Comment on How will this community survive its Eternal September?

• w0odl@lemmy.radio ⁨1⁩ ⁨month⁩ ago

  I’ve had that thought and we’ve talked about it a bit with respect to upgrades, but honestly, it opens a larger can of worms and trust levels.

  There’s a lot of sensitive information that I’m already by default trusted with and finding someone that, to be honest, I can trust would be a big conversation.

  Also… deploying this ship is not the easiest thing in the world, even as a docker container. Documentation is like the wild west and sometimes, you have to take a best guess or know how docker deploys work or how the instance itself works.

  BUT you are correct. if this is going to be a long lasted instance, having other people on board would help.

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  • vk6flab@lemmy.radio ⁨1⁩ ⁨month⁩ ago

    Ultimately this is about risk mitigation, about what happens if. There are many different ways to tackle this. I have not found a guaranteed solution, but here are some to consider:

    • If we keep the community size small, in other words, restrict the number of people who can join, the impact of this instance going away is limited in scope. It’s not a fun thing to contemplate, but it’s potentially a viable and effective solution.
    • If we “appoint” moderators, there are implications of trust. Even the most trustworthy person you know might make a decision that’s not what you would have chosen. Furthermore, people make mistakes for many different reasons. Making rules around moderation is attractive, but edge-cases will always exist and “don’t be a dick” means different things to different people.
    • The same is true for “appointing” an administrator, for the plumbing of the IT infrastructure, not the content. I have been spending a little time trying to either find or construct a “turn-key” fediverse “node” that can be instigated and run almost autonomously. This would reduce the requirements for human resources, but it would cost money.
    • Creating a “body”, a formal agreement between “founders”, is another way to go. It does not guarantee that your efforts will be a success. Even if you write your constitution to deal with malicious intent mitigation there’s always someone who will take over and shit in the nest.
    • We could leave well enough alone and let it crash when it does, either as a service, or as a community, as-in, it gets overtaken by unwanted content. We could stem the flow for a while, but if that’s ultimately unsuccessful, we could just shut it down.
    • One point worth making separately is the legal aspect of this community. What happens if a member posts, willingly or not, illegal material? What happens if someone attempts to invoke the GDPR on some aspect of the ongoings here? How is that “risk” mitigated?

    Note that I’m not advocating one solution over another. This is more an attempt at identifying ways to mitigate any potential “risk” in whatever shape that arrives.

    I’ll also note that the amateur radio on-air experience is essentially ephemeral in nature. There is nothing wrong with treating this community in the same way. It has a nice symmetry to it if anything.

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    • w0odl@lemmy.radio ⁨1⁩ ⁨month⁩ ago

      Awesome post! Since you made the original post, I’ve actually already started a github wiki to address my concerns about what it would look like going forward. To address them in line:

      • I’ll always want this to be a selective community. But as you said, this may be more than what “I” want and that may need to change in the future.
      • People do make mistakes. I can tell you I have already as a moderator and that’s just how things are.
      • For adding an admin, I have started a github organization that I would want someone to join who had experience in how things work and how to mitigate errors. I can tell you… I’ve brought down the site for an hour or 2 a few times and I hope no one noticed… And with the thought of money, I’m comfortable with where we are now with how much we cost, but going forward, there’s a lot I’d like to add like better backups that I know would add cost to our instance.
      • I think this would always be the case. What we’re almost talking about is treating this like a business where we just put the trust of this instance in people. That’s where the aforementioned backups would help (hopefully)
      • You already have me thinking too much about not letting this fail! I think that what we are discussing isn’t an overnight thing, but maybe over the coming year(s) we could implement.
      • There are already a lot of pull requests and issues on the lemmy github about GDPR, and it seems as though it’s something that is sorta addressed already but is a big deal that will be fully addressed in the future

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      • vk6flab@lemmy.radio ⁨1⁩ ⁨month⁩ ago

        I don’t know how you have implemented this, but on AWS we tend to set up an automatic snapshot every x-hours that expires (gets deleted) after y-days. If worse comes to happen, you resurrect the latest snapshot and you’re up and running. This isn’t a high stakes environment, so small levels of data loss might be acceptable to the community.

        I’d be happy to look at and assist with your GitHub repository. Note that I am unable to make a specific time commitment at this point.

        I did consider making the “business” aspect explicit in my list, but shied away from it, since with that comes “commercialism” and many mistake that within the context of Amateur Radio. For example, I’ve been told by “experts” that my podcast is a commercial enterprise and should be banned from local repeaters because I make an eBook available of the transcripts and in the past I had a “Donate” button on my website - no longer, thanks to the shenanigans by PayPal.

        There is nothing wrong with “failure”. It’s a state, just like “on” or “off”. If it doesn’t do what you want, then you might call that state “failure”, but if it did exactly what you planned, then that might be called “success”, even if from the outside looking in, the two are identical, the instance is no longer responding. In other words, this is a matter of perspective and planning. Which is why we’re having this conversation in the first place :-)

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