Comment on Do you think that Trump is the most hated U.S. president?
Nonconfrontational@lemmy.ml 5 hours agoK he’s worse than your many many serial killers, that was literally the only argument you “destroyed”. Let’s back up for a moment though, cowboy.
Let’s forget all that other shit, because, and I think you’ll agree, murder is by far the worst thing you can do.
Your Afghanistan number is okay, but that does put us in the range of 1.5 million. That’s millions buddy, anything over one million is millions.
Do you think Donald trump has killed 1.5 million people with his policies yet?
And let’s not forget the other 2 points you seem to have glossed over YET AGAIN, the fact that many presidents partook in the genocide of tens of millions of Native Americans.
*And presided over chattel slavery for centuries.
P00ptart@lemmy.world 1 hour ago
Let’s say it is 1.5 million combined for both wars. I don’t think we’ll ever truly know. But the amount from COVID alone in America is ~ 1.2 million. Obviously there would have been some amount of deaths here regardless, and not all of them were directly tied to his policies or propaganda. However, we had a very disproportionate amount of deaths for our population size, modern medicine, early information to mitigate risks and early availability of vaccinations. I would say 75% of the deaths were avoidable. For the sake of your skepticism to just HOW bad he is, let’s go with 50% were directly because of him. Which is obviously low. Thats 600,000 deaths directly because of him. Now we’re close to half of your 1.5 million already. There’s no direct numbers in additional deaths because of the embargo on Cuba, but they obviously exist. 3.5-6k deaths in Iran (including 140 children at school) and growing. Unless you add the 12k from him instigating the protests in Iran, and promising weapons that were never sent. About 100 in Venezuela during the illegal raid to capture Maduro. At least 221 in illegal attacks on "drug boats in the Caribbean and eastern Pacific. At least 52 died in ICE custody already, not including people shot in the streets. At the bare minimum those extra deaths are around 4,000. So we’re sitting at a conservative 604,000.
So now let’s get into the more abstract numbers. Trump gutted the USDA, FDA, CDC and USAID. The gutting of USAID alone has already caused an estimated 600,000 deaths with many, many more to come the longer it isn’t replaced. Over the last 20 years some 92 million lives were saved because of it. And it’s estimated that 14-23 million will die by 2030 without it. Again, I’ll go with the lower number, since you’re so skeptical. So our running total is 14.6 million.
newyorker.com/…/the-shutdown-of-usaid-has-already…
ph.ucla.edu/…/research-finds-more-14-million-prev…
Kicking people off of medicaid will result in ~51,000 preventable deaths per year.
ldi.upenn.edu/…/trump-senate-bill-seen-causing-51…
The cuts to the FDA, CDC, USDA will kill a lot more people but I haven’t seen a study estimating how many.
The cuts to NOAA, NASA, the National weather service and other climate organizations are also harder to quantify but believe that it will be in the millions due to simply not being prepared for the climate chaos and abrupt storms, let alone having the information that leads to climate action. Not to mention trading wind farms for coal and gas. The guardian and pro-publica estimate that cuts to these programs will kill ~1.3 million by 2035.
theguardian.com/…/trump-emissions-policy-could-ca…
So now we’re at 15.9 million excess deaths because of Trump. Hitler killed between 6-9 million.
No, murder is not the worst crime. The suffering and torture before the death is worse than murder.
And let’s not forget the wavering, half assed support for Ukraine, and the explicit support of Israel as they genocide Palestinians and Lebanese.
And I didn’t gloss over early American presidents. Like I said, yeah a lot of it was disgusting historical atrocities. I’m not arguing that, it’s true. But not all of it was intentional. For instance, Grant was against the slaughter of native Americans, and instead wished to forcefully relocate them. Again, not defending that but at the time that was extremely progressive. Grant did a lot of work to try and help the native Americans. Obviously that had limited effect, and stories are that he was so mad he came to tears after learning of what happened on the trail of tears. Also at the time the president actually had limited powers unlike today. The federal government wasn’t strong enough to do much about things happening on the frontier, especially unruly western expansionist “colonizers”. So while it didn’t work out, and in hindsight was absolutely horrible to modern standards, the consensus was that his actions were well-intentioned. Unlike Donald Trump, who’s intentions can only be categorized as simply evil.
The same is true of slavery in a lot of cases. The original hope was to outlaw slavery at the start of the country but it was thought, probably correctly, that we couldn’t beat the British without the southern states. So it wasn’t something they wanted, but something they had to accept for the time being that they would get to that after the war. The words of the declaration of Independence and that all men are created equal and are entitled to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness was a direct nod to slavery. It was put there in documentation at the start so it could be referred to later to abolish slavery. Then it became about not wanting to go into a looking civil war for many decades until the south took it upon themselves to decide to start the civil war because they perceived Lincoln as the one who would end slavery despite multiple times saying that he was against slavery but had no intention on ending it, to keep the country together. It’s awful, but it wasn’t exactly “yo, that slavery sure is dope!” It’s more nuanced than you’re acting. Not super nuanced, mind you, it’s still obviously bad, but nuanced nonetheless, again, unlike trump who isn’t nuanced at all, and is objectively evil. And before anybody mentions dementia as an excuse, trump kept a collection of hitlers speeches in his bedside cabinet while with his first wife ivana.
independent.co.uk/…/donald-trump-adolf-hitler-boo…
It’s the intentions that make him more evil than presidents of the past. Which I’ve said already. Is that enough to stop you from claiming I’m glossing over your points?
While at the same time you glossed over almost all of what I said in my first response. What about Jan 6? He led a revolt among his supporters to overthrow the outcome of the election, and 5 people died because of it. That’s unprecedented psychopathy, all so he wouldn’t lose power, and face consequences for his actions. He’s grifted billions from his supporters, even blatantly stealing their money in a bag handling scheme. This is also wildly unprecedented.
He’s sold national secrets to foreign governments and colluded with others in wildly corrupt deals that hurt the country and benefitted him and his family. President carter had to sell his peanut farm to become president so as not to even look to be profiting off of his position while trump blatantly disregarded any optics of corruption and used his real estate holdings and position to force his entourage to spend exorbitant amounts of money to house them in his hotels. He’s supported the genocide in gaza with the intention of building a real estate empire in the burning embers of an ancient society for his personal gain. Again, intentions here make him more evil than those of the past.
He’s been driving wedges in American society for far longer than he’s been in politics, pushing a second civil war closer and closer to reality. He’s eliminated gun laws that prevent deaths, allowing people with mental illness to own guns.
He’s also deregulated things like air and water quality laws, which will directly lead to cancer deaths. He’s deregulated nasty forever chemicals being used on produce. He’s expanded ICE funding and allowed his guard dogs unregulated permission to harass, attack and murder people based on color. He’s been attempting to manipulate elections in any way he can to ensure he never leaves power and never has to account for his crimes. No president has ever had this much evil attached to their name. So yes, Donald Trump is the worst, and most evil American in our entire history.
I apologize for my writing style and acknowledge that it isn’t the best. I struggle with punctuation and paragraphs, I have ADHD so my mind works… Funny. I also must admit that cataloging this much evil is exhausting. But I feel like I’m missing something… Oh yeah, he fucking raped children for years and years and talked with glee about it with his best friend. Absolutely the most evil fucking American ever.
Nonconfrontational@lemmy.ml 57 minutes ago
Yikes, bro. I believe you believe he’s the worst American to ever exist. To an outsider, not much has changed, this is American business a usual. Death, carnage, destruction, etc. Illegal wars and dead civilians. I’m not reading your wall of shit. Take the win and then take some meds, lol.