that it should be mandatory that English, or any of its derivatives, be taught as a course to children?
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
I’m questioning the importance of literature class as I remember it taught in late high school.
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
So, other than literature, are there some English-derived classes that you think would be good to teach?
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
How are you defining “obsolete”?
captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Much of the language Shakespeare uses is obsolete to a modern English speaker. Let’s start with his use of the archaic second person singular thee thy thou and move on from there to words we don’t use anymore like “contumely” or “orisons” and then arrive at metaphors that haven’t made sense since the industrial revolution. Shakespeare wrote in English v. 2.3.1, here in the 21st century we speak English v. 6.13.2.
Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
More what I’m getting at, regardless of language used in Shakespeare is whether you think Shakespeare, as a whole, is obsolete. So, iiuc, you aren’t saying that you think that Shakespeare, as a whole, is obsolete, but that that the language used within it is, which makes it difficult to read?