Comment on ICE Supreme Commander spotted in Minneapolis
Airowird@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 days agoAlledged rapist. And the original accuser firmly said he never touched her, even though the media/tabloids happily claimed so.
It’s possible some enablers around him like Makeeva or Letz would spike woman so they’ld sleep with Till (would match him getting angry when Lynn refuses to do so) but that doesn’t mean he himself was aware of it. Makeeva was fired shortly after the allegations.
Authorities both in Germany & Vilnius investigated and found no evidence to continue on.
Doesn’t mean he’s not a weirdo with an unhealthy interest in sex, but decadence isn’t “if you’re famous they let you do it”.
I’m certain that Lynn was drugged (random bruising is an indicator), but I’m uncertain it was Till, and until there is stronger evidence than now-retracted tabloid articles, I would consider him innocent until proven otherwise.
It’s possible some enablers around him like Makeeva or Letz would spike woman so they’ld sleep with Till … but that doesn’t mean he himself was aware of it.
Are you saying that it’s ok to have sex with someone if they’re drugged, inebriated, or otherwise impaired, as long as you aren’t “aware” that they’re drugged, inebriated, or otherwise impaired?
By you saying “aware” I’m assuming you’re insinuating “Wir habben das nicht gewusst” ?
No, I’m not ok with pretending not to know someone can’t consent.
But I’ll Devil’s Advocate this one: There was alcohol & drugs present and being used consensually. I’m going to assume Lindemann did so as well. If at some point someone looks inebriated, are you gonna think it was involuntary? If two people go to a bar, meet eachother and agree have sex, is that abuse? And what if they both willingly got drunk first?
Imho, the key factor is intent, trying to make somebody do something against their (sober) will is always wrong. Spiking someone’s drink is coercion, because you force them into another state of mind without their consent. But if a stranger at a party at a bar acts drunk, would you immediately think they got drugged? Or does one’s informed consent to get inebriated also include the common consequences? And would you think differently if that person was drunk at a work party vs a dive bar?
I don’t know enough specifics to be certain what happened either way, but as someone who has willingly opted to get inebriated in the past, I always considered the consequences as part of that choice. (As long as the inebriation occurred voluntary) I’m aware that some people may see that as a “blaming the victim” argument, but I do draw the line at knowingly abusing someone’s state of mind vs both parties being inebriated and trying to have fun.
The main logical discrepancy I see is Lynn’s account of Lindemann running off angry. If he was a serial rapist, he probably wouldn’t do that, he’ld coax her into having more of her spiked drink until she was too inebriated to say no. I think Makeeva got those women just high enough to agree to try some (more) drugs to get them going, to make her look like she knew how to pick the party animals.
But that’s just my opinion based on the evidence I’ve seen. YMMV
This situation isn’t comparable to consenting adults meeting at a bar. Providing drugs and alcohol to “entice” women into having sex is predatory behavior, whether or not the women partake consensually or not. Play devil’s advocate is you want, but I don’t think that behavior deserves defending/rationalizing/whatever you want to call it.
Providing drugs and alcohol to “entice” women into having sex is predatory behavior, whether or not the women partake consensually or not.
So you’ve never asked a romantic interest or Tinder date to have drinks? Because the moment you pay the bill, how is what you’re doing any different?
Aequitas@feddit.org 2 days ago
Yes, and that’s why he posted a photo with Boateng, another male perpetrator of violence against women, to portray himself as a poor victim of media coverage.
The man created a system in which young women were specifically targeted (affectionately referred to as the “slut parade” by the band and staff), taken to an isolated room with others, where their cell phones were taken away, where drugs were available, and where they had to ask security guards to let them out.
There are also anonymous reports from people who contacted journalists but, at the latest after Linnemann’s major legal offensive against other victims, no longer dared to file official charges or even venture into the public eye in any way. Others have backtracked because German law requires such things to be proven beyond a doubt, otherwise you make yourself liable to prosecution. However, this is almost impossible, especially in sexual criminal law. Lindemann’s lawyers would have done anything to destroy these people.
Another reason, of course, is the countless people who want to defend their idol at all costs. They are just as depraved as all the Trump fans who still cover for him despite all the reports of rape. Disgusting.
I don’t need a court ruling to form an opinion. German law is a joke in this area anyway. Even what is known for certain is enough for me to identify him as a disgusting person. And I am very sure that we don’t know everything. Stop defending him. Stop protecting perpetrators.
Airowird@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 days ago
I’m not fanatically defending or accusing anyone based on my feelings, I’m trying to be objective and rational.
This mob mentality “everyone not agreeing with my view is disgusting and a fanatic idoliser” argument isn’t helping your case.
Arguably, you don’t want camera phones near an artist doing illegal drugs. You don’t need to be a rapist to find that logical.
That said, I don’t tend to follow “celebrity news” and definitely not German football, so I wasn’t aware of his friendship with Boateng (up to 10min ago). Having read the cliff notes, his choice in friends does say something about Lindemann’s character.
I hope you are wrong simply because that means those women weren’t violated. But honestly, the firing of Makeeva sadly indicates she did spike those women to provide to Lindemann’s parties. How much he was involved, I don’t know. It wouldn’t be the first time an entourage does shitty things to keep the golden-egg-laying artist happy without their knowledge. That’s unfortunately too common to exclude it at this point, although I wouldn’t advice anyone to rely on it being the case.
But if you wonna convince people he’s a rapist, maybe try presenting evidence first, rather than just ordering people what to do. People tend to be more accepting of a conclusion they made themselves.
zalgotext@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
This is unhinged lmao. If you don’t want people to take pictures/videos of you doing illegal drugs backstage, there are at least two way more logical options that also have the benefit of not violating a person’s rights:
Airowird@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 days ago
I think it was more about inviting them to do drugs with him than to watch, and you wouldn’t want any selfies of that going on instagram.
Yes, obviously doing drugs around strangers is a bad idea. But if you truly insist on inviting strangers to do drugs with you, asking them to not bring any cameras in the room seems like a good move PR-wise.
MyCatIsDumb@lemmy.world 2 days ago
At least it’s now a good indicator of what kind of man you’re dealing with. Just ask him what he thinks of Till Lindemann.