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Comment on The horrible morals of a show supposed to teach them

ricecooker@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

The writeup on Section 31 is very good and was following along until you listed almost every couple on DS9 being in toxic relationships. Maybe you’re confusing relationship conflicts with toxicity? Maybe I don’t know what toxic means.

I’m pretty good at seeing different sides of an arguement, but you’ll have to do a lot more convincing on Kira/Odo, Jadzia/Sorf, Sisko/Jennifer/Kassidy being in toxic relationships. These relationships work for me because they are trying to overcome cultural and professional challenges. One character might not budge on something but overall they try to work things out.

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atlasraven31@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Worf in particular can be stubborn and traditional. Jadzia is anything but. It is a source of conflict in their relationship.

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Solumbran@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Sure, I’ll explain what I meant.

With Odo and Kira, Odo spent years wanting to be with Kira and making her uncomfortable; when she finally accepts, he hurries up, cheats on her and then abandon her forever. Not very nice.

Dax basically manipulated worf into being with her by waiting for him to be psychologically weak before having sex with him despite his complete lack of interest. Klingon rules then make him “forced” to stay with her, and most if not all of their relationship shows Dax not respecting Worf and constantly forcing things on him, cheating on him with a random naked dude before their wedding, forcing him to go to Risa against his will and then being mad at him for not enjoying it, etc.

And then Ezri convinces him they can be together, and breaks up because “I saw bashir in a dream so goodbye”.

Finally for Sisko and Kassidy were actually a good, relatively well written couple with challenges… Until Sisko hears the prophets tell him to not marry her, he does it anyway, gets her pregnant because he doesn’t get his shot, and when the prophets tell him to go with them, instead of telling them to fuck off he stays with them and gives up on his pregnant wife. And on top of that, he implies that he could talk to her but probably won’t, or in a few decades or whatever.

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- superb@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  It’s been a bit since I saw that last season of DS9, but Ezri and Worf were never in an actual relationship so there was nothing to “break up”. They had a few moments, but that Ezri was clearly confused and overwhelmed by their past
  
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  - Solumbran@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Ezri was a weird thing, most of the toxicity was with Jadzia. But Ezri still chased Worf even though he was avoiding her, started things again then stopped everything for one of the most ridiculous reasons I’ve ever heard. On its own it might not be toxic, but since it sort of still is Dax, it adds on top of Jadzia’s crap.
    
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    jmp242@sopuli.xyz ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    
    since it sort of still is Dax, it adds on top of Jadzia’s crap.
    
    Is it though? Isn’t that one of the things they deal with a lot with Trill - are different hosts actually “the same person”? I’d argue it’s “partially at best” and is one of the interesting things about the concept of personhood over time sci-fi deals with. In a lot of ways, Ezri is at best like a 30 year time difference in the real world, but maybe even more like a sister/cousin at the more extreme side of being different.
    
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