Comment on Woke
GuyIncognito@lemmy.ca 1 day agoBecause the explanation is more complex. Things aren’t the way they are for no reason, there’s historical context and theoretical frameworks that allow you to understand how and why the world came to be as it is, and how it is likely to change. If you understand this, then you also know not only that things are not going to be this way forever, you know that the world is changing right now. That we are closer to liberation than you think.
Knowledge is power, and understanding the world also means that you are more able to change it.
Do you really feel like this Iran incursion is somehow significant feeling compared to Iraq or Afghanistan?
The Iran situation is more significant than Iraq or Afghanistan, because Iran is going to win. This is a far worse situation for the United States government than both Iraq and Afghanistan combined, because it is breaking their aura of invincibility. They aren’t being slowly exhausted in a guerilla war, they’re being struck both militarily and economically by a country they haven’t even invaded, and will not be able to invade.
Do you actually think that the hegemonic status of the US really enters into the consideration of most people, to say nothing of having a significant impact on their emotions? Do you think an awareness of that would actually make people feel better?
You’re mixing up what is and what should be. No, most Americans don’t particularly care about the world outside their borders. If people understood that the power of the US government, of Donald Trump and his cronies, was based on American global hegemony - on the empire - and they further understood that that hegemony was crumbling and is indeed at a breaking point, they would understand that there is plenty reason to be hopeful.
Your oppressors, who are also the world’s oppressors, are being defeated! They depend both at home and abroad on the illusion of invincibility and the illusion that nothing will ever change. Those illusions are more broken today than they were yesterday, and were more broken yesterday than the day before. In the coming weeks and months, they will continue to break.
ricecake@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
I think you’re gravely exaggerating the significance of the iran war we currently have. The resources brought to force and the scale of losses are miniscule, and there’s no grounds to even say what “winning” is for either side.
That’s entirely aside from the point though. You’re arguing the a crack in the facade of hegemony is more responsible for emotional distress than a stark reminder that your next door neighbors are horrible bigots. That people should be comforted that people they don’t know will lose power.
Will Trump losing power make my neighbor not think we should hang trans people?
Will a loss of US influence in global affairs cause us to build a social safety net?
Will embarrassing the US military spur a wave of environmental reforms?
The answer is “no”, because why would it?
I think you’re thinking about global politics a lot, and assuming it must be on everyone else’s mind as well.
I don’t think you actually know why people are exhausted and depressed, and you sure as shit don’t know what would improve that.
GuyIncognito@lemmy.ca 22 hours ago
Ok, to start we’re going to have to go over the military situation, because you’re really not informed about it. This dovetails very well with my original point, that people tend to despair due to a lack of knowledge rather than too much.
The US has already verifiably lost billions of dollars worth of equipment - I say verifiably because the media censorship is very heavy. Was the USS Gerry Ford really crippled by a laundry fire? hard to say. But they’ve definitely lost a bunch of very expensive radars, including an E-3 Sentry AWACS aircraft, representing 1/16 of the entire fleet. These planes are a very high value target, and they are literally irreplaceable due to being out of production and having their successor cancelled. This is the first time the US has ever lost an AWACS to hostile fire. They’ve also lost a lot of tanker aircraft, which are also irreplaceable (though available in larger numbers), and which are vital to America’s ability to hit Iran.
Iran is striking US assets in the region effectively and at will. Once again, this is the first time this has happened - post WW2, no US enemy has every been able to hit the US military, consistently, before an invasion has even been attempted. Conversely, the US’s ability to hit Iran is continually degrading because they’re exhausting their stocks of standoff weaponry, which are very expensive and low production. Without standoff weapons (long range cruise missiles), US and Isreli aircraft have to fly deeper into Iran, exposing them to anti-aircraft fire.
But this is all beside the main point. The crux of this war is the strait of Hormuz and its position as a chokepoint for a large proportion of the world’s oil and natural gas. Iran has a knife to the throat of the global economy, and even more importantly, the petrodollar. The petrodollar is a cornerstone of US hegemony because it does most of the work in maintaining the dollar as the world’s reserve currency. As long as Iran is able to keep the strait closed to US aligned shipping, they’ve won, and it doesn’t look like the US has much chance of opening the strait up.
Now for the other particulars:
You’re misinterpreting my argument. I didn’t say that America losing is the cause for emotional distress, I said that it should be the cause of great hope, but liberals who don’t understand imperialism just have a nihilistic and despairing outlook due to this lack of understanding. Yes, your neighbours are nazi bigots, but they’re also losing.
The answer to all of those is “hopefully yes”. The bigotry of your neighbours is not some intractable inherent evil, it’s been instilled in them by a propaganda machine that uses social issues to keep the public divided and unable to unite in their shared interests, such as, as you mentioned, a social safety net. As American power degrades, so will the efficacy of its propaganda.
Regarding the environmental issue, the answer is a full-throated “yes!” The massive decline in the availability of fossil fuels caused by the closure of the strait is accelerating the green transition.
Once aghain, you’re feeding into my main point. No, American liberals do not think about geopolitics, you think about American politics, and American politics are fucking dire. I am not disagreeing with you in any way on that. Your country is filled with vile Nazis, you live in an economic pressure cooker where a run of bad luck could lead you to becoming homeless, and any kind of change seems remote and unlikely. These things are all true.
What I’m trying to get across is that the US government’s power is premised on being the global hegemon, and that hegemony being under attack also means the state’s power is under attack. In 1905, when Russia humiliatingly lost a war against Japan (a non-European power, so this came as a huge shock), the result was a wave of strikes, revolts, and mutinies that resulted in a revolution - the end of Tsarist autocracy, the establishment of a constitutional monarchy, and a broad democratization. There is plenty of precedent for a humiliating defeat being the catalyst for change.
In any case, you’re still taking a very American-centric view. Ok, suppose that the loss of global hegemony doesn’t result in anything getting better for Americans. So? There’s an entire world out there with billions of people, as opposed to your country of 350 million. If Americans can’t use this opportunity to better their lot, the world still gets the imperial boot off its neck.
ricecake@sh.itjust.works 19 hours ago
I feel like this is the crux of the pointlessness of trying to communicate to you in a nutshell. Of course I’m taking an America-centric view. We’re in a thread about woke Americans being depressed. That’s called being “on-topic”. Arguing that Americans should be happy their lives, and the lives of everyone around them, are getting worse because it means that some people somewhere else have lives that will stop getting worse is going to get an academic nod of catharsis, at best. I’m seriously questioning if you’ve ever actually talked to or met people before.
Ah, I see you actually haven’t talked to people.
Nightmarish bigotry of all sorts has existed far, far longer than anyone could plausibly argue that it’s because of American hegemonic propaganda.
By “broad democratization” do you mean… The Soviet Union? I would hardly use the early to mid 1900s Russia to be a good example of things getting better after a loss.
As for your war analysis, I don’t actually care. I only responded to it because I think you’re giving it undue weight. “Bombed so heavily they must surely be running low on bombs by now” is not the sign of imminent defeat you seem to think it is.
GuyIncognito@lemmy.ca 19 hours ago
The Bolshevik revolution was in 1917, I’m referring to the 1905 revolution. But I guess if you want to be ignorant about the present world, why wouldn’t you be ignorant about history too?
Once again, you’re being stupid. I was talking about precision standoff munitions - expensive guided missiles which are available only in small numbers. But it’s pointless to explain that to you, because you’re a mopey incurious sadsack. Why bother caring about things if you think it’s completely pointless and hopeless? Just be like every other american pig and only care about yourself. This is what I was talking about the entire time - nihilism. “Nothing’s ever going to get better and I will actively ignore any evidence to the contrary!” Ok, well thankfully nothing is depending on you or any other American, and thank God for that. You yankee pigs can rot in your shithole, the world will move on without you.