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Considering that Putin is the biggest fascist threat for all of Europe, your statement is laughable. The Left agree that Putin is doing bad things in Ukraine and other countries but their message is that the domestic social net is more important than Europe’s survival and all weapon deliveries must stop. Let’s talk instead.

If policies were up to them, they’d be helping fascism almost as much as outright Putin sheep

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Tartas1995@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
It is so fucking sad that the tolerance “paradox” goes all the way to fucking war.

Like you literally have to fight a war against war seekers if you don’t want war. Like fucking hell, why can’t we at least be chill there?

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AES_Enjoyer@reddthat.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
How is Putin the biggest fascist threat for Europe? Fascism was literally born in Europe and exported elsewhere, we have Nazi and fascist parties getting consistent growth election after election in basically every EU country.

Believe it or not, Europe isn’t at war with Russia, we should be struggling in favour of diplomacy to reduce both our and their military expenditure… which is hard to do when riding hard the NATO wave. Ffs Europe was building gas pipelines with Russia 3.2 years ago, we’re really still capable of separating ourselves from fascist US, reduce military expenditure with fascist Russia, and take care of our own fascist problems.

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- woelkchen@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  
  Europe isn’t at war with Russia
  
  Yes, we are. From election interference to contamination of drinking water at military bases in Germany, incendiary devices placed on DHL planes, and cutting undersea cables.
  
  we should be struggling in favour of diplomacy to reduce both our and their military expenditure…
  
  Completely naive. Diplomacy only works from a position of strength.
  
  Russia invaded Georgia. No military help, only diplomacy: Led nowhere.
  
  Russia’s 2014 invasion of Ukraine: No military help, only diplomacy. Two Minsk Accords Russia used to build up their military and Russia then happily broke.
  
  reduce military expenditure with fascist Russia, and take care of our own fascist problems.
  
  Russia is part of Europe. Russia is waging genocide in Europe. North Korean soldiers are murdering in Europe. Putin is our fascist problem and people appeasing Putin are also a part of the problem.
  
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  - Uebercomplicated@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    I absolutely agree with this, people really seem to not take Putin seriously enough. Putin is already at war with us; he’s literally had people killed in Moabit and invaded Europe. This is not Nato’s fault, it is blatant aggression from Putin, which we need to respond, and should have responded, to accordingly.
    
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  - AES_Enjoyer@reddthat.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    If attacks to civilian infrastructure and election interference are enough to claim war, Germany should be in the first instance at war with the US and Ukraine according to that logic, given the explosion of the Nordstream (much more important and evident than reported drinking water alteration or whatever you claim of DHL planes with incendiary devices). Also, Ukraine should be at war with the US for its interference in the election process in 2014, where the democratically elected leader was toppled in a blatant west-backed coup.
    
    You know what Georgia and Ukraine have in common? They’re in the Russian sphere of influence area and have been for the past century. What’s happening is that the west keeps meddling in the Russian sphere of influence and Russia responds in the only way it can: militarily. Russia exhausted the possibilities of diplomacy with the west, warned repeatedly of the consequences of western-alignment of Ukraine (which, again, was done antidemocratically in 2014). That’s the reason why Russia invaded Ukraine, because its diplomacy, soft power and interference were weaker than those of the west in maintaining a sphere of influence. Believe it or not, history didn’t begin in 2022.
    
    The EU should stop the US-directed meddling in Russia’s sphere of influence, and start building relations with the countries that are actually sharing a continent with it. It’s just too racist and too subservient to US interests to do so.
    
    Putin is our fascist problem and people appeasing Putin are also a part of the problem.
    
    Putin is a fascist and that’s a problem, but he’s not the one pushing to cut our healthcare and education and pensions budgets, he does that in Russia. He’s not the one threatening our minorities and our women, he does that in Russia. Europe is more than capable of having fascism by itself without the help of Putin, and blaming everything on a Russian conspiracy is, well, a conspiracy. Russia isn’t nearly powerful or influential enough to be mostly responsible for the fascist problem in the EU, there are a lot more material conditions thst give raise to that.
    
    Stop fucking cheering for war. Stop your warmongering attitudes, stop presenting Europe as the fighting ground for WW3, you DO NOT WANT to see war in the EU, and it’s absofuckinglutely not too late to go back.
    
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    woelkchen@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    
    Also, Ukraine should be at war with the US for its interference in the election process in 2014, where the democratically elected leader was toppled in a blatant west-backed coup.
    
    And here you are, laying bare that you’re just repeating pro Russian propaganda. Calling the right to protest a coup. Not the occupation of Crimea and Eastern Ukraine is the problem but the people rising up.
    
    He’s not the one threatening our minorities and our women, he does that in Russia.
    
    Yeah, Russia is just there doing some domestic stuff we don’t need to care about. Russia isn’t occupying parts of Ukraine, Moldova, and Georgia. Russia isn’t expanding westwards. Just sit idly by when tens of thousands of non-Russian children get kidnapped, put into reeducation camps, to then fight for Russia. Just sit idly by when Russian agents outright attack German barracks and twiddle your thumbs. Other issues are way more important than caring about that campaign of extermination in Eastern Europe within the borders of an EU-aspirant.
    
    stop presenting Europe as the fighting ground for WW3
    
    Good I didn’t do it. Another Russian propaganda tool is to push back against claims that were never made, acting as if anyone but Russia was the aggressor, trying to move the conversation into Russia’s genocide being just legitimate self-defense.
    
    You’re nothing but a Russian propagandist, whether you’re aware of it or not.
    
    “But wouldn’t a Russian propagandist deny that bad things are happening inside Russia?” the propaganda playbook would make you ask in return, admitting to some criticism but brush it off as a domestic problem far away, trying to cast doubts on your underlying intentions. Russia’s propagandists up the illusion of a broader political landscape. Put the AfD on Germany’s far right, put the BSW on Germany’s far left, put appeasers somewhere in between, and divert attention away from Russia’s attempts at conquering Europe.
    
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