Not sure what you’re referring to exactly. VW is saying they can’t comply with the new law because China is not transparent enough. Sounds like that’s the truth.
Would you expect them to simply stop doing business in China as a result of this lack of transparency?
Yes, that’s exactly what I expect. If you can’t verify with 100% certainty that your supply chain isn’t using slave labor, then you stop using that supply chain. And if that costs the company an entire market, or even causes the company to fail, then so be it.
I was thinking about this comment, far too often the argument is "what could they do if they aren’t getting the help from the Chinese government " etc, and it’s all shit. If we were buying something from a little boutique one person seller and we found out that somewhere in the process of making it they used slave labour we would all rightfully kick off. So why do massive companies, who could do much much more, get a free pass yet we hold individuals up to a much higher standard.
Yeah I think I agree. The law should be: if you can’t positively confirm it’s clean, you can’t use it.
We should have standards for the treatment of people, and strive not to participate in or reward those who treat people in unacceptable ways.
If we have to take on some difficulty for that, so be it. Maybe if our difficulty gets to the point where I’m hungry, I’ll choose differently. But until then I’m willing to take a break from this or that car brand until they can figure out ethical sourcing.
I do think, to whatever extent possible, the change should be implemented smoothly. Maybe a rapidly-growing tariff on such goods for a few years, followed by a ban on their import, instead of an immediate ban on the import.
It’s not good for a country to create an unfair marketplace. And it is an unfair marketplace when rules which acutely affect only certain people drastically for the good of all, are implemented too quickly to adapt to without major setbacks.
Just saying it should be phased in, to minimize local economic tearing.
Agreed. In essence, the cost of doing business is ensuring your supply chain is lawful and morally sound. This lack of respect for humanity as a practice runs rampant because capitalism calls for nothing less than infinite growth and ever increasing profit. Imo, if you can’t afford to do business humanely, you shouldn’t be allowed to be in business.
Yeah I think I agree. The law should be: if you can’t positively confirm it’s clean, you can’t use it.
We should have standards for the treatment of people, and strive not to participate in or reward those who treat people in unacceptable ways.
Totally agree.
It’s not good for a country to create an unfair marketplace. And it is an unfair marketplace when rules which acutely affect only certain people drastically for the good of all, are implemented too quickly to adapt to without major setbacks.
Just saying it should be phased in, to minimize local economic tearing.
Totally disagree.
Fines/tariffs/etc. are just cost of doing business for big business. Slowly enforcing regulation gives companies time to hedge, shuffle, and deflect without actually doing anything. Consequences should be hard and fast. Economies be damned. If an economy can’t stand on its own without companies acting ethically, or with them being punished for it, then it shouldn’t stand at all.
VW can demand transparency (e.g. access to supply chain facilities by 3rd party auditors) as a prerequisite to doing business with a partner company. It is absolutely standard to demand that business partners have had 3rd party audits to prove they comply with laws and regulations. This is not some insane ask, this is everyday stuff in the business world.
If a company can’t or won’t get an auditor to validate that they comply with PCI-DSS, for instance, they’re not going to be signed on for processing payment card information by other companies. And slave labor is a tad bit worse than retaining too many data fields in a credit card for too many days.
intensely_human@lemm.ee 5 weeks ago
Not sure what you’re referring to exactly. VW is saying they can’t comply with the new law because China is not transparent enough. Sounds like that’s the truth.
Would you expect them to simply stop doing business in China as a result of this lack of transparency?
davehtaylor@beehaw.org 5 weeks ago
Yes, that’s exactly what I expect. If you can’t verify with 100% certainty that your supply chain isn’t using slave labor, then you stop using that supply chain. And if that costs the company an entire market, or even causes the company to fail, then so be it.
Badger@lemmy.sdf.org 5 weeks ago
I was thinking about this comment, far too often the argument is "what could they do if they aren’t getting the help from the Chinese government " etc, and it’s all shit. If we were buying something from a little boutique one person seller and we found out that somewhere in the process of making it they used slave labour we would all rightfully kick off. So why do massive companies, who could do much much more, get a free pass yet we hold individuals up to a much higher standard.
HeartyBeast@kbin.social 5 weeks ago
I wonder how many manufacturers can currently manage that.
t3rmit3@beehaw.org 5 weeks ago
They all could manage that, as they are already managing similar attestation requirements from suppliers e.g. ISO 9000-family controls.
0x815@feddit.de 5 weeks ago
They have been already managing that for a long time. Independent audits are common - except in a few countries.
intensely_human@lemm.ee 5 weeks ago
Yeah I think I agree. The law should be: if you can’t positively confirm it’s clean, you can’t use it.
We should have standards for the treatment of people, and strive not to participate in or reward those who treat people in unacceptable ways.
If we have to take on some difficulty for that, so be it. Maybe if our difficulty gets to the point where I’m hungry, I’ll choose differently. But until then I’m willing to take a break from this or that car brand until they can figure out ethical sourcing.
I do think, to whatever extent possible, the change should be implemented smoothly. Maybe a rapidly-growing tariff on such goods for a few years, followed by a ban on their import, instead of an immediate ban on the import.
It’s not good for a country to create an unfair marketplace. And it is an unfair marketplace when rules which acutely affect only certain people drastically for the good of all, are implemented too quickly to adapt to without major setbacks.
Just saying it should be phased in, to minimize local economic tearing.
ninjaphysics@beehaw.org 5 weeks ago
Agreed. In essence, the cost of doing business is ensuring your supply chain is lawful and morally sound. This lack of respect for humanity as a practice runs rampant because capitalism calls for nothing less than infinite growth and ever increasing profit. Imo, if you can’t afford to do business humanely, you shouldn’t be allowed to be in business.
davehtaylor@beehaw.org 5 weeks ago
Totally agree.
Totally disagree.
Fines/tariffs/etc. are just cost of doing business for big business. Slowly enforcing regulation gives companies time to hedge, shuffle, and deflect without actually doing anything. Consequences should be hard and fast. Economies be damned. If an economy can’t stand on its own without companies acting ethically, or with them being punished for it, then it shouldn’t stand at all.
t3rmit3@beehaw.org 5 weeks ago
VW can demand transparency (e.g. access to supply chain facilities by 3rd party auditors) as a prerequisite to doing business with a partner company. It is absolutely standard to demand that business partners have had 3rd party audits to prove they comply with laws and regulations. This is not some insane ask, this is everyday stuff in the business world.
If a company can’t or won’t get an auditor to validate that they comply with PCI-DSS, for instance, they’re not going to be signed on for processing payment card information by other companies. And slave labor is a tad bit worse than retaining too many data fields in a credit card for too many days.
suzune@ani.social 5 weeks ago
It’s so easy to work around an audit. Companies lie. Auditors are being bribed. Everything is based on trust.
t3rmit3@beehaw.org 5 weeks ago
True, but it is far better than just saying, “well we called but no one picked up welpguesstheresnothingwecando!”