To me, this is more culture war bullshit that right-wingers love to distract us with.
Lowering the voting age is culture war bullshit?
Guess we’re making the term culture war meaningless now
Comment on Independent MP to push for lowering of Australian voting age
MisterFrog@aussie.zone 1 day ago
Daily reminder for what this independent stands for. She is a big L Liberal who just happens to believe in climate change and that queer people exist.
theyvoteforyou.org.au/people/…/monique_ryan
To me, this is more culture war bullshit that right-wingers love to distract us with.
The voting age is perfectly fine where it is and is in line with practically all other age restrictions.
Eyekaytee@aussie.zone 22 hours ago
MisterFrog@aussie.zone 15 hours ago
Yeah. I’m gonna do something rare on the internet: you’re right to call me out on this.
I let my dislike for a class enemy get the better of me in the way I expressed myself. Instead of commenting on the topic of voter age.
She’s still a wanker for being against wage theft criminalisation. I’ll stand by that.
princessnorah@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 day ago
I don’t think suggesting younger teenagers be allowed to vote is “culture war bullshit”. It certainly wouldn’t do her any favours considering that young people tend to overwhelmingly vote for left parties.
MisterFrog@aussie.zone 1 day ago
This is fair, my language is perhaps a little strong. Still a distraction in my opinion.
Teenagers are in school, and many are very knowledgeable and engaged.
But I don’t really think there is much need to change the voting age
Ilandar@lemmy.today 23 hours ago
What is actually wrong with the proposal, though? Or are you simply objecting because the idea came from “the other side”, even though The Greens have been pushing this since 2018?
MisterFrog@aussie.zone 15 hours ago
I’m not necessarily opposed, but beyond “they deserve a say in their future” I’m not really sure what the argument for it is.
There’s a lot of learning that goes on between the ages of 16 and 18. Like the level of stuff you’re learning accelerates quite a lot.
While education isn’t a pre-requisite for voting, we gotta set a line somewhere. 18 is the line we’ve set for a bunch of other things.
I would need more convincing that this line should be changed.
pineapple@lemmy.ml 1 day ago
If teenagers are well educated and know how to make a good decision that supports there views then I don’t see why they shouldn’t be able to vote.
Younger people voting for there future is better.
MisterFrog@aussie.zone 15 hours ago
Education isn’t a pre-requisite for voting, but unless we’re planning on fundamentally changing how we treat 16 to 18 year olds (which I’m in favour of, by the way), I don’t see why 16 should be the new arbitrary age we choose.
Why not 14?
18 is the arbitrary age we’ve already chosen to confer adulthood.
And when I was 16, I felt much the same way. I had my opinions, and I wouldn’t have been against being given the vote. But we also don’t let 16 year olds drive. Should we let them do that too?
Honestly, I dunno.
16 year olds aren’t stupid, but we just gotta pick some arbitrary line where we think the average person has had enough life experience to be entrusted with voting.
And honestly, it’s probably a good thing for people to have the chance of being more numerate and literate via schooling in year 11 and 12, or in a trade or TAFE before they start voting.
Learning accelerates (at least, in my experience) a lot in those last years of secondary schooling.
I’m not necessarily against changing it. I just very dislike Monique Ryan because she hates working people (fact, not opinion, since she’s voted against criminalising wage theft), and think this is somewhat a distraction from the economic woes which this kind of ideology produces.
princessnorah@lemmy.blahaj.zone 19 hours ago
Yeah, you probably wouldn’t see much need for it if you aren’t sixteen. Meanwhile, if you were, you’d probably be sitting there wondering why the rest of us keep fluffing up the climate that you’d have to live with.
MisterFrog@aussie.zone 15 hours ago
When I was 16 I also didn’t see much of a need for it (this topic is raised every couple of years). Even though I was much more engaged with politics than the average person at that age, at the time.
I’m not saying 16 year olds are unqualified to vote, but we gotta draw the line somewhere.
Adulthood isn’t totally arbitrary because of how we’ve structured our society (though, the age at which this is, depends on when people are leaving school/are legally defined as independent).
The reason I think this is a distraction is because this has been suggested time and time again, and it’s not likely to get off the ground and it wouldn’t make huge swings in voter numbers.
I dunno. As in my edited comment, I just think Monique Ryan is a wanker, who I happen to agree with on wanting to do something urgently about the climate.
Zagorath@aussie.zone 21 hours ago
I just don’t see why any of this is relevant here. Someone can be wrong in one area and right in another. They can even be wrong in most areas and right in this one area. You are the one bringing “culture war bullshit” to “distract us” from the conversation at hand here. Discuss the question on its merits, or don’t discuss it at all, IMO. Don’t distract by attacking the person who happens to be the messenger in this specific case.
MisterFrog@aussie.zone 15 hours ago
This is fair. And I’m sorry for how I responded because of my strong dislike for her.
I should have just left the reminder that she’s anti-worker as an off-topic aside.
The rest of it, as you rightly point out, is not my best work.
Zagorath@aussie.zone 15 hours ago
Yeah for sure. If it had been presented as an aside, like “btw don’t let her support of this good idea distract from all the other bad stuff she’s done”, I think there would have been significantly less pushback.